The main issue I have is, if they are not on his land, how can he prove that they are illegal? Yea, running thru the desert with trash-bag luggage is a funny way to go for a hike. What I’m not so hip on is some A-hole trying to figure out my legal status and pulling a gun. I am going to be highly annoyed.
If your land is being assaulted, I’m going to be on the side of caution and fire up the back hoe.
Though this article apparently leaves it out, IIRC in this case they were using his ranch, i.e.- his property (larger than just a few hundred sq. ft.) to cross from Mexico to Arizona when he confronted them. So basically they were on his property. If one talks to ranchers in Arizona and Texas they can hear literally dozens of stories like this. Illegals crossing over on their land, leaving trash, and fecal matter all over the place.
Also, in Arizona we do not have a “retreat” clause.
If YOU were the US Feds, and you were making over a $Billion each year form Illegals using some one else’s Soc Security number, and you NEVER had to pay them back for ANY of it, would you want the stopping of those Illegals into this country? Now you know why these fed agencies do not want to stop the flow at all, so don’t get in their Fing way of making more money, or your ass will get sued and they can make even more $!!!
BTW: Those people know damn good and well they are here illegally, or they fing wouldn’t be SNEAKING over the border!!!
WTF gives them the right to do things illegally, BUT NOT ME???
Whatever.
I know I am not part of the “I live on the border” culture so I am sure that I am missing a few things. I also can empathize with the type-in-all-caps-and-bold-font we’re not gonna take it anymore crowd. But I just don’t point a weapon at someone lightly.
What was this guy going to do - kill all of them? The article said that he detained them at gunpoint. Anyway, there’s a reason the guy is going on trial - we’ll find out how that goes. I suspect I would go on trial too if I went out onto “my property” and detained people at gunpoint - illegals or no illegals.
You’ll need to go back and show me where I truly proposed this.
:rolleyes:
Does it matter if they were illegal?
Let’s say that they were 16 regular old teenage Americans cutting through his property. Does he get to hold them at gun point? What if they want to leave? Does he get to shoot them in the back?
When emotions run high (I ain’t gonna take it no more!) it’s probably best to leave the firearms locked up.
Of course we don’t know the whole story, but crapping on someone’s lawn is not a justifiction for pointing a weapon at them and holding them against their will. That can be considered - and apparently has been in this case - aggravated assault and false imprisonment, among others.
Is it right? No. But it is what it is.
“hold at gunpoint” should be read “citizens’ arrest.” and no, if he’s placed 16 teenagers under arrest for trespassing, they are not allowed to leave whether they want to or not.
we’re missing way too much of the story to come to conclusions… which is evident by the wacky directions we’re all taking this.
This attitude is why we will never secure the border. Since you are not a “Cowboy” and can’t relate, I would like to know what you would do if your 16 teenagers came up to your house camped out on your lawn and refused to leave or maybe they are just sitting around your car in your driveway. Remember you have no police to call because the Sheriff’s office forwards all of the immigration calls to the Feds so you have to wait for the Border Patrol. If I am confronting 16 people (aka, trespassers) on my property that refuse to leave I would feel threatened and have a firearm with me.
It is a shame that the homeowner who IS at US citizen and probably has no criminal record is considered the bad guy by people on this forum for doing what he thinks is right. David
You’re right - I’m what’s wrong with America. I’ve been told that by the open carry advocates as well.
I don’t want anyone to think I’m advocating anything, but this is only going to make more people shoot, shovel, and shut up.
Sad, sad situation.
I also got told that by a mob on TOS once when I criticized a guy who was bragging about running outside and holding a guy at gunpoint because he caught him walking on his lawn.
It turns out he worked for the telephone company - but he was “on his property” so he needed to confront him at gunpoint, apparently.
As some have pointed out, we don’t yet know enough about this case. However I have no problem thinking for myself and not automatically being a cheerleader for the guy with the gun.
I agree up to a point; however, when you’re the one outnumbered and having to confront the trespassers, your mindset is a whole lot different. And when the trespassers are armed it’s a whole new ball game.
I recently had to run some hunters off. They were just teens or college kids with Fudd rifles out hunting rabbits. The problem is, they were shooting in my direction and in the direction of the house. I could hear rounds whizzing by me and impacting near my feet. I was not about to confront them without being armed. I chambered a round in my AK, but did not point it at them. I politely asked them not to shoot in my direction or in the direction of the house. As they were not on my property, I didn’t try to run them off.
Now, had the situation been different and one of them had lifted his weapon to threaten me, I would have left them both lying in the dust.
I also wonder if they would have been as compliant had I not been armed?
You are not what is wrong with America. You are from PA and I’m from VA and we have no idea what this homeowner is going through living on the border. I can only imagine he is at his wits end with trespassers destroying his property. I just think we should give the gun owner and not the illegals the benifit of the doubt in this situation. David
What did they call you in the Utah mall “Would you go back in?” thread? 
To ME, this sometimes reads that there are those who seem to think it is OK for our Country to be invaded by those who wish to not obey our policies. Such as coming here the legal way. Were/are these people only defending there property? Or are they trying to also defend their/your Country, which also is THEIR property? Without living in those border towns and seeing what all is going on, we from afar don’t really have a clue, do we.
Should we just eliminate the Mexico border? Or should we defend it against Illegal Intruders? After all what goes on on the East Coast, doesn’t effect me here in Montana, so should I tell everyone on the East Coast that they are wrong in the way they handle things there? When I don’t know their circumstances?
Not sure why everyone is getting defensive and angry over this. Telling Katar that he is what is wrong with America is the only out of line thing I’ve seen.
Relax dummies. 
I live in Colorado in a city which is about 67% Hispanic. Of that 67%, approximately 22% are illegally in this country. I don’t live on the border but I do frequently talk with those who have tried to keep out illegals and those that ARE illegals.
What many non-border dwelling types don’t understand is not just the influx of “peaceful” illegals, but the swelling tide of vicious drug-smuggling cartels which frequently have the Mexican government out-gunned and absolutely have our border guards out-gunned. Frequently there are armed mercenary escorts into our country of the coyotes who are not just bringing people, but drugs as well. The folks living on the border are in very real fear for their lives from these types who don’t hesitate to shoot first.
Now I’m not suggesting this group of individuals was in any way associated with drug smuggling. What I am suggesting is that this rancher was probably a little hyper-vigilant because of it and may have over-reacted.
Our society is so regional that often while we may have some idea what goes on in other areas of the country, we usually don’t have a full grasp of the goings-on in the daily life of those from other areas. I liken this to the urban gun-haters absolute inability to understand why anyone would possibly need to own a gun. Truly if they’ve never had any exposure to them then why would anyone else need or want to use them?
I only postulate this as a reason for what seems like extreme over-reacting in this rancher’s case. Until you’ve walked a mile in his shoes…
BTW, for those who really have no experience with what is really taking place on our southern border may I suggest viewing the documentary “Border” for a little insight. http://www.bordermovie.com/
don’t put yourself in that group .you just have a different opinion of what you would do in that situation .If i lived on the border I would have a Phone number for the Border patrol .and ask them what would be the SOP for this type of situation so I would not ended up Like this guy.
It might be interesting to look at the court records .
There’s an old case and a new case. I agree that there is something very wrong with illegal aliens having a right to interstate travel. This case is just getting started.
The false imprisonment case might shed some light on situation. Maybe Mr. Barnett is getting screwed twice.
Maybe there’s some lessons on how to prevail and stay out of jail ( and not lose a lawsuit) along the border.
ETA:
I think that what I’m driving here is that there’s these two cases and there’s the symbol. There’s a huge problem on the border , no doubt . One question is what can people do without getting nailed for “…nearly $100,000…”
Can you actually hold someone at gun point for tresspass (posted, non-posted?)? In the house in one thing, at the other extreme is unposted land. Down south near the border with drug gangs and MexMil, things are a bit different, I understand.