[i] Feb. 3, 2009 09:24 AM
Associated Press
TUCSON - The trial is now under way in a civil-rights lawsuit against a southern Arizona rancher accused of holding a group of illegal immigrants at gunpoint near Douglas.
Attorneys for the 16 people who were trying to cross into the U.S. illegally accuse Roger Barnett of holding a gun on the group, threatening them with his dog and also threatening to shoot anyone who tried to escape, according to a news release from the Mexican American Legal Defense and Educational Fund.
The group also said Barnett kicked one of the women in the group when she was on the ground.
The federal lawsuit charges Barnett, his wife, Barbara Barnett, and his brother, Donald Barnett, with conspiring to violate the plaintiffs’ civil rights, according to the release.
U.S. District Court Judge John Roll in March rejected Barnett’s efforts to have the charges thrown out, ruling that sufficient evidence of a conspiracy existed, that the Barnetts denied the immigrants’ right to interstate travel and that the actions of the three were motivated by race.
Barnett’s attorney, David Hardy, had argued that illegal immigrants didn’t have the same rights of interstate travel as U.S. citizens do.
Roll’s ruling came on the heels of another judgment against Barnett in February 2008.
At that time, the Arizona Court of Appeals refused to throw out a jury verdict from November 2006 - and a nearly $100,000 monetary award - against Barnett in another civil case where a jury concluded he falsely imprisoned members of a Douglas family.
The current trial is scheduled to go through Feb. 13.[/i]
dead people cant sue !!!
lawyer told me that saying
this kinda stuff boils my blood big time that this guy can be in trouble for having criminals trespass on his property then he gets in trouble for it is INSANE !!!
and they are not even US criminals but Mexican criminals !!!
lawyers and people that stick up for this BS make me sick
I have no problem if you want to come in legally thats fine welcome to the country just obey the law
we really need to make it so anyone who is not from this country can not sue anyone in this country
and if you are a criminal then you loose all rights to sue anyone who you did a crime against even if you are from this country
so does this boil the blood of others ?
in some sick way I hope the US falls under control of some fanatical dictator and cleans out these looser lawyer and bleeding types who slam this country
then he is thrown just want him in long enough to flush the sewers of all those that want to harm/slam this country from within !!!
Illegal or not if they were on his property he has the right to detain them. This is proof that we need more action from citizins to not take this anymore.
…isn’t there some kind of rule against entering the US illegally?
I mean, seems like it’d be ok to hold a criminal until LEO or ICE could get there…
I’m obviously thinking of something else…civil rights trumps this somehow…
If the above is indeed true, where did this guy get off holding these people at gunpoint? Was he fearful of a potentially lethal threat? Why else would an average citizen point a firearm at someone? Why didn’t he call the authorities? Were these illegals threatening his family or other citizens with lethal intent?
I don’t like illegal immigration either, but I am not about to go out and point a weapon at illegal aliens - unless they are a potentially lethal threat that I can’t safely retreat from.
Living in a rural ranch where the nearest bit of help is likely 20+ minutes away, hearing a noise, and seeing enough people to constitute a mob, you wouldn’t bring a gun to investigate?
Upon seeing such a disparity of force engaged in illegal activity, you wouldn’t feel compelled to detain them at gunpoint until help could arrive?
…I guess I thought he was on his own place the whole time…If he went hunting I could see the difference…On his own land…It’d be crazy not to investigate…
In general, so do I…but in a situation where your property is literally being overrun by illegals the calculus might change somewhat.
In any case, the appropriate action would be to charge him with a crime for pointing a gun at people who didn’t need a gun pointed at them. A federal lawsuit based on civil rights violations, on the other hand, is 9 kinds of screwed up.
from everything I have heard and talked to a few ranchers and seen plenty pics of border crossing areas
illegals in general are pigs !!! they liter and crap on your property and cut fences and dont care about your property
so I would say if 16 people came to your property and broke your fences and craped on your lawn and threw their garbage on your lawn and they did this time and time again when you tell them to leave and they say screw you time and time again
so after a few years of tons of people crapping and leaving the garbage on your lawn breaking your property when would enough be enough
also all ranchers are armed against 2 and 4 legged critters
I have to say those who think this is not the thing to do ?
if someone did the above on your property would you never say enough is enough and hold them till authorities come !!!
from what I remember reading
he held them from what I remember till authorities came as he called the authorities when he spotted them but knew it would take some time
I’m not digging up the details of it. But playing devils advocate, in the middle of the South Arizona desert where exactly are you going to avoid TO? 16 bedraggled miscreants come out to your place in the middle of no where looking for god knows what. Best case scenario food and water, worst case; money, guns, vehicles. Best case scenario it’s just folks looking to make a better life, worse case it’s some MS13 turds. Are you truly proposing inviting them in for tea to figure out which of these scenarios they’re from? :eek: Next you have to debate whether you’re gonna go out looking for them. It isn’t something I think is a good idea, but letting them get up to my doorway is a MUCH worse idea IMHO. Frankly I’d get tired of continually trying to intercept, I’d set up some damn remote cameras so I could call BP long before they reached my home. Maybe invest in some bilingual minefield signs. ;p
I’m with you up to here. If you retreat, when you have the option to repel with force, a potentially lethal threat… it is my opinion that you are just leaving that threat to move onto the next guy/girl/child/family etc. I dunno, dealing with the bold part only, I would attempt to handle it so know one else had to… if I could of course. Don’t think that makes me a cowboy…
On to the topic: Citizens in my state are permitted to resist, intervene, and stop forceful felonies. If the people were just walking across the border NOT on his land and were staying clear of him… for him to run out in front of them with a gun is plain retarded. However, I personally feel that if you aren’t a citizen OR have permission to be here such as a visitor/work visa etc, you are here at your own risk. But that’s a personal conviction. Let a rancher shoot a few of them, without persecution, and watch the frequency of people decline in that particular area… just saying.
If they were coming on to his land, he stood on his land front of them and told them to stop advancing, and they didn’t… well… they are making an overt hostile action at that point. How is the rancher to know they won’t harm him or his family? Going to a weapon?.. eh, i dunno. I’m of the opinion you don’t want a weighted piece of metal in your hand if you can’t legally use it. We have guys draw their weapon for everything even when they aren’t even NEAR the force matrix for shooting someone. Just ties up their hands and makes them more vulnerable. IMO at least.
Keeping human life values in mind, I’m not for shooting a family of whatever just because they are crossing the border, but… we as LE need to be freed up to defend the tax paying public with these sort of matters. ALSO!!! the court system needs to be pursuing this more aggressively. As it stands, in my area, we turn over the case to the local immigration branch when the offender is released from jail. It is up to them to follow up… yeah fucking right. We arrest the same illegals over and over and over and over. Each time their crimes progressing violently.
eh, my opinions on the matter aren’t polished and I’m open to the idea that I’m misinformed on somethings, but I for one and damn tired of it. The current system isn’t working. I’m open to new ideas…
