Guys, I’ve been trying to focus on developing my pistol skills as this
is most likely what I would be using for defense. The only formal training
I’ve had thus far is a Magpul Dynamics Handgun 1 course February of
last year. I learned alot from that class, but need more training, alot more.
I’ve done alot of reading on the errornet and M4 carbine.
Problem is alot of instructors/trainers/etc seem to differ even on some of
the fundementals. I read through the “Trigger Control” thread started by
Sproggy several weeks ago , took notes from several folks that posted
in that thread (Todd G and JW777 especially) and headed out to the range
after lots of dryfire and found myself shooting MUCH better, to the point
that I extended beyond my usual distances (past 40ft).
The above is G19 with NY1,3.5lb conn, factory night sights @ 45ft.
One problem that still bugs me is when I miss, for the most part I’m
missing to the left. I have 2 Glock 19’s and 2 XD45C’s, it doesn’t what
weapon I use the results are about the same. I will punch out the center
and that hole will slowly expand to the left the more I shoot.
I’ve tried to soak up as much info as I can from various sources, its
seems my problem is either too little or too much finger on the trigger according
to these sources, I don’t understand how it could be both:confused: .
Some top shooters insist on 1st distal joint, others (Magpul, etc,) middle
of pad, still others tip.
I’m curious where you folks are placing your finger in relation to the trigger
and what results you’re getting, lessons learned, experiences, etc.
Doesn’t matter unless you are pulling or pushing your shots.
If you’re a right handed shooter, and the shots are moving to the left, it sounds like you are using too much finger and should try to use the tip of your finger. See if that helps. Your off hand can also influence whether shots are pushed or pulled.
BTW, the amount of finger and the way the trigger is pulled, is different for handgun, rifle, and shotgun. For shotgun, I am talking about a bird hunting or moving clay target situation.
BTW, has anyone noticed the shooter’s trigger finger when watching those military sniper shows on the Military Channel? It looks like they are using the SECOND finger joint!
I would bet money your problem is described below:
Another problem directly connected to trigger reach issues is deflecting shots laterally by placing pressure on one side of the pistol frame while moving the trigger finger to the rear to fire the gun. This is a common issue among Glock shooters, who if right handed shoot to the left whenever they speed up. Of course, if left handed, they shoot to the right. The problem is what we at Rangemaster call the “trigger finger bicep”.
Try this: make a fist with your right hand and draw your forearm up to flex your bicep. As the forearm moves up, your bicep bulges atop your upper arm. Now, look at your trigger finger. Move it as if pressing a trigger. You will notice that the first joint, the part that joins to your palm, is bulging up, just like your bicep. The Glock, and many other polymer framed pistols, have a distinct corner behind the trigger guard, since the grip frame is rectangular in cross section, and considerably wider than the trigger guard. If your finger is in contact with that corner on the frame, as you press the trigger to the rear the “finger bicep” bulges, pushing against the frame, moving the gun laterally. Actually, the only place one’s trigger finger should touch the pistol is on the face of the trigger. If we wanted it to touch the frame, we’d call it the frame finger.
That is from an article I wrote on the issue. Try it and see if that doesn’t fix the problem.
I always use the tip of my finger. I find its the only way I don’t pull to the left, especially with glocks. A few of the guys in my department were having the same issues and after I explained to them how I shoot they no longer have the issue.
In my case, I have small hands and a short index finger. A grip reduction helps me greatly, allowing me to use the pad of the trigger finger without pushing the frame. I also relieve the area right behind the trigger, for the same reason.
If one can’t reach the trigger without touching the frame, AND he has the choice, I would suggest choosing a handgun that fits the hand better. Some can pick their own handgun, some are issued, I understand that. I said, IF he can choose. Many people pick a handgun that doesn’t fit them because someone told them only serious people use XYZ brand guns.
If stuck with an issued gun, and a grip reduction is not allowed, the best you can do is shift the hand position a bit. You need to be able to reliably depress the trigger safety on the Glock. Start by placing just enough trigger finger on the trigger to do that, then wrap the rest of the hand around the butt. That would be that person’s proper master hand grip.
Make sure you aren’t tightening the other fingers of the shooting hand as you squeeze the trigger.
More important than what part of the pad/joint you place on the trigger is finding a spot that allows you to press the trigger fully to the rear without causing the muzzle to move left or right.
This is something that is fairly unique to each shooter based on size of the hand/fingers and shape of the guns grip.
Yup, the low-left disease is quite common. I have worked out a two-fold solution: a) more grip with the support hand, and b) using the pad of my finger against the trigger, the lower edge of my finger actually rubs along the inside of the trigger guard. I try to think “tip-on-tip” - tip of my finger against the tip of the trigger. It’s a leverage thing.
FWIW, I use the tip-on-tip thing at longer distances and/or precision shots. When closer in and trying to get out of the holster and on the target quick-quick, I am not particularly aware of how I am interacting with the trigger.
I would say use the pad of your finger if you can. You probably can unless you have really small hands. I have really small hands and can use the pad of my finger to shoot an unmodified Glock.
That said, a double action revolver, DAO pistol, or traditional DA/SA in DA mode might require you to get more finger on the trigger, possibly up to the first joint. A nice, smooth surface trigger helps you finger slide across - this is not the time for serrations on the trigger.
In my experience, when a shooter (Glock shooter in particular) is getting lateral stringing, the first non-diagnostic fix is to put less finger through the trigger guard. I’ve watched this instantaneously fix dozens and dozens of “problem” shooters. Of course, reaching a point where you are habitually placing your finger in the new position takes time.
The closer towards your finger tip, the more fine control you’ll have but the heavier the trigger pull will feel. Most people need more control than more comfort, so closer to the tip is usually a better option.
Thanks for all the input guys. Looks like time to
experiment a little , first with the finger tip and work my way back,
see what works to minimize/eliminate this tendency.
Todd G sure wish you would come down to central/south florida
sometime .
Mark, we get it, you don’t like M&P pistols. This is the second post I have seen from you making a criticism of the pistol though the input has no bearing on the skill being discussed. There is no problem with making critical observations, but let’s keep the threads on topic instead of booby-trapping them.
I now return you to your regularly scheduled program.
.