Since I can’t find SBR anything just about in the flavor I would like, my attention has turn to SPR. Role of this rifle would to be able to send multpile rounds down range (if I do my part) and hit 2-4 inch at 400-500 yards. Is this asking to much? All I would need is the upper as I have a stripped lower already. When my Tax Stamp come back I’ll just throw the SBR together then (I hope stock for sbr’s come up by then). Any one suggest a optic as well? Been looking at Vortex’s and Sightron’s.
My looking at what is out there. I know I’ll be shooting 62 grain at the very least but more so 77 grain. Give this grain I though 1/7 twist would be perferred over a 1/8. 1/8 is all I’m finding for a 18 inch barrels, 20 inch has cross my mind but I don’t see the pros in the addition two inches.
I’m far from the expert on this board, but are you shooting M855 (you say 62 grain)? If so, you’re going to have a hard time hitting that small a group at that distance, since it’s typically assumed to be around 3-5 MOA ammo (ie, 400 yards, 12-15 inch groups)
1/8 seems to be acceptable for that weight, based on what I’ve read.
Have you used the search button? There are a TON of threads on here that will give you all opinions, facts, variations etc.
With that said. A 1/8 is more popular than 1/7 now because it is “better” for the most range in bullet weights. It will shoot varmint loads like ~40 grains up to single load 80gr SMK. The most optimal for you range is 69gr SMK and 77SMK if you want to stretch it a little further with less wind effecting it. There are 3 memebers here that are testing the 80SMK with great results, except you can magazine feed them. FGMM 77 or 69 and Hornady TAP .223 75gr, and BHA 77grSMK are probably the best you will see from factory ammo, otherwise Handloads will be your key.
If you are wanting an SPR, steer away from 62gr M855/55 gr XM193-not an accurate round.
SS is probably your best bet for a barrel for the accuracy you are looking for.
WOA and Wilson and possibly Ranier Match? offer 1/7 twist SPR profile SS match barrels with my nod to the WOA (White Oak Armament)
The consensus here though is it is pretty dang tough to beat the BCM SS 18" 1/8 barrel. Do a search on here for the results with BCM barrels.
I would choose Vortex PST line between the two you mentioned.
Depending on your price range and weight/size you are wanting, Also take a look at Bushnell DMR/HDMR, Leupold Mark6 3-18, Nightforce 2.5-10, USO 1.8-10/3.7-17 scopes, But for the money, it is going to be hard to beat the Vortex PST line.
I have an SPR knock off upper built around a WOA 18" 1/7 barrel. I am MOA capable with FGMM77 or even the Hornady 75 Steel Match or training ammo. I am 100% certain that operator head gap is the biggest issue this gun has. Not sure of you’ll get to a 2" group at 500, but hey it’s worth a try.
Mine has an 18" WOA SPR barrel in 1:7 and rifle length gas system, and a Geiseele SSA-E. I topped it off with a Vortex 6.5-20x50 (30mm tube). It is sub MOA with factory ammo. I have no problem hitting prairie dog targets @ 500yrds even with 55gr PMC Bronze. It likes 69 or 77gr better, but it shoots 55’s just fine.
This is with Blackhills 77gr. I had less than 100 rounds through the gun at this point. I know… It’s not 10 rounds…:eek:
Thanks guys for the input. I’ve been out if for a while and now just getting my feet wet. I feel like I have to learn everything I knew over again. I saw BCM 18" mk12 uppers. Why go for ss barrel vs standard material? I may just build the upper (more enjoyment) to be honest.
consider that you haven’t really said whether you want an SPR or a target rifle. your OP indicates a fairly casual interest & goal (nothing wrong there) but the two are entirely different things, really, and the pricing varies accordingly.
As foolish as this sounds I honestly don’t know the difference. Purpose would be to use for training and to hit targets that I can’t with red dot on my 16" ar. To give a little more “reach out and touch somebody”. I try not to have more than two of the same role of rifles. Each rifle has a purpose. SBR for home/truck defense, 16" for training range duty, SPR for longer ranges mostly prone, Bolt gun for even farther shooting.
Have you looked into the intermediate gas 18" barrels? It’s in between rifle and midlength gas and from my understanding, Noveske and Rainier are the only ones doing this.The Noveske barrel is 1/7 and Rainier is 1/8 so you can take your pick on the barrel twist. I have put in a lot of time researching Rifle vs. Intermediate gas and have found that it is more reliable than rifle length, but still soft shooting and accurate.
Remember, the barrel is the heart of the rifle and the area you should not skimp on.
From Noveske: “Since the development of the 18” SPR barrel, there has not been a proper gas port placement to work with the desirable barrel length. Now there is a perfect combination, introducing the “Intermediate Length” gas system. Developed by Vltor Weapon Systems, and perfected by Noveske Rifleworks, the intermediate length gas system offers the ideal gas port placement, providing maximum accuracy and reliability. Overall, the intermediate length gas system (1.5" shorter then a rifle length) was developed from feedback from end users and industry professionals. Accuracy and reliability are the best characteristics of the intermediate length gas system."
depending on what barrel & trigger you have in your 16 you might be pleasantly surprised at what you can reach out and touch just by installing a decent scope in a good qd mount and using match ammo.
since you’ll have to do that regardless which route you choose, i suggest that as a first step.
throw in a qd mount for your red dot, you’ve got an easily convertible system.
if you don’t have a decent scope yet, get started here:
Super Sniper 10x42 Tactical Riflescope P53712
or
Bushnell Elite 3200 Tactical Rifle Scope 10x40mm
triggers: ALG ACT, RRA 2-s, LMT 2-s, and so on up the scale. don’t know where your 16 is at now…
that will keep you around $500 and get you well on your way once you start with match ammo.
but if you’ve just got the itch for another upper (and who doesn’t?), the first thing you need to decide is if you want an SPR clone or if you just want an accurate AR.
the closer you want to be to an SPR, the more money it’s going to cost by far. and a giant portion of that money has way more to do with storied history and “The Look” than pure accuracy.
again, if you just want an accurate upper for mid-range target practice, get something like an RRA predator/varmint/national match. around $800 and RRA states .75 MOA capable.
if you want an SPR-class battle rifle, go with centurion arms or mstn or pri, depending on your preferred variant. and be prepared to double the cost of an RRA.
also consider larue tactical’s predatAR or stealth uppers. not SPR’s per se, but very accurate, high-quality AR’s.
I have a WOA barreled mod 0 clone that shoots great. I run a SWFA SS 3-9.
That being said, there are a lot of options and price ranges for SPR style setups. You will get great results with any of the previously mentioned barrels of you feed it good ammo.
it’s cheaper (and safer) to buy. you need tools (some proprietary to a single component), knowledge and experience - especially for an accurate rifle.
there’s only 2 advantages to building it yourself:
you can get exactly the components you want (but it’s easy to be too smart for your own good there (ask me how i know))
you can spread the cost out over time - if you’ve got the patience.
so, anyone who can change a tire can assemble an AR. but having one built right, by a craftsman, has value beyond whatever savings might appear to be gained.
the pricing game is kinda fun. go to rainier arms, price one of their complete ultramatch uppers, then price the components (i suggest them because it’s straight forward to figure out their BoM). then add in tools, etc. and see where you end up.
For a battle rifle I feel like I could do it no problem. Now for a accurate ar being for a first build I don’t think that would be smart idea. What about buying upper…throwing a lower on it shooting the heck out of it. Then building one and seeing how it shoots compare to the bought upper?
Any good books/videos one can get to get more info on the “secrets” of building a SPR/ “long range” ar platform? I’m wanting one for precision classes and if I ever had to take something or someone down at a longer range.
Yes. Monty and crew do a phenominal job and source the same parts that are used in the mil MK12. I have their mk12 upper and have never been disappointed.
I’ve considered building a Mark 12 SPR clone myself, but ultimately decided to put the plans on hold indefinitely. If I were to buy just the upper I’d consider going through High Caliber Sales or BCM. Sourcing an actual NF 2.5-10x24 might prove challenging though.
