Does anyone own, or have sufficient trigger time behind both of these platforms?
I understand what the physical differences are, but has anyone run both through their paces?
I apologize in advance if this has been covered in-depth in a previous thread.
It seems like most of the info on the PredatAR is hear say, dont know of any M4C members that own one. As far as regular OBR, I know there are a few on here that have one. I am also very curious about how they both perform side by side since I am on the process of deciding which one to get. I love the longer rail and light weight of the PredatAR, but would like to know how the accuracy fairs compared to the standard OBR.
I guess I could always be the test subject for M4C and get the thing and since I already own an MWS I could turn that into my precision rig with a 20" SS barrel and keep the PredatAR as a lightweight .308 battle rifle in case the accuracy is not that good. But if all I have heard is true the PredatAR should be as good as its big brother.
The later pages of this thread mention the two I believe, but not in too much depth.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=77936
It seems that by going with the PredatAR you won’t be losing anything but weight. Which is a good thing…
I have had an 18" barreled PredatAR 7.62 for a couple of months. First 100 rds or so were rough. Accuracy wasn’t great, and live rounds would get stuck in the chamber so that when hand cycling, I had to mortar most of them out. Mfgr didn’t matter - Black Hills, Winchester, Prvi would all get stuck. After close to 200rds through the gun everything has smoothed out, though. I’m very pleased with it!
This particular sample is a 1-1.5 MOA rifle. Not bad for a reasonably lightweight 7.62. It’s not a scalpel - more like a sharp combat knife.
0800: 74 degF, wind 10 mph from 4 o’clock, around 65% relative humidity.
Optic: Nightforce NXS 2.5-10 with NP-R2 reticle
Distance: 200m
Rifle was fired from prone using bipod and a couple of sand socks under the toe of the buttstock. That’s as solid as I can get.
Ammo was Black Hills 175gr HPBT, Prvi 168gr HPBT, Prvi 175gr FMJBT, and Prvi 145gr FMJ:
Outside of -H mag availability, how do you like it comparing to 17s?
I have a 16" OBR and 16" PredatAR and about 20 rounds through each. As you can tell, I have been waaaaaay to busy to get out and run some rounds through them and this sucks!
I will post a detailed comparison when I get a chance and I’m hoping that my SureFire 762K Suppressor (to shared with both rifles) will be in my hands by the fall.
Hmm… The SCAR 17 was at least as accurate and lighter weight. I won’t say I hated the ergonomics, but I did not have a chance to learn to like 'em – hard to do any meaningful drills with only one magazine, and the SCAR never quite felt “right” in my hands. The SCAR mags I ordered from three different sources 6 months ago are still on backorder, by the way. :rolleyes:
From a purely objective standpoint, I would have to say the SCAR seems like a “better” weapon. “Better” meaning more robust and more versatile. However, I have a lot of time behind M4’s and this PredatAR just feels like a big M4. Actually, it feels about like a full size A2 in length and weight. A little bulkier, but not by much.
Subjectively, I like the LaRue better, but I wish they would have been a little more conservative with the lightening of the barrel. I’d prefer to have a quarter to a half pound more meat on barrel. The barrel is 0.595" in front of the handguard.
I just emailed LaRue this week asking if it would be possible to buy a PredatAR with a standard weight OBR barrel. They said no.
The more I shoot the PredatAR, the more I like it, though. It carries well, and puts 145gr FMJ Prvi on a 12x16 inch steel plate every time out to at least 400m (the farthest I’ve shot it so far).
If most users find this to be the case, I will be leaning towards getting a 17 instead. Theoretically the 17s barrel should last longer so besides the whole mag availability issue that would seem like the smarter purchase for a “lightweight” .308 semi. I already own an MWS so I can tinker with different barrels/caliber to make it sub MOA.
Whats the barrel profile like on the PredatAR compared to the 17? is it thinner?
Going with my perception of thread drift towards the PredatAR, I’d say a couple of things based on my 200 or so rounds through mine so far. My picture-fu is weak so I don’t take pictures.
Performance in my testing (all limited to 100 yards at present) of GMM, Prvi Partisan match (both 168gr), American Eagle OTM, and five or six types of military surplus shows the rifle capable of 5/8ths of an inch with match (esp’ GMM and the AE OTM) at 100 yards, just over what the test target demonstrated with GMM. Groups with ball ranged, so to speak, from 2 inches to about an inch. No scientific or rigorous testing here, I’ll caveat, just three-round groups trying to determine a baseline of capability. Rifle performance so far illustrates more my shortcomings than any limitations of the system.
I put my best scope on the PredatAR, a 2.5-10X, 32mm Nightforce in Nightforce rings.
What do you want your rifle to do? It seems to me the demands of long-range precision versus 3-gun or battle rifle shooting are so different that you need to define your requirements as well as possible before writing that big cheque. At the risk of sounding pedantic, the glass and BUIS you choose for the rifle will affect balance and handling as well as down range performance so you need to give these things lots of thought.
PredatAR barrel profile seems very much to me to be like a GI-profile M14/M1A barrel and not dissimilar from that of the SCAR-H. Haven’t shot an 'H but there was a guy buying his at the same time I bought my PredatAR (both of our transfers came on the same Big Brown Truck). We each got to handle the other’s rifle while waiting on paperwork and such. Certainly the ergonomics of handling the two rifles are feel very different. Subjectively the two rifles weighed the same without optics.
System considerations vary from shooter to shooter. Parts and magazine availability were a consideration for me. None of my research (talking to owners at the range, m4carbine.net and lightfighter.com searches, e-mail contact with manufacturers) indicated that spare parts would be readily forthcoming from either LMT or FN for their rifles. When I asked Larue about a spare bolt and such, they asked me how many I wanted to order. Mag’ availability issues are well known.
Barrel life was of some concern. I discussed it with Larue when I ordered the rifle. I was as much as told that if I shot it out they’d replace it for me. I won’t have the opportunity to test this assertion any time soon.
Hope some of this is helpful.
Regarding barrel differences between LaRue and SCAR, the LaRue OBR and Pred barrels are made out of LW50 (aka 17-4) stainless. All the info I’ve been able to find about this steel is that it is VERY tough and will not likely wear out noticeably faster than the chrome-lined SCAR barrel.
Barrel diameter of the SCAR is a little larger than 5/8" (0.625"), as there is a slight shoulder behind the 5/8" muzzle threads, and the barrel only gets larger from there. The 0.03" +/- difference looks more substantial in person than it sounds on paper, but probably doesn’t mean much. My 18" LaRue barrel does seem to whip/vibrate more than the 16" SCAR barrel, based on some fairly extensive accuracy tests I shot on paper targets. The good news is that 10 shot strings are still in the 1-1.5 MOA range, which is as good as mine shoots 3-5 shot strings. I got smaller groups with a 1.5-5x scope on the SCAR than I am able to get out of the LaRue with a 2.5-10x scope… but this is a sample of one rifle.
For me, the pros/cons really come down to the fact that magazines are available for the LaRue, and it functions like an M4 so I’m more comfortable with it. After getting through the break-in period with the Predatar, everything runs like a clock and puts rounds on target. Not 300m brain shots, but as good as most bolt-action “deer rifles”, which is good enough for me. However, if you want sub-MOA, you need to get a full-weight OBR.
Thank you for this data & AAR.
Guys this is very informitive info thanks for it. I have yet to see any of these rifles in person but feel like I have learned alot about them already.
+1 excellent info and much appreciated.
can anyone explain if the difference between the two is more than just a light weight barrel, rail, and stock? As far as I know everything else including the BCG is the same, so reliability or working ability should be no different than a regular obr
I think the only differences are the barrel contour, the forend, and the fact that the Predatar has a “standard” flat-top and the full weight OBR has a 20(?) MOA tapered top rail that extends from the rear of the receiver all the way to the front of the forend.
Oh yeah, the OBR has a Giessele SSA trigger and the Pred has some lesser variant of the Giessele. Still a nice 2-stage, but noticeably less refined feeling than the SSA.
thanks for the info. That’s exactly what I was looking for.
Same thing. I am up to whole of 6 mags…Thanks for your info. I think the mag situation is killing 17s. For a weapon that has limited acceptance with .mil users, lack of spare mags is beyond my understanding.
7.62 OBR
• 20MOA top rail
• Heavier barrel
• Port selector gas block
• Geissele SSA
• Shorter length rail
7.62 PredatAR
• No MOA top rail
• Lightweight barrel
• Low-pro gas block
• Geissele S2S
• Extended rail
Wow, nice graphic.
Question: Do ALL full-weight OBR’s come with the adjustable gas block, or is that an option that costs extra?