Yeah, but don’t worry about that for too much longer… Obama knows how to “change” that, for us. 
How I interpreted what he said to mean was: “People in small town America don’t understand their own problems, so they turn to being rednecks.”
Thanks for giving PA to Hillary, Obama. We appreciate it! 
Seems like this presidential election is different from previous. It’s not so important that a “Republican” or “Democrat” wins the office as it is that Obama does not. Many American may not like McCain or Clinton, but they fear Obama.
There’s a republican running? 
Do we really want to go there? Remember, the old Republican party in favor of smaller government, less regulation, less spending, etc.??? I still do, but I haven’t seen it for a long time. 
I don’t know if it is a great idea to come on here as the new guy who is about to defend a political candidate who most on this forum clearly are not big fans of, but what Obama said has been taken totally out of context.
During the event, audience members could ask questions. One of them said they were going to PA to campaign for Obama and wanted to know the best way he could put the Obama campaign forward with PA voters. This is the direct text of his response:
OBAMA: "So, it depends on where you are, but I think it’s fair to say that the places where we are going to have to do the most work are the places where people feel most cynical about government. The people are mis-appre…I think they’re misunderstanding why the demographics in our, in this contest have broken out as they are. Because everybody just ascribes it to ‘white working-class don’t wanna work – don’t wanna vote for the black guy.’ That’s…there were intimations of that in an article in the Sunday New York Times today - kind of implies that it’s sort of a race thing.
Here’s how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long, and they feel so betrayed by government, and when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn’t buy it. And when it’s delivered by – it’s true that when it’s delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama (laugher), then that adds another layer of skepticism (laughter).
But – so the questions you’re most likely to get about me, ‘Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What’s the concrete thing?’ What they wanna hear is – so, we’ll give you talking points about what we’re proposing – close tax loopholes, roll back, you know, the tax cuts for the top 1 percent. Obama’s gonna give tax breaks to middle-class folks and we’re gonna provide health care for every American. So we’ll go down a series of talking points.
But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there’s not evidence of that in their daily lives.
You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing’s replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.
So it’s not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Um, now these are in some communities, you know. I think what you’ll find is, is that people of every background – there are gonna be a mix of people, you can go in the toughest neighborhoods, you know working-class lunch-pail folks, you’ll find Obama enthusiasts. And you can go into places where you think I’d be very strong and people will just be skeptical. The important thing is that you show up and you’re doing what you’re doing."
I disagree with Obama’s positions on a lot of issues and won’t be voting for him. There is plenty to shoot the man down with based on his proposed policies and his basic ideology. Having said that, I think he is both honest and astute; I think going down the path of personal attacks, name calling or ad-hominem arguments is utterly inappropriate.
An idealist, I may very well be, but I would love to see a presidential election where we actually get two smart candidates duking it out over real issues as opposed to dueling, multi-billion dollar smear campaigns. That goes for both sides.
So, he’s an “honest” politician? Now that would be “change.”
For what it’s worth, this is not about “issues” this time around…it’s about ideology.
http://www.gunowners.org/pres08/obama.htm
Oh sure, Obama told Iowa radio listeners last year that he is a “strong believer” in the rights of hunters and sportsmen, and that homeowners should have a firearm “to protect their home and their family.” But then in the next breath, he says, “It’s hard for me to find a rationale for having a 17-clip semiautomatic [sic].”
Not surprisingly, Obama supports the gun ban in the nation’s capital, saying the "DC handgun law is constitutional."4 And he is opposed to people using guns for self-defense, when those guns are owned in localities like Washington, DC and Chicago where firearms are banned.
The concealed carry of firearms is another important issue for gun owners, and yet Obama is not only opposed to citizens carrying guns, he supports using federal laws to override those states which currently allow the practice.
In 2004, Obama said he supports a national ban on concealed carry because the states that allow it are "threatening the safety of Illinois residents."6 Never mind the fact that concealed carry laws have improved the safety of citizens in the states that have enacted such laws.7
Obama has also taken a strong position in favor of the Clinton semi-auto ban which sunset in 2004. “I believe we need to renew – not roll back – this common sense gun law,” Obama said.8
Well, there’s nothing that’s “common sense” about the Clinton ban. Not only did it outlaw almost 200 types of firearms, legislators like Senator Chuck Schumer of New York tried to amend the law (before it sunset) to include additional types of semi-autos – even banning classic (wood-stock) long guns such as the Remington shotgun which Senator John Kerry received as a gift during his 2004 presidential bid.
He strikes me as being more honest than most.
Even looking at this controversial snippet from his speech; he essentially dismisses his campaign’s own talking points and delivers a hypothesis as to why midwestern voters vote the way they do and take up micro-issues as opposed to looking at the big picture.
Again, I am not trying to defend the guy’s policies and I am not saying you need to agree with his hypothesis, but in an era of sound bites and bumpersticker campaigns, that is a pretty honest and open way to speak in a hard fight election.
For what it’s worth, this is not about “issues” this time around…it’s about ideology.
I totally agree. Would you rather have an honest battle of ideologies or the smear campaign cluster f&*k we’ve been watching going back the last 20 years?
Well, since you did ask!
I’d like to see a return to the time when our politicians served the citizens they represented. When they still worked their farms and managed their family-owned drug stores full-time and only went to DC part-time. I’d like to see us get away from professional politicians and such a strong federal government.
It would be nice if we reverted back to the time when the states donated money to fund the federal government. Ah, the curse of the 16th Amendment…
Don’t worry, I’m waking up from my dream.
You really believe in this guy’s honesty after his horseshit responses to him being a member of a black nationalist church that preaches hate and intolerance from the pulpit???
Really?
Again, I am not trying to defend the guy’s policies and I am not saying you need to agree with his hypothesis, but in an era of sound bites and bumpersticker campaigns, that is a pretty honest and open way to speak in a hard fight election.
I agree, these voters should look at the big picture. If they did so they’d realize that it was Democrats and Unions that put them in the position they are in currently and that nobody, Democrat or Republican, is going to open the mills/plants again and they need to adapt to the new economic dynamic and move on.
C’mon, that was a dream? Ya had me going there for a minute, it kinda sounds like UTOPIA! I’m gonna have to vote libertarian this time around. These knuckleheads lawyers/politicians are just way too far from the beaten path.
Did you hear/read his speech on race in this country that he delivered in response to the uproar about that situation? Obama churned out what many people view as one of the most powerful, honest and open speeches about race this country has heard in the last 30 years. Oh, and he wrote it himself.
Go ahed, watch it for yourself, in full. If for no other reason than to know your enemy. The sound bites are one thing, but the full deal was one of the most refreshing things I’ve ever seen a politician say.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWe7wTVbLUU
And any way you cut it, the vast majority of people have put that incident with his pastor behind him, mostly because he took the issue head on and addressed it.
I agree, these voters should look at the big picture. If they did so they’d realize that it was Democrats and Unions that put them in the position they are in currently and that nobody, Democrat or Republican, is going to open the mills/plants again and they need to adapt to the new economic dynamic and move on.
You really think the plight of middle America is to be laid solely at the feet of the Democrats and Unions?
Average wages in Shenzhen are roughly $120 a month. Last year, that was $110 and the year before, only about $100. Most of the migrant workers in China (migrating from the agricultural hinterlands of the North) get room and board, which costs effectively about $25 a month. So, about $145 total wages per month for the average Chinese worker who took a US job.
Theorize a US without Unions. Do you really think that we could compete against Chinese economics, even without Unions inflating wages and adding to business overhead? Sure, the exodus of jobs would have likely been slower, but it still would have happened. Slave labor, even virtual slave labor, will always offer better core economics then employing free citizens in a democracy.
I doubt he wrote that speech by himself…he borrows plenty material…
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YuB_W8o_UsU
and this one is always good for a laugh…
So the Obama campaign has speaking/talking points that they coordinate between all of his supporters giving speeches. The Republicans have done the same thing - ever heard of the story of how the phrase “Death Tax” (instead of Estate Tax) or Global Climate Change (instead of Global Warming) came into being from the GOP? Google Frank Luntz; he is more then happy to tell you how the GOP gets all the players “on message.”
And in the opening, Obama was clearly channeling the pretty widely known speech from Malcolm X. Shit dude, he is grinning while he says the words and the audience is laughing in recognition. He is connecting with his audience; something McCain doesn’t do nearly as well. Obama is a Jedi Master of this.
and this one is always good for a laugh…
So here, he takes 3 positons:
Pull out of Iraq. I disagree with this. You disagree with this. Unfortunately thanks to the media however, the vast majority of Americans agree with this. Taking up political positions that the majority of the electorate agree with strongly sounds like a hell of a good way to WIN an election weather or not that position is right or wrong.
Do you really want to disagree too strongly with the second point? The USAF alone gets milked billions upon billions of dollars by defense contractors selling wing and a prayer Science Fiction. This isn’t to say that we shouldn’t develop future combat systems by any stretch of the imagination, but is anyone here going to disagree with the fact that the way we develop future combat systems is highly inefficient, rarely provides effective systems and is tinged with the taint of corruption? In fact, pre 9/11, wasn’t Rumsfeld installed as SecDef with a strong mandate to cut Pentagon fat to the bone?
Nuclear weapons. Again, we can have a pedantic debate about the topic, but I am guessing you and I would probably agree on a whole lot. I think a huge portion of Americans on both sides of the political divide don’t see the need to keep thousands upon thousands of physics packages pointed at targets across the globe. Just like pulling out of Iraq, Obama is taking up a populist position and that is what wins elections.
Look, I know it sounds like I am on the guy’s side. The fact is that I am very much in awe of Obama as a candidate. He is refreshingly articulate, squeaky clean and politically astute far beyond what his experience would indicate.
To defeat him, our side of the issue needs to get beyond the petty mud slinging that allowed us to eek out wins in 2000 and 2004. This man cannot effectively be labeled an “elitist” (voters are already indicating that the charge stemming from the PA comments is not sticking at all). There is no way for Obama to be “Swift Boated” out of the running the way Kerry was.
To defeat Obama, we need to pull the curtains on the light and puppy dog show he has been putting on and show the American people the unintended consequences of his policies if put into place.
Pulling American combat power from Iraq will unleash a humanitarian crisis on par with something from a Hiberious Bosch painting and will make Darfor look like a middle school bake sale.
Bailing out banks and home mortgage borrowers may stabilize the economy in the short term, but will put the nation deeper in debt and cause a negative Pavlovian response on the part of financial institutions and consumers.
National health care will lower the quality of service, innovation and independence of the American health care system and cannot be efficiently or effectively implemented without costs FAR beyond those projected.
Obama’s insane position on firearms is indicative of being seriously out of touch with a whole host of issues that concern Americans. The vast majority of people in this country support firearms rights and have expressed that view very clearly. Obama’s position runs totally against the political, practical and constitutional realities of the issue.
So, win by arguing against the man’s positions, ideologies and world view, NOT the man himself. It is a novel idea, but it is the only way we won’t see Obama elected to the White House.
'learn something every day.
Sooo, you like Obama?
It was interesting to read his comments in their full context, but I don’t think it added anything to what he said or what he was trying to say. Maybe he is motivated by compassion, but whatever his motivation I think it was plain that he is looking down his nose at some significant portions of American culture - like we are sad little toys that he, in his grand benevolence, is going to fix. Well screw him. He may be nice and articulate, but he is just another Mk1 Mod 0 liberal as far as I’m concerned.
If the American people have put the Wright controversy behind them, as you say, maybe we deserve obama and the erosion of our freedom for the crime of being apathetic, naive, and stupid. I would like to think the American people are a little more saavy.
striker 5 ask if americia had put the Wright controversay behind them.? There is no Wright controversay, just the fact that alot of blacks hate whites.
You lost me with the first part of your post. I don’t think black people “hate” whites in the purest sense of the term. I think when you are faced with the fact that your culture is massively dysfunctional and getting left behind by other minority groups AND have been told day on stay on that your problems are not your fault, I think it’s easier to cop out and blame white society. I remember Malcolm X saying something to the effect that black people should not try to gain the acceptance of white people until they accept themselves.
I don’t know how to work the format on this. So I will just say --to striker 5: I think that you may have more insight into this matter than I do , or at least you state it better than I do. My thought is that alot of white americans were niave about about what blacks thought about them and the controvsey stems somewhat from them suddenly finding out. ------------he went into younder village and never returned.
I saw it, I was underwhelmed.
And any way you cut it, the vast majority of people have put that incident with his pastor behind him, mostly because he took the issue head on and addressed it.
Sure, his supporters put it behind them.
I’m sorry fella, but if you can put it behind you that this man was a member of a hate organization for 20 years because he gave ONE supposedly “honest” speech, in which he concluded that the “typical white person” is an ignorant racist afraid of blacks, you are a believer, not a thinker.
You really think the plight of middle America is to be laid solely at the feet of the Democrats and Unions?
I don’t know fella, there is an awful lot of industry growing in the South. Much of the auto industry didn’t move out of the US, it simply moved to more conservative/right-to-work states where unions have a lot less influence.
Politically, there is little anybody can do about foreign economic advantages, however; one can at least isolate for policies that hamstring business and make them uncompetitive. Democrats and Unions bear the bulk of that responsibility. High corporate taxation and capital taxation and questionable liability torts combined with bureaucractically obsolete, intractable unions who have shown that they’ll continue to “fight” for more pay and benefits even when the company is approaching bankruptcy are just such things that one can affect here.
This ends my engagement with you. My views of Obama and his “campaign of hope” aren’t going to “change” (snicker) unless he suddenly stops being a socialist, racist, and populist, so I don’t see much point in furthering our conversation
To everybody else who isn’t drinking the Obamania Kool-Aid, didn’t anybody else notice in that sound clip Obama’s mention of “anti-trade sentiment???” I though that mighty odd considering his own opposition to free trade.