I have a longtime friend who is moving back to my area. He is interested in guns and shooting and has owned them in the past. Just one problem, he had a bad ND once and it’s part of the reason he doesn’t own guns now.
To make matters worse he shot a friend in the foot when it happened. He isn’t a bad person and he’s not a retard, he just never had anyone teach him gun safety or stress it to the point that he internalized it. While in his mind it was an “accident” it would never have happened if he was paying attention to where the gun was pointed and he kept his finger off the trigger.
And now he wants a handgun, and he wants me to get him one. I don’t know what, if anything, he has learned about gun safety since the incident and he has a wife with two kids. And he wants a Glock (of course).
I know the standard line is to send him to a gun safety class but that won’t happen. I already know the “I don’t have the time, money, etc.” reasons he will have for not doing it. I have been around him shooting a few times and didn’t see anything noticeably “unsafe” but that was also before the incident. I also wasn’t paying close attention and looking for problems.
I don’t fancy myself a “firearms instructor” but I’m concerned enough that I’m thinking about taking him shooting a few times and trying to really pound the 4 rules into his brain and ride his ass if he even comes close to doing something unsafe. But at the same time, I don’t want to act like he’s a moron who needs my supervision and instruction. The big problem of course is he believes he already knows this stuff.
What do you mean by, “he wants me to get him one”? Do you mean he wants your recommendation as to what to get, or are you talking about straw purchasing, which is illegal?
Well as he is not a “prohibited person” it wouldn’t be a straw purchase if I gave him one as a gift. But in this instance, I am a FFL and he simply wants to purchase one from me.
Well, like it or not, you will by default, become his mentor. I’d take him out, and let him try several pistols, Glock, M&P, etc, throw in a DA/SA pistol as well.Let him shoot and watch for anything stupid, and if anything pops up, bring it to his attention right there on the spot, and correct him. If he continues to do it, end the session, and explain stupid mistakes cannot be tolerated, because when that bullet flys out of the barrel, it dosen’t care where it’s going, there’s no calling it back.Make him go home and think about it… I would’nt sell him anything until he could demostrate that…
A. He understands the basic concept that all firearms are considered loaded, and they are to be treated that way…
B.If he understands A above, then he should also be able to grasp the concept of keeping his trigger finger OFF the trigger, unless he wants to put a hole in whatever he’s aiming at…
C. Continue to stress to him to seek training…When he throws up the “I don’t have time” shit, Remind him that if he has another ND/AD and kills someone, the state will find time for him, in a cell… His choice.
Get him a surplus S&W Model 10, cut the hammer spur and single action sear surface off so it’s DA only, and tell him if he so much as touches any other gun and you hear about it, he’s all done.
Get him to an Appleseed shoot, they are cheap, fun, and they pound safety into your head, and so do all of the other people there if you are lax about it.
I wouldn’t get that guy anything untill he completely understands that he is the only one responsible for where those rounds end up.
Also the word “accident” needs to be erased from his mind. Somehow someway, untill that happens I don’t think there is any hope for him.
I’ve known people like this in the past. They have dense gray matter that is almost impenetrable. I wouldn’t take the responsibility of placing a weapon into the hands of a known Ding Dong. Having a beer or breaking bread with this friend, OK, but I’d defer to some other FFL in your area and stay clear of going to the range until he can clearly demonstrate a level of safety that you are comfortable with, and tell him so. Personally, with folks like that, I don’t even talk gun anything with them. I promptly change the subject or walk away.
From the comment in the OP about “had a bad ND once and it’s part of the reason he doesn’t own guns now,” it seems likely that Steyr’s friend appreciates the destructive potential of a handgun and, if anything, has a lack of confidence around firearms as opposed to the careless overconfidence some seem to suggest.
Regardless, I wouldn’t feel comfortable facilitating his acquisition of a handgun until he takes some instruction, gets back in the saddle, and demonstrates both safe gun handling techniques and proficiency. And I’d just tell him straight out, “Hey. I think you had a bad experience. I think it shook you up and made you uncomfortable around guns. And now I’m uncomfortable handing one to you until you get your head straight.”
I would use the ND as a main training point as in “you remember when?” we don’t want that to happen again .
I would think something with a manual safety would be better Like the XD or M&P ( do they have safeties?) if he is dead set on a Glock style Pistol .But in the end it will just take hammering in his head about the safe handling of the weapon .
If this wasn’t a very good friend, it wouldn’t be a problem at all. But I think I have a solution. I have another friend who is mostly new to shooting and has no safety concerns, in fact he will still sometimes stop everything he’s doing just to evaluate things and make sure he’s “safe.” We’ll call him Friend B.
So my plan is to tell Friend A that I need his help introducing Friend B to firearms and we both need to really watch him for safety issues. In reality Friend B will be “in on it” and will actually be keeping an eye on Friend A and helping me with him. And the entire event will revolve around everyone making sure everyone else is being “safe.”
If Friend A becomes responsible for making sure Friend B is safe, then he will be much more mindful of those safety issues himself. And it “should” make him assume the role of a “responsible shooter” in order to present an example to follow. And hopefully that will allow him to internalize all this shit.
I also plan to show him what I’ll represent as “advanced skills” which will be predicated on redundant safe handling skills.
Don’t enable the guy by calling them “reasons.” They’re not reasons. These are excuses. For an individual who has already had a Negligent Discharge where someone was hurt, he has no grounds to argue that a basic firearms gun safety course isn’t for him. Instead of trying to accommodate your friend to make him happy, you should help him by letting him know that he is being completely unreasonable. In a nutshell, if it’s important to him he will find the time and the money. If it’s not, he won’t. By refusing to go to a gun safety class he’s already told you that while he is aware of the dangers he is unwilling to be serious about gun safety.
Gun safety courses are just a few hours and cost relatively little money. If you’re his friend and you want to make this easier for him, pay for a course so he has one less excuse. Beyond that, tell him if he’s not willing to help himself by attending a gun safety class, there’s no reason for you to aid him in his quest to be an irresponsible gun owner. We already have enough of those types out there and they make all gun owners look bad.
It’s not some Machiavellian scheme to elect the next Pope. It’s simply me recognizing that for this person, making him think he is responsible for helping me teach “gun safety” to another friend is probably the most effective way for him to internalize the concepts for himself.
The alternative is nothing. He thinks he’s safe, his logic being he is careful now that he’s had an accident. If I pull his card and tell him I don’t think he is safe, he’s simply going to be offended and he won’t get any safer. He’s not in the military where I have discretionary authority over what he learns.
My “crazy plan” involves getting him to the range with two other “safe shooters” who will keep an eye on him and at the same time getting him thinking about “gun safety issues” by suggesting he help me keep an eye on another friend of ours to make sure he is shooting safe. As a consequence he is thinking about safety and emulating a person who is already a safe shooter.
Call me crazy if you want, but so far that’s the best plan I can come up with that will work. Sure it’s a Jedi mind trick, but that is simply so I can skip the part where I offend him by suggesting he needs some remedial gun safety practice.
I don’t think your plan is going to work, if I thought I could just tell him and he’d take a gun safety course I’d do that. I know him well enough to know that he won’t think it’s necessary.
