I hope I am never this "highspeed"

[Patrick_Aherne]

@Pat_Rogers

Pat Aherne- were you at this particular class?? My understanding 3rd hand from some that were was that this was a POST cert class, and this wasn’t on the POI. Is that correct/ incorrect??

I was not at that course. I was at one of the next training courses after this one. The drill pictured was not run in the course I was in. However, we did do a number of drills similar to this one, just not walking towards each other. The POST outline I received showed range drills, but didn’t break it down much more than that.

There are other specific issues with this training that I won’t get into here. Hit me with a PM or email if you want more info.

[ashooter]

@Cato

Especially as a civilian I would rather go home after a training class with exact the number of holes in my body that I started with, than have the doubtable profit of a bit more “realism”. Not every safety violation leads automatically to desaster, but ingraining safety violations by a “its not that bad”/“shit happens” mindset will bite you sometime…

…Anyhow, as often as the muzzle of my “team member” (who I didn’t know before the training class and never will meet again after it) may sweep my body, I still wouldn’t embrace this as realism.

Let me first say that I do NOT condone or encourage safety violations for the sake of “realism”. That is NOT what I meant by any of my previous comments. My comments on this type “high speed” stuff are based on a grand total of 2 Tactical Response courses and discussions with a couple of friends who have attended several courses with Suarez as well as Tactical Response. I can’t speak for the Suarez classes, but in the TR classes, I did not observe ANY safety violations other than an issue with one student not being 100% aware of his muzzle on day 1, but that was addressed by Yeager on day 1 and wasn’t a problem thereafter. By the time we got to the “scarey stuff” on days 3 & 4, everybody was on the same page… and everybody was encouraged to sit out anything that made them uncomfortable.

If you’re doing these types of drills properly, with students that are ready for these types of drills, both mentally and skill-wise, there will be no safety violations. Drills like the one pictured that started this thread do not require safety violations to perform… Quite the contrary, they absolutely require strict adherence to the 4 rules of safe gunhandling!

There are a lot of drills I would absolutely not do with any other student(s) on day 1 of any class, but that I would gladly do on day 3 or 4… and NEVER would I expect or condone having a muzzle pointed at me. Near me, no problem as long as it’s in a controlled drill… AT me, hell no!

Again, I think this stuff is lot scarier looking/sounding when taken out of context than it is in the context of several days (or weeks) worth of training.

[The_Dumb_Gun_Collect]

Pat Rogers,

I think you should incorporate this drill into a shotgun course.

Seriously, I am a big proponent of the idea that AK’s are not as inaccurate as its’ detractors claim. But, if I was in this class, I would really want it to be an m4 class. Hell, maybe a PSG-1 class.

Seriously, while I understand the theory behind this, I really don’t want this guy teaching any hand grenade drills.