Excellent condition 95% + Colt SP1 Carbine values???

AR/M4 Vintage ARs
1

Hey gents, I’m outta my league a bit on the retro or collector stuff, but I want my damn KISS Colt back, and am at a gunshow staring at a beautiful, almost flawless looking SP1 carbine. Looks to be shot, but very little. Perhaps the nicest non NIB SP1 Ive seen fwiw.

No box, no papers, no accs., 1 mag, and the OEM sling. Sticker is $2350. I told him I’d be back in 30minutes with an offer. $2350 is never gonna happen, however what about $2k.

Should I just altogether pass, and just rebuild my Colt 6520. One thing I do know I think…this particular gun should only go up and up in value as times goes on given it’s treated right, and protected. I’m kinda thinking more investment, or perhaps it’s mental gymnastics.

2

A little high but you only live once. Plus they aren’t making any more. Should be a good investment if you plan on keeping it like new.

3

I know I am a little late responding, but I have to weigh in. A few years ago, I paid $1800 for a excellent condition 1981 SP1 Carbine. This did not include any accessories, manual, or box. Book value was about $2500 at the time. That said, If you were able to get the carbine for $2000 or somewhere close, you would have done well. Original SP1 Carbines are getting few and far between as many are stripped down and sold for parts. I hope you were able to make a deal on that carbine.

4

There’s a near 100% condition SP1 in my area for $1500. Its tempting.

5

For a near 100% condition SP1 Sporter, that would be a good price these days. Most likely, it is a mid to late 1970s model for that price. About 10 years ago, I bought a mint condition 1977 SP1 Sporter for $1K at a local gun show. It is still in mint condition. It is not going anywhere.

6

I don’t know anything about dating SP1’s, but its a completely slickside upper, if that means anything.

7

I offered $1800…saw his grimace, and long delay so I went ahead and gave him my final number…$1900. He countered with a firm $2200. The gent has become somewhat of a friend over the last several months at shows I’ve seen him at, and he told me he had a $600 SKS, and $1400 cash into the rifle as it sits.

Considering the ARs I have already, any AR would be dumb for me to buy…but imho, that is without question the sexist little KISS carbine I’ve ever fondled. Funnily enough the stock was the thing that I almost just couldn’t walk from, that and those old school skinny handguards on it. I’ve bought several NIB colts since around 2007, and everyone looked more dinged up than this pristine SP1 carbine.

Either way, I honestly feel privileged just to play around with it for an hour or so, and contemplate the thought of owning such an exquisite weapon. Ive seen the SP1 carbines in pics and stuff, but after getting hands on with a primo specimen, this is without question the sexist, coolest, KISS carbine ever built, again imho. The 6520 is a minivan in comparison. Thanks guys very much for the help, and after seeing Renegade’s Retro army, I think it’s save to take his advice. :dirol:

8

Colt SP1 Sporters, SP1 Carbines, AR-15 A2s, AR-15 A2 Carbines, and some others are easily dated by serial number range. The early 1960s (starting in 1963) SP1s are quite pricey when you can find them for sale. Depending on condition, $3000-$3500. Early 1970s SP1 can be around $2500. Mid to late 1970s SP1s bring around $1200-$1700 depending on the state and the market. SP1 Carbines generally bring higher values than the Sporter. Seeing them for sale for around $2500 is not uncommon.

9

I forgot to ask, since you actually own one of these gems, can I assume you shoot it since your on M4C? :cool: Some pics would be fantastic as well.

If so, what kinda of schedule do you put it on, do you take any special precautions with it. Damn it’s crazy I want a close to 40yr old AR when I have one or two SRs, and MRPs that I currently consider the best defense firearm I can own. Why go back in time before the AR got to be the absolute razor edge sharpness it is now in terms of refinement. We’ve mastered controls finally, something just 5yrs ago I essentially gave up on in regards to anybody but KAC, and boutique high end ARs to feature OEM rifles with full ambi, and advanced controls. Combine that with twist rates, 1000x more modularity, perfecting and totally controlling gassing, especially in regard to suppressing them. Throw in the advancements to the RE, and buffers…one would be crazy to buy a used SP-1 Carbine, when right down the road one can buy a new MARs MRP or an SR 15 in the current flavor for exactly the same amount of money??

My answer to the question above personally I think…cause it’s everything the modern day AR isn’t, yet has all the true pedigree, DNA, and history of being a Tier 1 rifle then and still now given you can run KISS setups.

Kinda a humbling moment in my AR love affair, I’ve honestly never seen the point to retros and had no interest in them outside of what they would represent in terms of the incremental advancements they might feature. Still not sure I’d ever get into modern produced retro rifles, although if I hit powerball….I’ll have it all boys!

The power of one aged, tiny, and perfectly balanced pony in a man’s hand can change things in a NY minute for sure. I wish I never f**ked with my factory 6520…thus far it’s my thrown away rookie Mantle card. Still have the most important part perhaps, but damn its hard to find a almost new 6520 upper from the vintage of 2007-08 era. Restricted marked days.

10

I don’t own one, just handle one lustfully at a dusty gun store that I live near. The rifles I own are newer, but I sometimes question if they are really “better”.

11

Retro ARs are not for everyone as they do not appeal to the masses. For me, I fell in love with the M16 when I joined the Marine Corps back in 1978. My issue weapon was a M16A1. When I got into ARs hot and heavy back in 2004, I wanted to get a Colt SP1, but I was more inclined to the modern AR with all of the new tech. A couple years later, I decided to jump on the retro bandwagon and I am glad I did. I have learned a great deal about the older M16 rifles and carbines than I ever thought I would learn. I eventually did buy a nice SP1 Sporter and Carbine, but I have more pride in ownership in the retro ARs I built. Although not an expert by any means, I do have a lot of knowledge on retro ARs and love sharing it when I can. I have seen guys get into retros that would never have thought they would get into them. It is the nostalgia and the history they like. The platform is simple and is reliant on the skills of the shooter and not technology to shoot them accurately. Old school ARs are something everyone should appreciate and experience. Personally, I am as much a new school AR guy as I am an old school AR guy. I can appreciate them all as I would not have 42 ARs if I did not.

12

Thanks for your informative thoughts on this topic, and for weighing in again. I imagine one learns a much more well rounded history, and perspective on the AR design after diving down the retro rabbit hole. Most people just accept changes, and move on without ever really understanding why things were changed or altered in a designs evolution over time.

One last thing I loved about that SP1 yesterday is that it’s stock felt just like a sopmod on an LMT RE with regards to a hydralic type feel, with almost no slop. Most of old carbine stocks I’ve felt were incredibly noisy on the tube. Also I’d have never changed the handguards from those on the older 6520s and on the SP1 carbine…they felt great in the hand.

13

I was fortunate to have friends with their SP1 parts cast aside to reconfigure their SP1s to be more like the A2 M16, so I was able to snag parts at the cheap. They were glad to get rid of the “crappy old shit,” especially if I bought Colt OEM replacement parts. Ironically, the one guy kept telling me he felt like he “was taking advantage of me” because most shooters want the latest, greatest & not what was used in 1970.
Unfortunately, friends like that are too few & far between.

14

The thing that I’m currently focused on (the overall bucket safe guns) due to a sudden realization last March when I bought my dad his beloved USGI carbine back that he had stolen when he was in his 20s. At that moment I got bite hard by the carbine bug, and had a come to Jesus moment with regards to the neglect, and one track focused mentality I had all through my 20s…Modern, modern, modern…cutting edge, cutting edge, etc. bullshit. That type of savant vapor lock or obsession around one particular love affair with the AR made me oblivious to all the chances I was blowing, or had already missed to acquire the honestly limited number of truly special pillars any military/tactical firearm collection must include…the USGI carbines made me realize that I had already waited to late to do anything but get one good representation or one or two prime contractor carbines and in my case a Winny, an Inland, and a Jukebox. During this time I also realized I finally waited to long to get a HK P7 for any respectable price.

I’m trying to decide if I should go with this basically full retail impeccable SP1 carbine @ $2200 OR get what I believe is the much more significant piece of a true collection, and in this case a piece of the fine China, a.k.a a pristine, Norinco 56S-1 UF with the rare blue bolt with one OEM chicom mag, and OEM sling, but no box, bayo, oil bottle, or manual for $1500

I have essentially also missed the boat on getting a preban chicom AK like a Polytech or Norinco for anything less than $2500. That’s just crazy money for an AK, regardless if it’s one of the gold standard models that all AKs get judged against. Pretty sure I’m not gonna find another Siles NY Norinco 56s-1 UF for $1500 that looks in new condition…whereas I’m sure I’ll see a few more SP1 carbines marked at full retail or close to that $2200-2500 mark.

Funny how a War Baby designed by a convict in the clink in the 40s, can make a younger fellow living in 2018 instantly reevaluate what guns matter and what guns won’t matter in the future. USGI carbines ooze some kinda special sauce, and their almost unmatched conflict history fighting in an untold amount of battles, wars, and conflicts just adds to their specialness. Playing detective with a new non corrected carbine is about as fun of activity to do within the firearm realm that I’ve found thus far.

Anyways, for those that are in their 30s, and 20s…keep KISS factory rifles stock, don’t neglect an overall collection in pursuit of your 7th LMT MRP, and start learning today about guns you plan to add to your bucket safe. Each firearm takes a few months at least for me in order to even be educated enough to know what I’m looking for, and what the market prices should be.

15

No box and paperwork? Wouldn’t give more than $1800.

Buying any imported assault rifle right now (Beretta ARX, Tavor, SANs 55X series, CZ Bren, etc) is a much better investment than an SP1 that is not NIB.

If I had that SP1 in my collection or acquired it in a trade/deal it would be immediately sold on gunbroker.

With the new requirements for state level AWB, slab side large pivot pin Colts have lost their appeal. Serious shooters do not want them because of the large hole.

16

I even got a scottryan opinion on this subject which I certainly appreciate. I also really liked hearing you quote the price I offered the gentlemen on Sat., as it was $500 + off his sticker and didn’t want to offend him with an unreasonable offer.

Regardless of it’s exact current market valuation, those SP1 carbines are incredibly cool. While that one won’t be mine, I’m glad I’m a little less ignorant about a firearm I never learned to appreciate or know in the past because of this experience.

I did end up settling on the trashcan that I picked up on Sunday :slight_smile:

17

still funny that the average ticket price for one is $2500 and I paid $150 for it new in the box in 1976 and I still haven’t scratched her. If you got a Carbine for $2k thats not bad at all.

18

Why the difference in pricing? Are there any design changes between the three? Do you know the serial number breakdown for the three “generations”?

19

Here are some links that will help explain the differences.

Colt Model 6000/SP1
https://bpullignwolnet.dotster.com/retroblackrifle/ModGde/CivGde/R6000.html

Year Serial Number Range
1963 SP00001-SP00023
1964 SP00101
1965 SP02501
1966 SP05600
1967 SP08250
1968 SP10750
1969 SP14000-SP14653
1970 SP15001-SP15473
1971 SP16001
1972 SP19401
1973 SP24201
1974 SP32601
1975 SP43801
1976 SP55301
1977 SP67651
1978 SP83400
1979 SP96401
1980 SP112801
1981 SP134601
1982 SP158201

Note: All SP1 serial numbers start with SP, not SP1.
If you see a 1 there, it does belong to the serial number.
Early SP1s were marked “Colt’s Patent Firearms”
Later SP1s were marked “Colt’s Firearms Division”

Like the Colt Model 602, early SP1 Sporter barrels were stamped with Colt’s proof stamp a V & P in triangle (Verified Proof) on the right side, the barrel extension was also marked with a C (C stamp was used through 1965). A “12” marking was added just over and inch from the muzzle to differentiate it from the earlier barrels. Marking was used from 1963 till the Fall of 1967. These barrels are highly sought after these days. Over the next few years, barrel markings changed. Also, early SP1s had dimpled pins, selectors, and a few other parts that were brought over form the Model 602. Value comes in the compilation of the parts on the early SP1 Sporters. The later the manufacturing date of the SP1, the more common the parts.

20

Thanks for that link, a lot of great information. This is one of those threads I need to save.