I bought the CTR’s for a pair of lowered I bought from Grant w/o stocks. I like them but like I said I’ve learned I don’t need the lock. I will probably try to sell/trade towards MOE stocks. The last stock I bought was a Colt N1. Kinda full circle. Like many of you I steer friends toward basic gear so they don’t spend money on stuff they don’t need.
I cannot believe that we’re now comparing snake oil to products that offer an advantage in manipulating the firearm. Just because someone is a satan-hander and can’t appreciate that function, or someone tries it and doesn’t like it, or has concerns about the safety of it, doesn’t mean it doesn’t offer something in the way of improving the manipulations.
actually, yes I can.
Rob. I’ll trade you one of my CTRs, black, FDE or OD, for a MOE any color and BAD lever! I’m not wrong handed like Trident!
But hey, if he has a high post count it must be fact that BAD Levers are junk… It has absolutely nothing to do with one not actually having any experience at all, it has to do with how it looks slathered in oil and posted in the pic thread :rolleyes:
To have at least one sentence on topic, I’ve always used standard springs, but now I’m using the A5’s and they really are a good product.
AFGs at first, I couldn’t stand. It took a while but now I am having a hard time using anything else. I have an LMT RE, BAD Lever, KAC vert grip, Gear Sector handstop, etc., up for trade I. E E&E for a KAC handstop.
I’ve been using the Gear Sector vert grip too without much luck. I used the Tango Down for a few years and it was fine and I should never have messed with it. Now, it’s hard to use anything but the AFG.
Many guys don’t like it at first. What I found works for me, besides stippling, it using the AFG 2 with that A2 nub turned around so that gap between it and the front is smaller. My index finger goes in front of the AFG, my middle and ring finger between the front and A2 style nub and my little finger behind the nub. Works perfect for me and gives me more control, but it took some time. I just wish they’d release an AFG III that didn’t have the rear 1/3rd or so since I don’t use any of that space.
I’m hoping I have some luck finding the KAC handstop as I think that will be a good compromise. The Gear Sector is more for using in front of your hand or in the webbing between your thumb and index finger, according to Jason. It just doesn’t feel right for me as it’s not large enough to pull back against. The KAC seems about right, plus I can get them if I run any of the slick rails later on.
There are a lot of things out there that really don’t do much good and are just a waste of money. The T2 buffer comes to mind as does that Mako stock that absorbs recoil. How much advantage is there to a monolithic upper (not talking about barrel changes, just being monolithic)? I’ve owned one and I didn’t see it but that doesn’t mean I’ll tell run my uneducated mouth to anyone that will listen, make a fool of myself and get called on it and continue to do it anyway… It means it just didn’t work for me and I can only say that because I gave it a real effort, just like I did the piston guns a while back. They do nothing for me.
There is no good reason for a lot of things we do, but sometimes it hard to leave well enough alone. For me, if I don’t see an actual advantage in some way, it’s gone.
You can see how these AFG’s are set up differently in the pics. The first works best for me with a c-clamp type grip from the side with my thumb over the top or forward above the left side rail. The tips of my fingers just go past the right side of the AFG when looking from the rear of the gun. I can see how uncomfortable it would be if you try to use the AFG as the main contact point with an underhand grip. It just wasn’t designed for that from my understanding. I’ve seen a couple of the many that don’t like it post videos or pictures, and many times they’re using a complete underhand grip. I can see how it would be awkward at first.
John is the smaller AFG the II?
Yes sir it is. It allows me to get a much better grip that the AFG 1 because I can get the tips of my fingers just past it and grab onto the side. The AFG 1’s wider area in the front does not allow this and I can’t grip it nearly as tight.
Also, the AFG 2 with the A2 tab ( for lack of a better term) has a tighter gap than the AFG 1, basically pinching my fingers in there and it feels very secure.
When I first tried the AFG I wasn’t into it and I tried different ways. I always dedicate at least a couple months to a product (as long as it has some good reviews and looks like it may be a good choice for me) and I tried it a few different ways. I decided to try the AFG 2 and when I turned the nub around it was a noticeable difference.
Now, I’m having a hard time finding anything else that works as well. I’m hoping the KAC handstop does it for me as I don’t want to go back to vert grips as I’ll be in the same position if I ever start using the slick rails.
Yeah I tried the AFG. And I had to change so much around I just scrapped it. My sling was okay but my light was the issue I just did not have the room. I sold it on EE here. I think its important to try new things out. I also have a huge paw. The non QD Tango Down stubby worked awesome for me and now the MOE VFG works great. The fact that its cheap and light rocks too! I’m still in search of the right light and mount combination. I’d like to try one of the Mount n Slot set ups for my MOE handguards.
Who are you referring to?
I wouldn’t state anyone by name as that would be rude… But let’s just say ther’s a few people of a small group that seem to have very strong opinions on things that they admittedly don’t have experience with, which can get people pointed in wrong directions.
Is one thing for people to say they tried something and it just wasn’t their thing but it may work for another, and it’s a completely different thing to come on a public forum and bash a product stating it’s junk but have no experience to back it up as we have been seeing quite often.
I don’t know about anyone else, but when I see that stuff it really bothers me because I know some guy browsing the forum who may not even be a member will read that, look anther post count or member status and assume they are correct. I hear it all the time. It’s amazing to watch how people act over a tiny accessory and the things they’ll say about them.
I don’t speak for anyone else, but I will never talk about a product I don’t have extensive experience with and haven’t given a serious effort.
I don’t much care for EoTechs. I have owned one. I have many rounds down range with one. Do you ever hear me say they’re pieces of crap and only Aimpoints, Acogs and S&Bs should be purchased if you’re a serious shooter? No, you don’t because I know my opinion is just that, an opinion and I can only give my experience with how it worked for me. Mine wasn’t crap, but it didn’t serve me as well as my Aimpoints.
When I see someone completely bashing a product and when they’re asked about their experience they either skirt the issue or say they have little to no experience with it, I know I speak for a good number of people when I say at their credibility drops tremendously in my eyes. I’ve seen and heard others say the same.
OK, so allow me to offer this observation about our precious “evil black rifle”……
(It used to be the “Ford”… any color, as long as it’s black, right? Now we have FDE, OD green, Coyote tan, you name it. Pink, anyone?)
Wikepedia quote: “the first sale of AR-15s were made to Malaysia on 30 September 1959 with Colt’s manufacture of their first 300 AR-15s in December 1959…”
Which means this platform has, effectively!, been around for 50 years. Think about that.
In my modest opinion, what makes this weapon system so attractive, besides it’s simplicity and effectiveness, is it’s modularity. The fact it can be outfitted and adapted to most any situation at hand within 500 m.
Another thing to seriously consider is what has changed in the last 50 years in regards to general manufacturing methods (CAD, plastics, ergonomics etc etc) and tactical/training approaches.
Just think what a game changer the rail-hand guard represents - the amount of crap we can attach to it……and someone has to make all that stuff.
So it only makes sense we are going to be offered an almost unlimited number of gizmos, gadgets and toys, bells and whistles, some better than others. But all supposedly designed to adapt the rifle to your mission, your need, your liking, your body-mechanics.
From a marketing- and consumer point of view an ideal merchandising platform with no end in sight, really.
Fair to say therefore it allows itself almost to be an extension of your individuality, no? The ultimate American rifle.
I mean, look at us bickering about springs, triggers, what makes a modification valuable or snake-oil…hey, if it works for you, it’s good-for you. Because we’re all different, with different bodies and abilities.
Bottom line: once the marketing onanation has worn off, real world usage will determine real quick what works, and what does not. Which is what we should (and do!) look at and talk about, and makes this the forum it is.
And we’re under no obligation to stick it in or on, our rifle if we don’t want to, no?
I thought we were supposed to be talking about springs here 
Anyway Ive switched to springco springs in 2008 after I found out my USGI springs from BCM were lasted a whopping average 3k rounds before it had to be replaced. I believe there is enough feedback on this site that proves they arent just snake oil and do last quite a bit longer.
How can you tell it’s time to replace the spring - obviously you don’t want to wait for feeding problems.
Measure your springs. I found this with a Google search:
They need to either buy BCM lowers or BCM RE’s. The MOE’s are TIGHT on them (not that it really matters though).
C4
Measure it, or just pull it between 3k-5k.
C4
OK, so measure it, “Carbine spring lengths should be between 10 1/16 up to 11 1/4 inches”, or pull sometime between 3-5K.
Kinda like -oilchange…3 months or 3000 miles…
Sounds good, thanks…
This seems like a very good opportunity to explain the benefit of a good aftermarket spring, like the blue Sprinco that you said you used in another thread. You can let a quality upper go for 20+ thousand rounds without cleaning (see the Pat Rogers BCM “Filthy 14” test in SWAT), but you’re supposed to change the CS spring 4-6 times in that period?
I don’t advocate that people who are relatively new to the AR or who have a poor understanding of mechanics and physics start going for color-coded springs, but there is upside to it if you understand it.
No, you do not change out CS springs that often. Typically I would do it every 20K (on the low end side), but honestly speaking, it should last for 100,000 rounds.
I did a general guidline for springs and buffer weights for those that do no undertand what is going on in their weapon.
C4
Then I was confused by what you meant by “measure it or pull it at 3-5k”.
Sorry. If the SS buffer spring is past 5K, just pull it and put a new one in. If you do not know how many rounds you have fired through the SS spring, then measure it.
C4