First, let me open this thread by saying I am looking for educated and firsthand responses only. So if you’ve never “jocked up” for non-square range activities, like I haven’t, please just read the responses of those who have…
I am intensely curious, due to some recent reading, if our finest elite soldiers routinely leave on missions without body armor?
Policemen seem to wear it as religiously as they wear their duty pistol, yet I often see, and read, of our elite warriors not wearing it at all.
I’d like to understand the reasonings why one would chose to leave it vs. wear it.
What I have noticed lately is many guys are wearing less or no body armor in hard cars. Reason: If the blast can blow through the side of a hardened vehicle, the kevlar and plates just make it harder for your buddies to carry your injured/dead body.
Wearing a tac vest is easily noticed and may put you in more danger. (at least where I am)
Do I keep it in the vehicle, yes, with no mag pouches or anything- everything is in my “go bag”.
Occasionally will leave armor for pure recon missions. Stand alone plates and carriers are occasionally used to provide protection without undue soft-armor weight, as well as a platform for minimal gear.
DA will always be in full (mission profile) kit, as contact is imminent.
Most snipers hate body armor, for many reasons, but especially the reduction in ability to stalk/conceal.
ETA-Many organizations have different rules/outlooks on the employment of armor.
I have a level III-a point blank that I wore for law enf. duties and driving armored truck and I must agree it was damn hot and uncomfortable during the summer months and somewhat heavy( 7 pounds). But I never stopped wearing it after one of our officers was shot and killed by a 16 yr. old punk kid. I must firmly say wear it all the time for civilian use but the military has some obvious reasons why they leave it behind. I guess it comes down to the enviroment your operating in.
I wear a RAV on some missions (mounted patrols, etc.), but more often than not I wear a regular Paraclete plate carrier with soft armor backing. Mobility kills a lot of people. It’s scary to think of all the shit Uncle Sam requires soldiers to wear. They look like the kid off of “A Christmas Story” when he’s all bundled up in his winter suit. I wear Paraclete Level IV plates in both rigs.
Unless I am on SR or something I always wear some kind of armor. I don’t see anyone rolling without armor in populated areas.
I am still a big proponent of plates in my carrier especialy the ceramic type to up the level of protection. For some odd reason a silly rumor started in the mid 90’s that a round could ricoche off the plate and go up in to your lower jaw. That rumor became so wide spread that within a few weeks nearly every housing officer and guard at AT systems I worked with had taken his plate out. Ever heard that one.
I’ve heard it, but I thought it was from the hard steel rounded trauma plates that used (thinking early 1990’s) to be in LE soft concealable armorer. Now all companies that i know of have soft trauma plates…
Jack
When I’m on duty as a reserve deputy sheriff (in NC reserves or auxiliaries are the same as the regular guys, same basic and in-service training, except we work when we want to, for free) I always ALWAYS wear a Paraclete IIIA covert vest with soft trauma plate. It’s hot in summer and itchy all the time for some reason, but it beats getting shot or seriously killed. Not all of my colleagues are so enthusiastic about body armor, or seat belts for that matter. Either product only gets buckled on when they think they might need them. This even though (1) the only line of duty death in our dept’s history probably would have been a minor injury if he’d been belted in and (2) the Florida trooper who didn’t wear a vest last year because it’s just too hot, and died by means of one .25 ACP center mass from somebody who didn’t want to get a ticket that day. But seatbelts and vests are too uncomfortable. I only work here, I don’t ask questions.
In the trunk of whoever’s car I’m riding in goes not just my AR case but also my Level IV ceramic plates in a Tactical Assault Gear carrier. Well, aren’t you supposed to have armor that stops whatever YOU carry? They weigh more than I want to know so they’re not an everyday thing. I’ve only put the plates on once in earnest, for a search warrant, and a couple hours inside them made me glad I hit the gym now and then. I train with plates sometimes when shooting rifles in the backyard range. When I can afford it, I’ll go with the lighter Eagle Industries carrier since I now know I don’t need acres of PALS space, just a mag shingle or two.
I wear a IIIA vest with a IMPAC ST trauma plate and a soft plate. The IMPAC ST is a great piece of gear. Here’s a link to the demo video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeowmnioCKQ
Thanks for the link S-1 very informative video. Now that I have seen that plate in action, I must have one. My wife will probaly curse you for making me spend some money. So many toys such little time.
I’m a cop and I wear mine every time I go to work, whether it be while on patrol or doing task force stuff under a raid t-shirt. I’m in the desert and it does get damn hot during the summer but I’d rather sweat like a pig than bleed like one.
“I wear a IIIA vest with a IMPAC ST trauma plate and a soft plate. The IMPAC ST is a great piece of gear.”
Ditto. The only thing I don’t like about the IMPAC plate is that when your vest rides up, the top of the plate hits you in the chin every time you look down (i.e. when you’re trying to find the cheeto you just dropped on the floorboard).
When I was on duty the body armor was always on. It was also Dept policy. When in uniform you wear armor. In fact it was like, " gun, badge, armor, on duty don’t be caught with two out of three". You could be reprimanded for not wearing it and would be sent to retreive it. I personally don’t understand those who don’t in a LE setting. Columbia, SC can be a pretty miserable place in July and August, especially in a black poly uniform, duty boots and unmpteen pounds of duty belt, radio, sidearm, and armor. But it’s alot more comfortable than dead or shot. It was also policy to wear it anytime on the range, and after qualifying with some folks I saw why! I don’t have any Mil experience so I can’t comment on what they do or don’t do., and why that might be.
Same policy we had in my battalion in the 101st. Big problem we had though (during my last tour) is the high ranking slick sleeve morons logging their first tour would demand ALL of the IBA suppliments be worn, which literally KILLED any mobility and freedom of movement. It got to the point where I for one would rather not wear anything at all than a full IBA with EVERYTHING on it. Just the vest, + SAPIs, + ACH for me, thanks.
They weigh more than I want to know so they’re not an everyday thing. I’ve only put the plates on once in earnest, for a search warrant, and a couple hours inside them made me glad I hit the gym now and then. I train with plates sometimes when shooting rifles in the backyard range. When I can afford it, I’ll go with the lighter Eagle Industries carrier since I now know I don’t need acres of PALS space, just a mag shingle or two.
