Paterno and Penn State

[chadbag]

Actually, we might not want to rule that out just yet. Check this out: http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/1...dal/?hpt=hp_t2

The Roman Catholic Church wants to lend their expertise in confronting sexual abuse scandals to Penn State.

Well, they have had a good head start in trying to figure it out and know lots of the wrong things to do. Experience is one way of becoming an expert. Kind of the reason we train with our firearms too.

[montanadave]

Seriously, dude, it's called irony. As in the tradition of classical Greek tragedy.

And your inability to appreciate the irony and the tragedy of this whole ****ing debacle is tragic in itself.

Get some air.

[chadbag]

Seriously, dude, it's called irony. As in the tradition of classical Greek tragedy.

And your inability to appreciate the irony and the tragedy of this whole ****ing debacle is tragic in itself.

Get some air.

Ah yes, a master.

I bow down to you. He that is so full of irony in every single post he makes that he is the god of irony.

And based on the responses of most people who would rather let their anger overcome their ability to be rational and objective, I rather think I appreciate the tragedy much more than most here.

[SteyrAUG]

Exactly that.

Based on emotional (over)reaction a guy lost his job. He was not the predator. But people seem to be equating him with one.

Based on accounts of his life, he was an extremely caring and respectful and decent person. He deserved better.

I don't think it is emotion or over reaction. They guy FAILED to stop a child molester. Now that doesn't make him a predator, but it also doesn't mean he is innocent of any wrong doing.

If the accounts of his life you reference are true, then he certainly had the capacity to know what should have been done and failed to do it. I think he is guilty of placing a higher priority on a school sports program than a child that was being sexually exploited by a member of that organization.

I also suspect if it was your kid, you'd feel a little differently about the whole thing.

[montanadave]

Ah yes, a master.

I bow down to you. He that is so full of irony in every single post he makes that he is the god of irony.

And based on the responses of most people who would rather let their anger overcome their ability to be rational and objective, I rather think I appreciate the tragedy much more than most here.

Well, I see you've grasped sarcasm. That's a start.

As for Sandusky and Penn State's complicity in his heinous acts, I'm quite content to let it play out. But I'm not gonna hold my breath. The current scramble amongst the cast of characters in this sordid affair to lawyer up and cover their ass insures that Sandusky's last victim will likely be the truth.

Given that Penn State spent five years fighting efforts of the public to learn how much they were paying Paterno, a football coach at a state university, methinks the steady diet of big bucks from their vaunted football program has dulled their appetite for the truth.

[OldState]

I don't think it is emotion or over reaction. They guy FAILED to stop a child molester. Now that doesn't make him a predator, but it also doesn't mean he is innocent of any wrong doing.

Do you even read the previous posts or have you even looked at any of the updates on this case? Sounds like you and many others made up your mind on day one and then went in the tank.

Given that Penn State spent five years fighting efforts of the public to learn how much they were paying Paterno, a football coach at a state university, methinks the steady diet of big bucks from their vaunted football program has dulled their appetite for the truth.

This is an absurd statement. Your upset that their "big buck" program tried to hide the fact they were paying their legendary coach less than their school president? (the other $500k came from outside endorsements).

Yeah, definitely a conspiracy there.

For a coach of Paterno's stature the going rate is $4M. He never asked for more money and gave over $5M back to the school when he sign his 5 year contract.

[OldState]

Has anyone acknowledged that they are NOT reading the full record of testimony???

ESPN just did last night. Their legal analyst explained to the ignorant lynch mob exactly what a Grand Jury Presentment is and that they can include or omit any testimony they wish.

They usually include just enough to explain why the are bringing an indictment. Being that Paterno and McQueary were NOT indicted, they had no reason to share all the details.

[Evil Bert]

Has anyone acknowledged that they are NOT reading the full record of testimony???

ESPN just did last night. Their legal analyst explained to the ignorant lynch mob exactly what a Grand Jury Presentment is and that they can include or omit any testimony they wish.

They usually include just enough to explain why the are bringing an indictment. Being that Paterno and McQueary were NOT indicted, they had no reason to share all the details.

Yes I will acknowledge that on the condition that you acknowledge that the presentment clearly shows that it is reasonable to believe that Paterno had knowledge to some degree that Sandusky was/is a predator.

The presentment has multiple witnesses stating that Paterno was told about it. So unless you or anyone else believes it is some kind of conspiracy theory and they are all out to get Joe, the Presentment shows he had knowledge and failed to act.

How much knowledge, clearly not enough to adamantly face charges. However, as the school does not have to follow the same level of scrutiny that the courts do, they felt that there was sufficient reason to reasonably think that Paterno as well as all the others had enough knowledge to do something about it and notify the police. Which they failed to do.

I am a very strong supporter of the 4th and 5th amendments. With that said, I am neither judge, jury, prosecutor, etc. Therefore I neither have duty or responsibility to reserve judgment on Paterno or anyone else. I have the right to form my opinion based on the information I have. As do you. You may choose to ignore facts already released and known to everyone, I choose not to. If during the trial, new facts come out and I change my mind, then fine. But I cannot see any facts coming out in the trial that will show Paterno had no knowledge whatsoever about the sexual assault of young children.

Especially after Paterno said himself in a statement that he regrets not doing more to stop it. That tells me and it should tell you that he knew enough of what was going on that he could have done a lot more. Yet he failed to do it.

There is no harder evidence that Paterno's own words.

[OldState]

Not ignoring facts, just acknowledging there are very little. Call me crazy but I like to reserve my opinions, especially when the charges are this great, until I do have all the facts. Not just 2% of the story.

So you will acknowledge that you have based your opinion on very few facts and mostly speculation, and I will acknowledge that based on very little factual knowledge and mostly speculation it may appear Paterno and McQueary covered this up?

Seems reasonable.

You realize that you are also acknowledging that you don't care or need to gather all the facts before you pass judgement on people. That doesn't sound like someone who would be a fan of the 5th Amendment to me.

[SteyrAUG]

Do you even read the previous posts or have you even looked at any of the updates on this case? Sounds like you and many others made up your mind on day one and then went in the tank.

No, honestly the whole thing sickens me and I'm trying to avoid it.

Are you now saying that Paterno had no knowledge of the incidents, that nobody reported it to him?