I attend approximately two carbine courses a month. Over the last few years, I’ve seen some funny weapons, support gear, and end users. My favorite:
In 2003, I attended a 3-day class in SoCal by ITTS. As usual with most classes, there was one student who was ill-prepared and frequently causing the course to stop. He was a civilian security guard with a brand-spanking new, shiny clean Blackhawk 4-mag subload (in “Tactical black”). To give you an idea of his skills: The whole line was prone and had already reloaded and continued firing with their new magazine, while he was still trying to figure out how to open (for the first time) the velcro/fastex buckle on his hip.
Well, for the upteenth time his weapon malfunctioned- This time due to an old beat up GI 30rd mag that was beyond repair. Instructor Scotty Reitz told him to ditch the magazine, explaining how mags don’t last forever and should be considered disposable. The student insisted on keeping it and started to put it in his pocket to take home and save. It may be the fact that CA civilians can’t buy them anymore, but who knows his rationale for keeping it. After much fuss, Scott grabbed the bad mag and threw it as hard as he could over the cliff of the range (Eagle’s Nest area of Angeles Range). I’ll never forget the look of horror on the student’s face- You’d think the mag was a winning million dollar lottery ticket.
I’ll never forgot that guy’s face- I still crack up everytime I think of that incident.
In 2003 with the AWB ban being still in effect I would treat a pre-ban magazine like a million dollar lottery ticket too.
I live in a permanent AWB state and I treat my pre-ban lower and magazines like gold(meaning I do not drag them behind my car or throw them off cliffs.)
Now even if a pre-ban magzine does not work I believe you can swap it with a new one from C-Products.
Now with that said I understand that magazines are “disposable” to a degree.
Maybe I would laugh if it did not happen to me, but if it did happen to me, I would not be amused.
they are disposable items, as they are cheap and easy to replace.
unless you are from one of the assault weapon ban states then they are not disposable items. as long as the body is good the rest can be refurbished. brownells makes a tool designed just to straighten the feed lips. followers, floor plates and sprgs. can all be replaced.
i feel the same way as you do about my pre ban stuff. we don’t want to end up on the wrong side of the law. c products emailed me that they do not have date stamps on their mags.
i recently purchased 8 more pre ban mags for the collection. the owner felt he would rather buy new than overhaul thses. i don’t care about the finish and have no problems installing new parts in them and bringing them back to life. i build a good magazine.
Chris “The Flasher” has to be my funniest class story.
How can you top a guy who rips his pants from his JOHNSON to his knees (Twice in one class!) and runs around the entire day in basically his underwear? Plus he shot damn awesome to boot.
Our fighting doctrine has held that magazines are disposable… therefore the reason for the cheap construction – we are not at all like some nations who issue a handful of mags to a conscript and expect him to hold on the them for a career.
Back when I was a young man (Molly Hatchet was a new group) we even got a strange magazine to test: It was disposable in every sence… it could not be reloaded, it came preloaded with ammo, but for the spring and feed lips was all plastic and used a coil spring that had to be “wound up” with a zip-pull ring and lanyard at the bottom of the magazine before use.
So have I, but I changed my pants ASAP so I wouldn’t have my balls hanging out all day. Chris did it twice in 3 days and opted not to change, hence the hilarity. Every time we go to the range I give him the business over it. If he’s not shooting well, inevitably someone will suggest he should be “balls out” for best efficiency.
Besides that, LAV giving Dinger the business during class was worth a chuckle or two. The quote’s in your signature, Paul, give me a laugh every time I read them.
Not a “class” story, but I watched a guy fumble around trying to reload his pistol during a 3 gun match once, and after roughly 3 minutes he figured out the spare magazine he had was for an altogether different gun. That was so embarrassingly painful that I thought it would never end. Like a Ben Stiller movie.
Don’t know if you are being facetious or not, but carefully consider this.
Most everyone will commit some kind of act of omission, error or faux pas in any given class.
From my standpoint, bringing this to the attention of the entire class provides me with a teaching point (actually, emphasizing a previous teaching point).
I can bring humiliation to an art form (Right Harv?) not because i want to lower the malefactors self esteem, but because if we can’t do it and have fun at someones expense, we lose the value of that potential teaching point.
Everyone will feel this at some point.
OK, not everyone. I have a rule of 100. If i tell you to do the same thing one hundred times and you can’t function in the environment, you probably won’t do it at 112, 346 or 1197.
In other words, you are a non hacker. However, as long as it is a non safety issue, you can remain and have fun- but individual instruction will cease.
Self esteem is a non starter in a fight. If people can’t hang in training, they are certainly not going to do any better in the two way rifle range.
Go to gunskul with a clear mind and be ready to learn. Accept that fact that- Euro gun makers claims aside- there is no perfection, and you will make mistakes. Learn from the mistakes and enjoy the ride, but also understand that attending one class- or one hundred- won’t necessarily make you a gunfighter.
I see alot shooters take instructors input (designed to help them) in a negative way and become insulted. I can only think that a lot of people are not used to people telling them what they are doing is wrong or that they are a perfect shooter.
When I was a cop, my partner (Mike) and I both helped run the range. One of the officers was having issues with his duty pistol and it was obvious that the problem was due to one magazine. During a cease-fire, Mike walked over and asked to see the magazine. It was a really cheesy aftermarket magazine that obviously wasn’t suitable for duty use.
Mike held the magazine out and when the officer reached for it, he “accidentally” dropped it on the ground. As the officer started to bend down and pick it up, “CRUNCH!” Mike stomped it flat with his big 'ole steel-toed boot! “Oops,” he said. “I guess you’re going to need a new magazine. This time buy one from Sig.” The officer didn’t think it was funny but I laughed so hard I thought I was going to wet my pants!
Originally Posted by Pat_Rogers
Don’t know if you are being facetious or not, but carefully consider this.
Most everyone will commit some kind of act of omission, error or faux pas in any given class.
From my standpoint, bringing this to the attention of the entire class provides me with a teaching point (actually, emphasizing a previous teaching point).
I can bring humiliation to an art form (Right Harv?) not because i want to lower the malefactors self esteem, but because if we can’t do it and have fun at someones expense, we lose the value of that potential teaching point.
Everyone will feel this at some point.
OK, not everyone. I have a rule of 100. If i tell you to do the same thing one hundred times and you can’t function in the environment, you probably won’t do it at 112, 346 or 1197.
In other words, you are a non hacker. However, as long as it is a non safety issue, you can remain and have fun- but individual instruction will cease.
Self esteem is a non starter in a fight. If people can’t hang in training, they are certainly not going to do any better in the two way rifle range.
Go to gunskul with a clear mind and be ready to learn. Accept that fact that- Euro gun makers claims aside- there is no perfection, and you will make mistakes. Learn from the mistakes and enjoy the ride, but also understand that attending one class- or one hundred- won’t necessarily make you a gunfighter.
Amen Brother…
Hell, Half the reason I go to class is to mercilessly pick on some poor Dump Bastard who pooches a Tac reload in between drills. (Opps, forgot, that was me… )
Big Boy rules in class roll over to the real world I figure. if your gonna get all Girlie cause some one ripped on ya a little bit, it’s gonna be a shock when some one’s trying to kill ya…
As to funny stories… there was a guy in a class a few years ago who showed up with a 550 cord Sling. We all looked at him like he had a third arm growing out the side of his head. he was graciously offered several sling hook ups from the Instructor, but he shrugged it off. Said he would be fine. Guess what he was NOT using at the start of day 2… And he was a pretty good shooter.
Oh yeah, one of Cpt Kens classes. about 2 years ago. He finally took either you or some one else’s offer to replace the 550 cord with a real sling. And I thought I was a frugal cheap Bastard…
[quote]Don’t know if you are being facetious or not, but carefully consider this.
Most everyone will commit some kind of act of omission, error or faux pas in any given class.[/qote]
I’m only one-quarter serious. I’m ready to make mistakes, so long as they are NOT safety-related. Generally someone only has to tell me something about thirty times before I pick up on it.
Mainly I need to stop procrastinating and just go to a class. FIRE Institute is local to me, and from what I’ve heard they have a decent rep.
Don’t have any funny AR class stories, but I’ll always remember the time a local police officer pegged a “hostage” right between the eyes during an informal night of IPSC shooting. When he came off the firing line we all had those little round stickers on our foreheads.
I’m ready to make mistakes, so long as they are NOT safety-related. Generally someone only has to tell me something about thirty times before I pick up on it.