So as the question states…
I’ll use myself as an example;
My rifle currently has a Daniel Defense rail on it.
But current offerings from Midwest Industries, along with a desire to shed some size/weight off my current setup has got me kind of horny for one of their offerings, not to mention the price/features are right.
I think it goes without saying, I’m not going to throw away proven reliability for a slightly lighter, slightly slimmer setup.
And I don’t mean to be insulting but “back in the day” if I recall MI had more of a rep for being “light duty” range stuff.
So…I know this is probably a bit of a subjective question, but from a durability standpoint, versus some of the other manufacturers out there that make products you can run over with a truck or throw out of an aircraft and not have an issue… How does the MI rail offerings hold up?
Seriously.
Has MI or anyone accidentally or intentionally tried to do some serious damage to these rails?
How does it hold up?
I guess to make it simple, if you were deploying tomorrow and/or this is the last rifle you could own, is this rail “battle ready” or more for light duty/range work?
I’m not really worried about how may rounds you’ve got through a rifle with the rail mounted (unless the thing started loosening up…),
I’m talking about “I dropped it getting it out of my car or off a really high shelf onto a cement floor/pavement and it did/didn’t break”
or “Some dumbass didn’t see my rifle by their car at the range and ran it over”
or “I fell off a mountain with this rail and it did/didn’t break”,
or “I was on an ATV/truck and the rifle fell off at a high rate of speed and then my buddy ran it over and it did/didn’t break”
or “I’m a high-speed oper8tor and dropped it fast roping out of a helicopter and it did/didn’t break”
Or “I stuck it in a vise and tried to bend it and it did/didn’t break”.
That sort of info.
Under hard use, or the “oh shit” moments, how does it hold up.
I tried this MI offering on an upper a couple of years ago…light, but the mounting system concerned me. Sure doesn’t seem like it would do well under hard use. The two two screw mount on the bottom seems like it would have weak points. I sold the upper, so I never tried running it through a carbine course, etc. I have no “hard use” anecdotal examples though. Their new hand guards all use what appears to be the same mounting system. I have DD, LaRue and BCM KMR’s on other rifles, they seem considerably more robust in their mounting system.
No. MI’s new hand guards have new features in their attachment method, preventing the rail from rotating, sliding forward, or over pinching the barrel nut. Seemingly more robust, and appears to solve the issues many people, myself included, had with the SSK gen 2.
I can’t answer your question about deliberately damaging it, but my (and some of my customer’s) experience with MI’s first two generations of rails does not inspire confidence. I also don’t like rails that clamp the rail system opposite the top rail, spreading it - structurally, that’s just bad design.
If I had the money to buy that rail, and wanted to shed weight and width, I’d buy an ALG EMR M-LOK V1, V2 or V3 for less. I have ten of them now. They give up nothing to the MI rail except front sling QDs, cost less, you have more modularity selecting between V1, V2 and V3, and the rail screws directly into the barrel nut.
I spent $110 shipped on 12" rails from ALG, plus $20 for a modular rail section, there’s no way I would consider the MI offering at the same price, let alone more.
That’s a pretty high standard. I wouldn’t gamble with MI rails for that standard, even though I like them and the gen3 appears to be a significant upgrade in the mounting method. For the standard above, I would really want an LMT MRP, since there’s no possible way its forearm can come off. I think KAC has a similar setup but I’m not as familiar with their product line. The Colt 901 and 6940 would also be good options. Below that monolithic standard, I would have the most confidence in Geissele or Daniel Defense, although I’m not in love with DD’s mounting methods but they seem to be well proven in use.
On the SSM series, and the preceeding generation - I haven’t tried the G3 he’s asking about - I saw that they had a lot of flex and some slight rotational wiggle, which seemed to be all between the barrel nut and rail. The bottom clamping screws would slightly bend the threaded section they tightened into before they stopped turning. It was similar to the Troy TRX rail, and I see why Troy abandoned the bottom-clamping design. As a budget rail, it was good enough. We still sold them, but I didn’t consider it a bomb-proof or combat-ready design - it was an affordable tube-rail replacement for plastic handguards on Bushmasters and Stags.
He’s asking if he should replace a Daniel Defense rail with the next generation, and while my eyeball analysis is that it seems to be a better design, I can’t imagine it’s equal to or better than the ALG EMR design, and I would bet money that Daniel Defense, BCM, Geissele, and all the other $200+ rails are really superior in materials and design. I like MI products just fine, for the record, their KeyMod rail covers were my favorite, but I was not overly impressed with their rails, and they’d really have to step up in a major way to impress me with their next iteration.
I never have liked that bottom squeeze clamping setup. I had a Troy with that clamping system before I knew anything. But after awhile I realized that the design is not optimal.
The suggestion above, ALG EMR, is a very good one. It’s a tough rail even if you don’t consider the low price. I put one on my ‘test’ rifle and am very impressed. In fact, I may just leave it on there.
Otherwise I like Daniel Defense (I have one), and Geissele for super tough rails. I have a couple KMR rails which are very nice, stiff, and light weight, but I wouldn’t want to run over one with a vehicle. Same for the Noveske NSR which is a very nice rail, but I don’t know if it would survive the run over with a vehicle test.
I’d take the DD, Geissele, KMR, NSR and the ALG rails over the MIs I’ve seen. Maybe the Gen3 is better but I’m not sure.
I’m just an everyday guy, so you may get better feedback from the pros on this site.
I have a gen 2 SSK hand guard on my precision build. I don’t have a ton of rounds through that upper, but when compared with my primary/training upper with a KMR, the SSK mounting method does not inspire confidence. I would ditch it if I didn’t have a perm attached muzzle device (and already changed the hand guard out once). The Gen 3 alleviates my primary concerns of a crappy rotation limiting system and only friction keeping it from sliding off the front. I’d still rather go with a proven design until the gen 3 matures/is tested though.
If you have a DD, and like DD, have you considered their slim rail? I like the ones I’ve handled, and a shooter was running one at the Frank Proctor class I took this summer and loved it.
I’ve been looking at rails to replace some older 4 rail designs I have. Once these came out, I decided to switch out a couple of them. While I still have, my son anyways a DD lite rail and a CMR, I don’t feel handicapped with the Gen 3. Mine are solid, no slop or worry about breakage. I also hear of a large east coast PD that will be using some 11.5 uppers with a MI rail. --and they do get used often and shot a lot.
I just mentioned this rifle in a recent SBR thread. I replaced a KAC URX2 MID with a MI SSM M-LOK rail because I wanted to save weight, have a smaller diameter, and switch to MLOK. The MI seemed like a decent option. I have no regrets. It’s very sturdy and light. I have zero concerns about the mounting method.
Their Wedge-Lok rail is pretty sweet, but for the same weight/price I could have a Geissele, so… not sure.
This is very interesting. Can you elaborate more on what makes the ALG offerings that much better than the MI stuff?
Honestly, when I saw them the other day, I was like “Oh it’s a Troy redesigned for M-lok. Meh.”
Well, if you want to shave some profile/weight, it’s still cheaper then buying an ENTIRE new upper…
Considering you could also re-sell the previous rail and negate most of the cost.
That’s my point. I would never go through the hassle of buying a new rail, installing a new rail, and selling the old rail to lose 3 ounces. The money and effort would be better spent shooting the gun.
