Which rail, I'm torn between 3...........

AR/M4 AR General Discussion
1

I can get any of them for about the same price and there are really just two main differences. The troy and Midwest Industries clamp on and don’t require removal of gas system, and as such they are mid length rails that would leave my front FSB. The Yankee Hill is a rifle length and would extend over my gas block meaning a new low profile gas block and cleaner looking front end with longer rail.

I’m torn on which way to go. The clamp on ones seem much easier and much less work, but am just not sure they are really a good long term sturdy option. At the same time, I read posts that question YHM quality compared to troy, dd, etc.

I currently have a 12 inch Yankee Hill rail to install that I picked up yesterday, but after sleeping on it and thinking about how much is involved in getting it installed, I’m back thinking about one of the clamp on ones again. So what do you think? What should I do? Give me some additional input to help me make this decision and move on. Sorry for the stupid post.

The Midwest Industries Mid length clamp on one:
http://www.midwestindustriesinc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=72

The Troy mid length clamp on version:
http://www.troyind.com/MRFRails.html

The YHM Lite Rails: (scroll down page)
http://www.yankeehillmachine.com/store/forearms.html

Rifle this will go on:

2

First of all, its not a stupid post. A number of folks face this same issue, your not the only one.

I cant say much about the other handguards, but I have had Troy rails in the past and continue to use them. I like the two piece design, though fitting can be a bear. Sometimes you put them on and they’re good and straight, other times after installation they’re out of line with the upper receiver. It takes patience in fitting a handguard. To insure a good straight fit, Ive resorted to filing my barrel nut in certain spots(not alot mind you, just a little). Once done, its just a matter of basically holding the rail in place while tightening the screws in the clamp. At least periodically checking the alignment while tightening, to insure your not tightening it under a bind or out of alignment.

So, dont think you’ll completely miss all kinds of work with the clamp on design. Though it probably isnt as involve as removing the FSB and gas tube etc… etc…, it will possibly pose some more work for you than just popping off your plastic handguards and screwing on the clamp of a FF handguard/rail.

These are just my experiences, others may have different results. I figured it might help you in your decision to hear from someone who has used one of those that you speak of.

For the picking of the rail for particular reasons, thats up to you. Beyond that point, Im sure folks round here will help you through the installation process of whatever kind of rail you go with.

Good luck,
Seth H.

3

Thanks Seth. I appreciate the input.

My last AR had the 12" YHM lite rail on it and it worked well, but it also came with it on it, so I didn’t have to fiddle with the install. Unfortunately, while we have a shop that sells the stuff, we don’t have a good option for install really, so I’ll be doing it myself, which means having to buy the various tools/wrenches/blocks, etc.

I picked up the YHM and endcap for it yesterday, but they don’t sell MI or Troy to compare, so I’m shooting blind here. My plastic hand guards were very easy to pop off with no tools so I have a good idea of what’s underneath, but I don’t know how I feel about trying to remove the FSB, and reinstall either it with the sight and lugs cut off or another one. I’ve been told that you should press the taper pins in rather than use a punch to remove and install, so that is part of my hesitance I guess. If using a punch is really no problem, then my thoughts were to remove the FSB, cut it down and paint it up and then reintall under the YHM free float.

That said, there is a fair amount of work and cost involved in my getting the YHM installed versus just taking the dremel to the delta ring assembly and then clamping on the troy or MI rails and just leaving the FSB in place.

My plans for the rail are simply as a light mount and a bipod mount, as well as I just like the looks quite honestly. I also want to try to monopolize on the minor improvement from a free float.

My plans for sighting are right now leaning towards a 1-4 illuminated glass optic like an accupoint if that makes any difference in the decision, but I haven’t completely decided between that and an aimpoint, but feel I’ve narrowed it down to those two types of scope.

The one thing I can’t really figure out on the troy is why the bottom rail has that gap on the front end that you can see. It’s sort of odd looking. It must have something to do with the way it attaches or something I guess. The MI and the YHM with end cap, have a nice tidy front end by comparison.

Does that help with regards to folks further helping in the process? :smiley:

4

If you are going with a non-magnifying optic (eotech, aimpoint etc.) then get rid of the FSB it’s going to be annoying. (it was for me anyhow). If you are going with a scope of some sort then it doesn’t matter because the FSB dissapears with magnification. I started w/ an eotech and ended up with a TR-21r.
Of the 3 listed I would go with the troy just based on reputation. I personally went with the Daniel Defense but I paid nowhere near what they are asking today.
Just my 2cents with very limited experience.

5

Good info. Sounds like a full rail with flip up will be more versatile when it comes to optics.

I looked at the DD omega clamp on, but don’t like the fact that the delta ring stays in place and is visible. Just looks odd. Also looked at the Samson clamp on and really like the look but they want 150% more than the troy for one of them and I have a hard enough time spending the cost of the troy rail.

6

txbond, what color finish is on your upper and lower? I LIKE,I LIKE.

7

Check out the VLTOR CASV it looks great and functions even better, also its a free float system.

8

Thanks. It’s some type of hard coat anodized finish applied by a vendor to Spikes Tactical as I understand it.

I bought this second hand, so I don’t know if it is what they consider their FDE or their OD finish, as apparently they produced limited runs of those two colors.

You can see in this picture it looks more FDE without a direct flash:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24643102@N02/3419389603/

9

I can see where one would agree with you, but I dont think I do. I had no problem seeing through my front sight, or above it. The way I understand a 1x optic to be mounted is to have the irons in the bottom 1/3 of your viewing window. Thus keeping 2/3’s of window clear for view of target and dot. Thats speaking in terms of closing the other eye.
Seeing through the front sight post; I have absolutely no trouble at all with using optics like Aimpoint or Eotech in a OEG type fashion, both eyes open. With both eyes open your left eye sees the target and surrounding area with the red dot masked over and into your sight picture. Close your end cap and leave both eyes open and you’ll see what I mean, practice this, it will help and become second nature.
Im not trying to be confrontational, just throwing in my 2 cents, if Im missing your point then disregard my claim. :slight_smile:

10

YHM Lite rail with spector gas block, endcap, and their flipup sight.

Their product is fairly large in diameter

11

Aren’t those whole new uppers or are those the ones that have a rail that extends over the upper?

12

Thanks, that looks a lot like the one I had on my noveske build that I sold last year like a dummy. Thought I’d make a few bucks and buy another one cheaper this year after the prices dropped. DOH! LOL

Well, now I’m getting a slightly lesser rifle for the same money basically. :rolleyes:

I do like the look of the YHM when you see it like you posted it. How does that specter block work and install? That’s the one they sell locally but I didn’t buy it yesterday as I needed to measure my barrel for size last night to see which one I needed.

Also, is that the large end cap or small? They only had the large ones here locally.

13

I “bobbed” my FSP while still attached to the barrel, just FYI, its not that big of a job. I pulled the barrel off of the upper to do it though. “gotm4” does beautiful work on FSB’s, there is a post somewhere on the forums where he shows pics of his work. Absolutely beautiful job. Mine doesnt look that nice, but it does look good and is covered by the rail anyway. So the job can be done with minimal stress, or worry of ruining parts or messing up.
Yes the Troy rail has a gap in the front bottom, and yes thats the result of having a removeable bottom(6 oclock) rail. It doesnt bother me as I know that it has to be that way to function the way it does, having the removeable bottom rail that is.
I to am looking for a 1-4x optic… Am not having much luck finding the package I want, though the (pre) new 1x/4x 32mm optic from IOR Valdada looks VERY COOL.

Good luck man,
Seth H.

14

If I bobbed the fsp on the barrel though, could I get the barrel nut off to put the yhm barrel nut on? Seems like I’d have to remove it to get all the A2 handguard mounting stuff off and to swap the handguards.

Guess I could bob it and clamp a longer troy rail on, but not sure I want to add a 4th option to my list to torment me further. :slight_smile:

15

No, you would still have to take the FSB off to get the barrel nut off. The only reason I said something about “bobbing” the FSB, is because I saw in your post you wanted to remove it and cut it down,repaint it etc… Im still speaking in terms of using the Troy rail… I guess Im a little biased.:smiley:
Sorry, your probably looking for non-biased opinions/experiences.

16

So in that case, which one fits over a mid length system with lo pro gas block? The 10" mrf-mx or the 12" rifle version? If I bobbed my existing sight, I’d want to cover it completely I guess.

17

A lot of people with much more experience than me don’t like YHM rails.
That being said I really like my 7 inch Lite rail. It is a bit bigger around than some others but I find that it fits my hand really well once I put XTM panels on it.

The biggest complaint seems to be out of spec rails. I haven’t noticed this one mine, however like I said. I have a much more limited cross section to work with.

18

Well, I returned the YHM rail and end cap this afternoon. Just decided I didn’t want to mess with removing the gas block and stuff, so with that said I’m now down to the option of which clamp on rail to go with, and if I should choose a 9" mid length, or a longer length and bob my FSB to fit under it.

I really like the look of the MI one better, but everyone keeps saying Troy, Troy, Troy. And, the writeup about the troy leads me to think it might be a slight bit more sturdy.

Anyone know if the MI rails have any sort of anti-rotation design like the way the troy rails have the little tabs that fit around the receiver?

19

I’m telling ya get the CASV-EL system and you wont regret it, I tried all kinds of rails and ended up with the CASV and love it, i wouldnt have nothing else. I like how it (piggybacks) the reciever and raises it a bit so when you add an aimpoint it dont stick up like a satalite dish like most you see.

20

I looked it up, but I’m just not fond of how it looks and I don’t like the delta ring staying on either. Just a personal preferrence I guess, but thanks for the lead.