I am in the market for a new .308. I am wanting a main battle rifle because I think they are a dieing breed and I think it would be neet to own a part of history. So I have been seriously looking into a new loaded Springfield M1a with the 22" barrel. I like the traditional look, the history behind this gun, and I have a desire to get this gun just for fun range use. This thread kind of ties into my other one asking about the barrel size on the M1a. I have decided that I want to get away from the AR and AK platform. The requirements that I am looking for is a semi-auto, reliable gun that does not malfunction and it does not have to be highly accurate (1.5 MOA or less). I know the AR10 and a bolt action will be more accurate than the M1A, but I really do not need another bolt action or AR type of gun.
I keep going back and forth between the M1A and the FNAR. I have a budget of $1400, which both fall into this range.
My only problems with the M1A is the lack of accuracy and mounting a scope. I keep reading that the M1A is only 2-4 MOA and that is mainly what scares me off from buying it. I will not add anything else to this gun nor tie up money into it for accuracy. Basically it will be an out of the box gun and I will later add a scope. My only other concern is the scope mount and the check weld, or lack of a check weld.
Second I did not know if the FNAR fits my “wants” a little better. I have read that it is more accurate than the M1A, but it has not been proven like the M1A. It dose not seem as if the FNAR is very popular and I do not know about the quality. I am sure it is good quality since it is made by FN, but what about the longevity of it? It seems more of the tactical gun and I was wanting a traditional gun.
I really dont need a .308 semi-auto, it is just a want. I am about 90% sure of the M1A, but I didnt know if the FNAR would be better as in quality, accuracy, and investment. I want something that will serve me well and hold its value. The accuracy of the M1a is just what scares me. Most people say its a money pit to tune that gun into an accurate rifle. Anyone know of something else that I may look into.
I looked at Keltec’s 308 but Im not sure about the quality, and a G3, but I just wasn’t impressed
How are they money pits? Just because of the old age? I picked up two Granads from CMP and had thought about converting one of them to .308. If it’s a money pit, I’ll probably hold off. Just wanting to get your thoughts.
Let me just add a few things. The reason I currently do not want a SCAR is because I feel as if they have not been on the market long enough to short their reliability and I would want FN to work out the “bugs” if any. I have just learned not to buy anything new unless it has been on the market for a few years. But yes I will get one later one, but I dont want to spend the $2500+ right now.
I do not want an AR or AK rifle because I have several and I was wanting something different. I am getting an SBR, and that will be my AR platform toy. I was wanting something more traditional.
Kind of the same reason I dont want a bolt action. Yes they are more accurate, but I have several hunting and target guns, ranging from .223, 7mm mag, to .300 WSM. I use the 223 and 7 mag for target. I like to use the.223 for 400 yds and the 7 mag out to 800 yds.
I would like a semi auto .308 that will hit a paper plate at around 400-600 yds. I figured the 308 because it would kick less than my larger caliber guns that I use for long range. I would just use this for more or less medium range and “just for fun/range shooting”.
Thats what I am afraid of. Some say they shoot 1.5 MOA or less out of the box, others say its 4 MOA out of the box. I have read several people say you spend an extra $2000 on mods for accuracy and you are lucky if you get 1 moa.
That’s exactly it. It will never be as accurate as a cheaper 308 AR nor as reliable as the FAL or the SCAR H. With the introduction of the LaRue OBR that won the International Sniper Championship at Fort Benning, the light weight LaRue PredaTAR, and the UK military issue sniper rifle LMT MWS, I seriously cannot fathom why anyone would choose an M1.
A paper plate at 600? What is a paper plate diameter? Like 8" or so?
Can YOU shoot that well? I can’t.
If you are talking about a fun gun for the range, the M1A with iron sights is alot of fun.
But like LL says it will turn into a money pit if you want to get it accurate. A large portion of them seem to shoot like an AK out of the box and can be extremely bad about wandering zeros or at least that has been my experience with them. I had 1 and my brother has at least 4 on my last count.
They are fun to shoot though, if that is your primary concern.
If accuracy is, don’t look at the M1A. If durability is, don’t look at the M1A unless you have access to alot of USGI parts. If you want to mount a scope, don’t look at the M1A. It can be done, but it will be expensive.
I haven’t fired a Scar 17 but I have held one. I have fired the 16 quite a bit and I like it, and I assume that most everything carries over to the larger gun.
The only other gun that I have fired in .308 (that wasn’t a bolt) was a DPMS that my brother had. Other than a bad extractor that wouldn’t pivot, it was okay to shoot.
I have never even picked up a FNAR so no help there.
If you are wanting to spend a lot of time shooting at the 400-600 yard range with optics, you will get alot more bang for your buck out of a bolt gun. A good accurate (non AR) .308 semi is going to run more than your $1,400 budget in my experience.
On of the reasons I went with the SCAR 17 was precisely that they’ve tested and worked things out in the DoD program it came from. You’re going to have a hard time finding a semi .308 that is as soft shooting and reliable.
Is it perfect? Heck no. Mags are harder to find than a backstage pass to see the Biebs. I’m still waiting on a backorder I placed in May and haven’t paid scalper prices on Gunbroker, since it’s not my only defensive rifle. The stock trigger is crunchy and awful, and the rail system is awfully short because otherwise the quick change barrel system (not yet available to the common person, if ever) won’t work with a longer forend.
I bought it because it’s different than my AR and my AK, and it is hands down the lightest and most easy to handle military derivative .308 out there right now. The Larue PredatAR in .308 is another excellent choice if you don’t mind another AR…it takes PMAGs, and comes with an excellent Geissele trigger from the factory, but it’s another AR.
What are your accuracy requirements and what kind of shooting are you typically doing?
Edited to add…a “main battle rifle”, such as the M14, FN FAL, HK G3, Beretta BM-59, original Armalite AR-10, are going to be about equal when it comes to practical accuracy…2"-4" groups are typical.
If you want a DMR type rifle, you can make some upgrades to any of those existing weapons, but don’t expect the standard variants to be match grade rifles.
The DoD has been testing and revising it for, what, like six years or more? I don’t think there has been a modern assault/battle rifle desigthat with more end-user feedback. I beat the shit out of one in training and on deployment with no problems. If you’re looking for a semi auto 7.62 that can bang plates at 600m the Mk 17 is the best option.
If you want something reliable, inexpensive, shootable and with a lot of history behind it consider a CMP Garand.
Imbel DSA FAL-Heavy, not very accurate, but easy to get parts for.
SA M1A Loaded-Heavy, accurate but optics are hard(expensive) to mount, Loaded has good trigger.
FN FNAR-Flexible ergos, accurate, good trigger, total pain to strip and clean. Can’t be field stripped. Not a combat rifle.
FN SCAR 17-Combat trigger is hit and miss, mags are non-existant, otherwise a very good battle rifle. Lite, flexible and accurate.
I say SCAR 17 and call it a day. I ran mine at a short range carbine match yesterday. I was the only guy running a .308. I didn’t have any decent way to carry a reload, so I reloaded from a dump pouch.
I went a little slow on my runs to demo the stages to other shooters, but still I do not feal this heavy caliber held me back in the least. The 17 is very shootible in that type of event. I placed well with it.
The 17 is a battle rifle first and foremost. It is capable of great accuracy, but something I have noticed with the 15ish different loads I’ve tried in it, it shoots nothing “bad”. Some loads like the 155 gr TAP are literally on par with some bolt guns, but even surplus junk is still very capable of getting hit after hit on 10x12 steel plates at 500 yards. The 17 shines as a heavy caliber option for a reliable, accurate, lightweight modern fighting rifle, just as much at home at the close up work as an M4 with a little training.
If you want to play DM or Sniper, buy a well built precision SR25 type rifle or wait on the MK20. I don’t mean this in a negative way, but it sounds like you yourself are already aware of the negatives of the M1A, but are probably smitten by the lore/romanticism of the M1A. Let it go, there are way too many BETTER modern options for your wants available now days, that can do what the M1A can do and drastically exceed it’s capabilities. Not to mention, if there is another type of AW ban, what do you think will be worth more, a Springfield Armory M1A or an FN SCAR 17? Listen to the guys here, they won’t steer you wrong, especially Lebo; he tells it like it is.
Are you looking at 7.62x51 or are you willing to look at other .308 weapons?
I have become intrigued with 7.62x35 that AAC has developed, it will fit my 5.56 lower without any change but the BCG.
I cant find any ammo that isn’t subsonic, so I am not ready to buy a barrel or another upper for the caliber yet. When the non subsonic ammo is available at places like Ammoman or the Ammos Bros. in SOCal I will make the jump and go for that caliber. You have to understand my son and I go shooting at a range in the mountains behind LA and make the day of it. The last time we went there were 5 of us and we ran thru about 2500 rounds in four ar 15s and several handguns. That is typical of our range days.