I’ve been pricing free float rail systems from various manufacturers and noticed some cost significantly more than others. For example, I noticed Daniel Defense rails are a good bit more expensive than Yankee Hill Machine free float rails. Why is this? What technical reasons make the Daniel Defense rails worth more?
Thank you,
Dave
Biggest reason is probably strict quality control. Strict quality control will need competent people, top quality machinery and may even mean a higher degree of wastage due to the strict standards. – Costs of all which, naturally, will raise a product’s basic cost.
One thing I think which may or may not be factor is product innovation. It takes money to innovate and even more to test.
Depending on the company, they may choose to view this as either an investment to recoup over time or make it part of operational expenses, adding a small percentage to basic cost across the board for a rolling recovery, if you will.
While all that is true, it doesn’t answer why an individual should pay more for one free float rail over another “name brand.” Why should one pay more for one over the other? That’s what I’m wanting to know, what makes the more expensive rails better? Anything?
[QUOTE=DaveInGA;582393]While all that is true, it doesn’t answer why an individual should pay more for one free float rail over another “name brand.” Why should one pay more for one over the other? That’s what I’m wanting to know, what makes the more expensive rails better? Anything?[/QUOTE
Porsche or Pinto? Up to you and all about the Benjamins.
I am not positive more money is better. I just got the YHMC free float rail and it is made really nice, it is sturdy, mounts tightly and has a quality fit and finish. Unless you are packing it miles and need to shave every ounce you can not sure the more expensive rails are any better.
It’s just like in racing. There’s an old saying “Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go”.
It’s pretty similar in ARs. Lots of companies can make big, heavy and weaker rails. Few make them lighter, smaller and stronger.
Same for suppressors. YHM make good suppressors but they are bigger and heavier thus less expensive vs. their competitors who’s suppressors are typically quite a bit smaller and lighter.
Another appropriate saying:
Light
Cheap
Strong
Pick any two.
On some I am not certain there is much difference. On many of the high end quad rails, Larue, DD… there is a big difference.
YHN is a cylindrical aluminum tube with rails on it that uses a jamb nut to index and lock the rail system. YHM has added screws to help lock it into place once indexed in. Although it is an ok system I personally do not like jamb nuts.
The Larue is narrower side to side than it is top to bottom which I like and is much more difficult to manufacture. It has indexing pins to index the rail system and, in my opinion, a better locking system for the nut that holds the rail on. (No jamb nuts)
Looks at how some of the other higher end quad rails are manufactured and secured to the rifle and I think you will have your answer.
Also there was a chart that listed the weight of different rails. You would be surprised in the weight difference, although you did write that it is a non-issue to you.
A YHM rail will probably serve you well and later, if you decide to trade “up,” you can always buy a new one and sell the YHM.
What I’m trying to determine here is what is a Porsche and what is a Pinto. I’ve got enough experience in life to know that not everything that costs like a Porsche is a Porsche and not everything that costs like a Pinto is a Pinto. I learned reloading just spending a lot of money doesn’t mean you’re going to get a better product. Sometimes you’ll spend more and get less or outdated product.
What I want to know is WHY, in real terms, not theory, is it the higher priced rails cost more. From some of the posts, I get they are lighter or have better indexing systems, etc. Where can one find this information out? Most companies selling the products don’t seem to list the weights on all rails consistently, etc.
Ok, this is starting to get me somewhere. Lighter, smaller and stronger is what separates out the rails. Now how does one identify which ones are actually lighter, smaller and stronger without doing one’s own research and buying several brands of rails?
Ok, more good useful information. It would appear when decision making for rails, you’re looking for lighter, smaller, stronger and those three factors determine costs. It also makes sense that some companies produce a top notch product, some produce a mid level product and some produce a cheap/junk product.
This begs another question: At what weight and strength levels are the companies separated out?
Look for RobS. chart on rails. In a nutshell, you will pay more for a rail that has a smaller more narrow signature, lighter weight and sturdy structure. All of which IMHO are important to have all of these attributes. YHM and Midwest are strong but they lack in slimness and lightness.
I’m thinking I’d like to get a list up of manufacturers even worth considering to start with, then start separating them according to weight, strength, quality and features.
Thank you for your answers so far. It’s very helpful.
Dave
Anyone have a link to the RobS chart? I now have a much better idea of which features are desirable. It would appear there are at least two tiers of manufacturers related to size, weight and strength, with Larue and Daniel Defense being in the top tier and with Yankee Hill Machine and Midwest in Tier two. Are there other tiers?
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pwswheghNQsFnUZMkZNF2DQ&output=html
“ranking” into “tiers” is counter-productive IMHO. Find the rail system that meets your needs in terms of size, weight, and cost and run it until it breaks or you find fault with it. If you can’t justify the added price of a thing then chance are good you won’t appreciate the reasons it costs more.
Wow, this thread made my head hurt.
Best thing I can suggest for the OP is to try to find people local who have the rails in question so that you can see & feel the difference between a DD and YHM rail. Pay attention to the difference in fit, finish, and how theyaffect the feel and balance of the rifle/carbine. Also pay particular attention to the difference in weights as the YHM rails weigh almost twice the amount of a comparable DD rail and add considerable bulk to the weapon. It always seemed counterproductive to me to take a lightweight carbine and stick a heavy/wide/bulky YHM rail on it.
I’m not bashing the YHM or MI rails, just saying that all rails are not created equal and it comes down to what features are important to you and how much you willing to spend.
This choice is not always clear… what about a Porche GT3 Vs '09 C6 Z06?
The Porche costs almost twice as much, but the Vette will out accelorate it, out break it, out corner it, and out perform it in every way posible on either a drag strip or road cource… so what do you get int he porche for twice the price you do not get in a Vette… a foreign name plate, and hand stiching on better leather?
What I am trying to say, is that price does not always equal quality. There can be a gray area. I am not saying that DD and LaRue are not better than YH or MI, I am simply saying that you can not simply say DD is better because it costs more due to R&D and so forth.
Honestly, I think we pay more for LaRue and DD is because they do make a better product, but how much better is hard to put into dollars. Is it $100 better? $50? $5? Maybe they cost $20 more to build and LaRue and DD knowing how many of us are “lable whores” will pay $100 more so thats what they charge. Simple supply/demand curve right? If they start charging $600 for a rail, we will start buying YH and MI ones, untill they come down in price to where we can justify to ourselves that its worth it…
A KAC rail is something like $100 more than a DD rail, is the KAC $100 better? or is it just priced that much higher because its says KAC on it?
Almost all the products we buy work the same way.
There are only 2 major manufacturers of LCD panels in the world, so your $3000 Samsung TV may have the same panel as a $800 Vizio, but you buy the Samsung because its not a Vizio, its a Samsung… meanwhile, it may very well have the same exact LCD in it. [I bought a Samsung, I am not immune to this lol]
I just don’t know how much of the increase in cost of a rail is hype and how much is quality.
Not everyone uses that same metric of value. If Daniel Defense has what I want and they cost $100 more than YHM which does not, then I’m buying the DD. When someone starts making a rail with the same features that I value in the DD for YHM prices then I’ll change brands.
“how much better” is irrelevant to me. Better is better, and better is what meets my needs.
My next rifle is getting a $165 9.0 Troy Vtac tube. Contrast that with a DD 9.0 Lite at nearly $200 more. For this particular rifle the Vtac better meets my needs in this case, regardless of price high or low.
It’s because KAC charges a premium for its name like any other company that knows how the mind of the average consumer works. And KAC likes to charge a pretty hefty premium. $350 for a non free float two piece rail? What a scam. Can buy the MI rail for less than half of that and it’s just as good.
Rail panels? Ha, another overpriced product.
It’s all marketing. Samsung and plenty other manufacturers are all being currently investigated over price fixing of LCD panels. They did it in the past with computer memory.
It’s like how CMT makes parts that all these various companies sell but each company has their own roll marks and claimed quality control so the prices vary. And for some reason people keep buying the most expensive ones.
Decide what features you want and then decide according to your budget. More expensive != better.
Rob, you just simply rock. I wish I had all the free time you did! 