To the Op;
No, you did’nt get out of line at all, you shared your knowlege, As was stated above, “you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make him drink” That is quite true, I’ve done the same thing, guys at work would ask me about buying a AR, I’d tell them what I know,Usually, they balk at the price,Alot of these guys think paying $1000 for a rifle that is reliable,accurate, and capable of saving your ass in a pinch, is waaay to much to spend.I ask them “how much is your life worth?” Almost always get “the deer in the headlights” look. A couple of times I even printed up “the chart” complete, with all the text, told them to sit down and read before buying…it was pointless. In almost every case, they ran right out and bought the first AR they saw, usually,something on the very low end of the chart…and usually, they overpaid. Anymore, I don’t offer advice…Pain really is the best teacher,That, and when they figured out they got screwed by the shop they bought it from…
First, good attempt.
To be honest though, the DPMS might actually “fit” his needs just fine (as he will never shoot it and just wanted a black rifle to show his “buds”.)
C4
No you did not cross the line. I’ve seen it happen time and again in other forums of various topics. Any time someone pops in asking if the decision that they’ve already made is good as opposed to asking for help in making the best decision possible, a red flag should go up because you may get jumped on for answering honestly.
All I can say is Thanks… Because of users like you - helped me make the right decision when I was looking along with the “chart”… you tried and did you best… some people it may not make a difference… other learn the hardway…
My brother in law has a DPMS (not his choice) hi gun guy bought it for him at a discount. You can see the differences when you compare my DD to his. Although I will admit his gap and wiggle is prob less than mine. I do like the DPMS plastic mold on the inside. Looks like it can hold a lot of different configurations compare to the egg carton foam in my DD came in.
Grant had a point.
Many who go out and buy an AR15, might shoot a few rounds through it at first. But then, they turn it into a safe queen. These are the folks who don’t want to shoot it, because the ammunition is too expensive. If you think about it, there is nothing wrong with this.
To those folks who want to own a gun to brag about, or plink a magazine or two per year, then the DPMS might be just the ticket. It looks “cool” enough!
Some people take advice in quantity, not in quality.
With this thought in mind, many will bash well established brands because the individual either can’t afford it, or is trying to justify (sometimes to themselves) why they didn’t buy the established brand.
Many will defend their decision to their dying breath, rather than admit they made a poor choice. These types can be rather vocal on the internet.
I grew up hearing the phrase, “buy quality, buy once, buy crap, buy often”. This was in reference to hand tools and guns.
To the OP, your intentions were noble. But I have found that internet sites tend to attract individuals of like interests. On gun sites, some are centered around those who like to own guns, and on occasion, shoot them a bit. But not too much, as bullets are expensive, and range time takes away from building up high post counts!
Some sites (such as this one) tend to attract individuals who find the above, well, rather annoying. Sites such as this one tend to attract individuals who actually use their guns, train to use their guns, and view their guns more as tools vs. toys.
Many Officers within my Department came to me with questions about buying an AR about 6 months go. These were basically inter-city officers who wanted to have a carbine around just in case. For those not in Law Enforcement, most LEO’s are cheap… Very…
When the conversations came to the point of “well, do I really need to buy a ___? Isn’t a ___ almost as good?” I remind them why they said they wanted to buy the gun. I also tell them if they ever need this thing, then they really need it to work. None of these individuals bought a DPMS, or a Bushmaster…
was this on arfcom?
in the minds of half of those jackasses, if it’s chromelined and isn’t an HBAR, you are a gun snob.
I’ve gone the route of asking what they are going to use the rifle for. If its plinking/range use, then a DPMS would be fine. But if it has any remote chance of being used for self defense then go BCM, LMT, Noveske etc.
The moment they say 'This is just as good as the others, it just costs less" I ask them how the hell do you think they get it so cheap, but cutting corners where they can, or using lesser quality components.
I had a guy extoll how his Del-ton upper runs just great. When I asked how it was in a class, or run hard he says he hasn’t run it hard.
Now, when subject about AR uppers comes up he never chimes in anymore with ‘I have one and it runs flawless’. I’m guessing he ran it hard and found out he got what he paid for.
No you weren’t out of line. That said OPSEC on BCM with the idiots, its hard enough for the guys who want to buy the best to find them.
Let the Oly, DPMS and Shrubmasters fanboys stay content with their choices so that it leaves more Bravo for us.
I try to push a person towards something they’ll like rather then what’s cheaper or better for their needs. Like you have done. Just because a rifle has better features doesn’t mean you’ll be winning matches or shootin like a pro. Only time and lots of shooting(getting use to your rifle) will get you to those levels of Black rifle shooting.
It took me 2 rifles to figure out what I was looking for. And I had all this info to use, no excuse other then lack of local choices. My lack of patients has cost me in the long run, but iv learned a lot while making these poor choices.
Scott
LOL! My wife won’t be a fan of more Bravo for me!
That was just the thing. I proved to him that a BCM could be had for the same money or less and other jumped on me for it. I never even said you should pay more for better quality, I merely said you could pay the same or less for better quality so why wouldn’t you!
I thought I was grumpy in the morning
I was and still am an uninformed person when I was purchasing my AR but I got kicked in the head enough here to LEARN before making a mistake and am thankful to the guys here that guided me in the right direction. I got a much better setup then if I was on my original course. I think showing someone another option is not wrong. In the end it is your opinion and you got that from experience and education and they can take it or leave it. It is their loss of gain. Good for you for speaking up.
You were deff not out of line. Some people make up their mind about something and there is nothing you can say or do to open their mind. There was nothing offensive about your post and if I were new to firearms and thought DPMS was a good rifle, I would find your post quite informative…but some people just won’t listen.
To the OP, you weren’t out of line at all imo. The guys that jumped you probably didn’t know what all those specs. you shared meant anyway.
Especially in today’s AR market, better quality doesn’t always mean it will cost alot more money.
To the OP, your heart was in the right place, all you can do is give the best advise you can. When it is ignored, try not to laugh too hard when you get the opportunity to say, “told you so…”.
Next time, post links to the Chart and Oh no…I bought a BM, OLY, Stag, before I knew better…that will cause numerous heart attacks and get you attacked like a school of Puranas.
i’m glad people like you are willing to share your opinion on things that you have researched and know about. if it were not for this site and the people on it giving their opinions and advice i would still have my first ar…a del-ton.
the day i bought it i found this site and sold the rifle the very next day for a slight profit and built a totally better gun consisting of a noveske lower, larue stealth upper, BCM bcg, DD chf barrel and DD lite rail…completely different animal than the del-ton i must say:D
I think I have contributed to more than my fair share of heart attacks by passing that link around.
In the end, though, serious folk tend to accept The Chart and act accordingly.
Welcome to the Interweb! They can’t ALL be M4C!
QUALITY is an acquired taste - it took me a while. Let the crowd spend a fortune making their rifles “as good as” - and it’s STILL not - & sometimes that becomes a better teacher, than the most wisened, reasoned, voice among us. Besides - maybe you’ll be able to get some of their gear cheap, when they break up their old rifle for sale! 