This is bold statement that is not intended to insult others. I’m just expressing my honest,unabashed beliefs.
If you vote,in this upcoming Presidential election, for any candidate other than Mitt Romney you are naive, an idiot or a traitor.
SJC3081
The purpose of this post is not to insult or violate any forum rules.
I’m just expressing my opinion and not directing my above statement to any member in particular.
Perhaps in the long run it IS in my best interests? Perhaps I’m telling my “friends” that I no longer approve of them putting a turd between two pieces of bread and serving it to me as a club sandwich? Also, them more disgruntled and intractable we become, the less money and votes they get. They only really care about money and votes, so that’s the only way to get tthrough to them.
I’m no longer interested in propping up my sorry-assed party. At a certain point, I’d almost rather see the absolute WORST candidate in the history of the world get elected. The sooner you reboot the system, the sooner you restore functionality.
Not to be insulting, but your opinion is worthless. 
It might be in your best interest if, in the long run, it lead to fundamental change. But that is nigh impossible to actually happening. So no, you are not voting in your own best interest, even long term.
There were those who were disgusted with McCain, and thought that getting Obama in would be the “absolute WORST candidate” and help move people to fundamental change. Worked out really well, didn’t it.
The larger the mountain is, the harder it is to move it so hoping for some fundamental change to come in the future through some miracle candidate is a lost cause, because the mountain you are trying to move is just getting bigger in the meantime. If you can slow the rate of that mountain building down, you buy your time for the miracle and marginally improve conditions in the mean time.
This thinking of yours is why the Democrats and liberals in both parties have gotten as strong as they have: they are willing to make minor course corrections and not have to have the fundamental change all at once.
Care to show me where this alleged “fundamental change” started and what it’s progress has been so far? Because all I’ve seen from the GOP is a de-evolution and worsening prognosis for the future. I’m not really interested in waiting until the Tea Party conversion is complete, because I’ll be worm food by the time that happens. :rolleyes:
I vote my conscience AND a straight party line.
I inevitably vote straight Republican party ticket, because they are much more likely to align with my views than Democrat. I don’t go off the reservation, because we’re stuck (at present) in a two-party system, so I want my vote to count. I say I “vote my conscience,” because, even though the individuals my not perfectly align with my ideals, more republicans in office means my views have a better chance of being implemented to some degree than if I vote otherwise.
So, my conscience dictates a pragmatic vote directed by my ideals but based in the realistic constraints of the present.
If you read what I wrote, I did not say that it had, though the Tea Party, that you brought up, is a start of a fundamental change, if it can last.
Because all I’ve seen from the GOP is a de-evolution and worsening prognosis for the future. I’m not really interested in waiting until the Tea Party conversion is complete, because I’ll be worm food by the time that happens. :rolleyes:
Yet you were the one talking about long term benefits of your head-in-the sand approach…
“A vote cast in good conscience, is NEVER a wasted vote.”
- John Adams: Founding Father, 2nd President of the United States -
There is a difference between a “wasted” vote and an “ineffectual, against your own best interests” vote.
Not head in the sand at all. You can’t just stay home and expect anyone to get the message. You should go vote, you just don’t have to vote for ANYONE that doesn’t represent your political views. I’ve stated multiple times that I will vote, but I will not support Romney. It’s not that he’s a less than ideal candidate, it’s that he’s a completely substandard candidate.
I also make sure to let those in power know WHY I will not support them, regardless of their party affiliation. Being a Repugnican doesn’t give you a pass, just ask Lugar and Specter. My rep just fell in the primary race. he was a do-nothing alcoholic and he got his ass fired. Good riddance!
What say you? How do you deal with it?
Will, I have thought a lot about that. I have come to believe that every vote counts and even a non-vote counts. The bean counters are typically quite good at what they do and it’s usually pretty clear where votes are going when not placed with the two top teams. Not always but most of the time. It’s rare to have a three equally viable candidates in most elections.
I honestly believe it comes down to two things in a my life. I can decide to lead or follow / win or lose.
I mean no disrespect to anyone that “votes their conscience” but in my way of thinking they have chosen to lose. They have made the decision to follow. They have chosen to allow their vote to become a tax. Their vote will be collected and doled back out to whomever society and the bean counters have decided it will go to in any given election.
For instance in this election, VA is very evenly split. We have someone that may run as a third party and people like him so they will draw votes. He has ZERO chance of becoming President. Even if he was the most brilliant candidate imaginable, he can not win this election because he has not proven himself to the nation. For that reason, I find his conscience corrupt for even putting his name on the ballot.
Here is his web site. As you can see, he opposes Obama, yet somehow his conscience will allow him to help Obama regain election as he will be in direct competition with Romney. Many voters feel the same. http://www.goodeforpresident2012.com/.
We don’t let three teams play in the Super Bowl nor World Series just because a few fans can prove that a third team is superior.
I believe the vote should represent my best effort to have government change in the manner that I want. Even if I thought all of the 3rd party candidates were just off the chart better than either of the two that will win, I still have to pick one of those to win.
Especially a Presidential election is not a place to “practice”. I know it would not be possible for me to do so because I am just an ordinary citizen, but can you imagine if you were having one of those SWAT competitions and all the members had trained and I simply wanted to participate because I “meant well” and my head was in a good a good place regarding the LEO community in general? I don’t think anyone’s conscience would sit well with that and most of all, even if you would allow it, my conscience should not allow me to even consider it.
The vote is a cornerstone of America. It’s more important than a basketball game, a football game, a shooting match, or any other event. Yet for some reason… many Americans will enter the voting station with the forethought that they indeed are simply going to lose and are perfectly ok with it. No other facet of life do they take that attitude. Even flipping a coin, heads or tails, they are more competitive and have more of a winners mindset.
The way I see it, we as Americans give ourselves a 50/50 chance of winning every few years. I have to vote for one of those two. My conscience will not allow me to go to the voting station and practice.
Practice should be handled locally, before election time. Build up a good candidate. Get them elected to Mayor, Governor, Senator. Call your local talk radio guy. Have them interview people that you want to represent you. Help the people get their names out there.
One simply can’t start at a top down Presidential election and expect to change things when it’s beyond clear that either Romney or Obama will win this election unless something unforeseen happens.
You can’t organize on election day. That 3rd party has to be an equal 3rd right now. If that were the case, then one’s conscience would truly have three viable choices. As it stands now we don’t.
I appreciate why a lot of people “vote their conscience” knowing their guy will not win but I have really come to see that as the government taxing my vote because for any given election it can be reasonably calculated as to where that vote will go and generally speaking I have found that it ends up helping the person I would least like to see elected.
I helped America get where it is today for better or worse and through action or in-action. I have one of two choices to make when election day rolls around.
agree 
while some can argue you should have voted this way or that ? fact is you voted and voted for what you thought and that is what voting is all about !!!
to me the only vote wasted is one that is not cast !!!
those that say those are throw away ? maybe but maybe others who see that vote use ron paul as example might next time think HMMM I would have voted for him but thought nobody else would have and if I do I am throwing it away ! and maybe if I and others just voted what WE thought not what others said he could have made a bigger dent and maybe enough next time he or other outsider might win
Honestly, you could make the same statement about voting for ANYONE in the last 4 or 5 elections. Nobody is rescuing the Republic, the parties are just taking turns stealing from us.
They have far more in common with each other than anyone they claim to represent. And if anyone doesn’t realize that they are naive, an idiot or a traitor.
Just my opinion, not picking on anyone.
For what it’s worth, your opinion is shared by a lot of folks.
why I say:
choosing republican or democrat is like asking to be punched in the left side or right side of the face and we say we dont want to be punched at all ! they say sorry that is not a option !!!
I don’t believe it is a coincidence that Group A represents about half of the values of most normal people while destroying the other half and Group B represents the other half of the values while destroying the first half and BOTH claiming to be the only ones who have your values and best interests in mind.
The sad reality is people get into politics for money and power. In order to get money and power they claim to serve the people. Anyone foolish enough to enter politics for noble reasons like “serving the people” will be relegated to the political equivalent of hall monitor or janitor and anyone who poses a risk of actually gaining the power to “serve the people” will quickly be destroyed by those who are there to gain money and power.
In many ways the mere desire to enter politics should disqualify most candidates. Candidates who have been lawyers or have degrees in Political Science should be especially precluded.
I think we’d be a lot better off if we elected our Congress by lottery similar to being called for jury duty. I really believe we could randomly pick people off the street and they couldn’t make it much worse.
I think this election is also about voting for our future
Maybe one is the same old bs political junk
But the other wants to transform this country even more radically away from our founding fathers vision
Voting my concious this time around might have to be at least getting things back on course then next changing the driver
I realize my agreement is like the kiss of death around here but you are so right on the money.
It ain’t about “red” states and “blue” states. The only color calling the shots is green and the plutocrats hold all the chips.
Despite what people say, the “lesser-of-two-evils” has always been something we all face pretty much everyday. For example, the other day I had to choose between filling up at a gas station I was driving by but was boycotting at $3.07 a gallon; versus a gas station that I may drive by tomorrow for $2.95 a gallon.
Which one is a lesser of two evils is based on the current situation. If my car was running on “E”, the higher-priced gas station that I was boycotting looks much better because I need the fuel now. Otherwise, I might face the consequence of running out of gas or the gas prices jumping up so that there isn’t any financial advantage waiting until tomorrow (this has happened to me plenty of times).
The way I see it is any vote for Romney is realistically a vote against obama. But any vote for someone other than Romney is basically a vote for obama. While it might be against our “conscience” to vote for either one, in the end, unless we can come up with a VIABLE third candidate, it comes down to a choice between Romney or obama.
I’m sure that during the 1992 Presidential Elections a lot of Gun Owners voted based on their conscience. Just how much comfort their conscience gave them when some of these very individuals had to give up some of their rights thanks to the Assault Weapons Ban, Lautenberg Law, etc.
My question is will following your conscience help keep our Rights as Guaranteed by the US Constitution, preserve our military, restore our economy, prevent unnecessary increases in taxes, stem the flow of illegal aliens, reduce crime, reduce dependence on welfare, and keep our country safer? Or will following your conscience allow the current dictator to play more golf and take more vacations on our dime? JM2CW.
Yup agree
I think in the past the people were more in the middle or midst of the two parties over the last 50 years or so the groups really started ignoring the people and sliding away from the people
At this point I look to history and look at some things Kenedy did and he would be considered a radical right wing conservative by some folks !