Ultimate Reliability for Colt 6920....

AR/M4 AR Technical Discussion
1

Gentlemen,
First off, I would like to say THANKS to the great founding members of this forum (whomever you may be), for creating such a great place, which I can already confirm is better than many of the other BS forums out there…

I’m proud to be here, and hope everyone doesn’t mind me joining up, and getting a bit of help from the most knowledgeable persons here…

Anyhow, I have just purchased my very first M4, a Colt LE6920. I’m totally psyched to say the least.
I have no experience with AR’s until now, but I have much experience with shooting and also shooting with iron sights.
Most importantly, I plan on buying as many quality mags (using HK right now) and ammo as I can afford, as well as all the range time I can get too.
I simply need to get to know the weapon.

NOW, my BIGGEST concern is with reliability, and I know that keeping the weapon clean and lubricated is priority #1.
SO, that brings me to the subject of mods to the weapon. This thread’s purpose is to ask the more experienced persons on this forum for advice on what can be done to this 6920 to make it AS RELIABLE AS POSSIBLE???
I realize not all that much needs to be done, but I have heard of some who have sent their Colt to a gentleman named Ken at SAW (Specialized Armament ?) for his reliability package. Apparently it costs about $150-$200, and I have not yet logged on to his website to see what this pkg consists of. I will do this soon however.
I would like to ask you guys WHAT LIST of mods or part replacements, would you say could be/should be done to this 6920, in order to achieve ULTIMATE RELIABILITY???

Just a note, I do not plan on throwing on tons and tons of accessories onto this weapon. I simply plan to add what is needed. Below is a list of items I currently am thinking of adding…

  1. Optic -BEST I can afford. Still not sure what to do here. WISH I could afford a Short Dot, but have heard the Nightforce 1-4x is a good choice too.???

  2. Sling - STill not sure if I need a 2 or 3 point for general use???

  3. BUIS’s -Possibly Troy brand…

  4. Possibly a vertical grip from TangoDown or Magpul… or ???

Thanks guys for any help you could give.

As stated earlier, my NUMBER ONE GOAL is to make this weapon as reliable as ulitimately possible BEFORE I do ANY other mods…

2

Welcome Razor,
The only thing I would add to a 6920 to increase reliability would be a Crane-0-ring on the extractor and follow Pat Rogers guide on cleaning and lubing. Other than that shoot it.

Later,
Robb

3

A brand new LE6920 is a wonderful thing.

It deserves to be fed good ammo - don’t go cheap on this part. I like Federal XM193 and 55gr. FMJ American Eagle.

Buy a supply of good magazines (I recommend from CProducts or 44mag.com) and try them all out. The MagPul gen 2 follower is a good thing.

An extra bolt is a good idea too - G&R Tactical is a good resource for these.

Get some good lube and use it correctly, as per the Pat Rogers article.

A Crane o-ring or DFender around the extractor spring will go a long way.

Your carbine should be very relaibale and provide you with shooting bliss.

4

Buy good mags, junk mags is the surest way to buy trouble with an AR.

5

Thanks guys,
This is JUST what I was looking for.

  1. Can you guys tell me where is a good place to get this Crane-O-Ring?

  2. Can you tell me what exactly a CraneORing does, and how it helps??

6

You can get them from Grant at www.GandRtactical.com they multiply the pressure applied by the extractor spring.

7

Well the first post was right, there are some BS forums for sure.Heck, I just posted an experience on another forum and got chewed alive and burnt at the stake! Theres always a tough basturd somewhere who thinks he is anyhow.But that big talk:cool: doesnt mean doodly-squat to me, but I do like being among more rational folks.Hell, I am a corrections officer, I get enough of that Know-it-all crap from them.I want to relax on a forum.Thanks fellers, you rock!!!

8

Ken Elmore is the guy when it comes to building reliable LE6920’s (actually all Colts). My agency buys all of our guns from Ken, and he isn’t the cheapest guy in town. Our guns have been truely phenomenal as far as reliability goes.

9

Add the Crane O-ring and get a spare factory bolt. (Whose factory is your choice.)

If you want to learn to operate it reliably, take Dean Caputo’s M16/AR15 Operator Diagnostics Class. I took this class along with my two oldest children. You will never spend money better on your carbine. (ETA: This modifies your brain, not the carbine.)

Many can attest to Ken Elmore’s Reliabilty Package. I suggest taking Dean’s class first, though.

10

Last time I checked SAW keeps some of their reliability package a secret to protect their corner on that market.

  1. Optic -BEST I can afford. Still not sure what to do here. WISH I could afford a Short Dot, but have heard the Nightforce 1-4x is a good choice too.???

I’d stick with an Aimpoint ML3 in a Larue mount, unless you have a strong astygmatism (I do) in which case I’d use a 1.5x Compact ACOG in a Larue mount.

  1. Sling - STill not sure if I need a 2 or 3 point for general use???

2 point, and use either the Blue Force Gear Vickers or the VTAC Larue.

  1. BUIS’s -Possibly Troy brand…

Can’t really go wrong there

  1. Possibly a vertical grip from TangoDown or Magpul… or ???

TD would work well.

11

So Sub, does yours (brain that is) run more reliably now? :wink:

12

Just ordered the Crane O Ring, thanks guys.

As far as the SAW Reliability pkg goes, I would have to know what’s being done to my rifle, in order to drop the $150. That’s just how I am.

Here is a quote from Ken’s website, which tells me that I’m sure some of us could determine WHAT is actually being done to the rifle…
Here is a quote that states what is being done to the rifle (not specific of course):

“4 to 6 barrel modifications (depending on barrel type)
3 gas system modifications
2 bolt group modifications
Buffer assembly and other lower receiver parts”

My only guesses would be the following:
Bolt Group Mods:

  1. Crane O Ring/spring/extractor mod

4-6 Barrel Mods:

  1. Polish M4 feedramps maybe?

Buffer Assembly Parts:

-Maybe a new buffer spring???

I’m a novice, so that would be the only guesses I’ve got…

Not trying to bust on Ken’s game, but I’m a DIY kind of guy, and would love to find other things to do on my own for reliability…
I’m interested to hear what you guys think is actually done in this “Reliability Pkg”…

13

razorhunter,

It is my understanding that Ken Elmore does not use an O/X/D-ring. He does install an upgraded extractor spring made to his spec’s. I’m sure that he also installs the proper extractor insert (“buffer”) if required. I know that he does replace other springs in the weapon, but I’m not sure about the buffer spring.

I believe that he did replace the buffer in my carbine with one of a different weight.

I suspect that the gas-system mod’s. include changing the gas port diameter in the barrel, which would necessitate removing the front-sight base (FSB) at a minimum. It is my understanding that he re-installs the FSB with a fixture that ensures it is not canted.

I also believe that as he goes though the weapon he corrects anything that was done improperly in the original assembly that might lead to issues later. As one of Colt’s senior armorer instructors, Ken, like Dean Caputo mentioned above, knows from hard-earned experience what to look for.

All of this requires precious time of a highly-skilled/experienced individual. $150 is not an inconsequential sum to most of us, but I’m not shocked whenever I have to pay this much or more for routine tasks performed by an auto mechanic, plumber, electrician, etc. I feel better about paying someone like Ken Elmore for his time than I do some of those other guys. I consider it insurance or peace of mind. For a fun gun it’s proabably not cost justifiable. For life insurance, however, I consider it a good investment.

If/when I am able to take Dean Caputo’s class I may have a different opinion.

ETA: nyeti’s recommendation of the LE6920 with Elmore’s reliability package in another thread on another forum (no, not TOS) was instrumental in my decision.

14

About the only thing I would do to a 6920 is add a Crane O-Ring, H2 buffer and ISMI buffer spring.

Quality mags are a must. USGI mags are a good choice as are the CProducts SS mags with Magpul followers and CS springs.

I would also get a spare bolt to keep around.

C4

15

My brain runs much more reliably after Dean’s class which, in turn, makes the carbine run more reliably. Dean is the source of my sig line.:smiley:

ETA:

One stop shopping. See Grant!:smiley:

If you go this route, please let me have first shot at your Colt H buffer and spring.:cool:

16

I’ve always heard good things about the SAW reliability package.

17

Funny, I always heard it was a waste of money.

How do you make a gun 110% reliable?

18

Milkman,

Exactly how many actual customers have told you that they regretted having gotten the SAW RP? Who stated that their carbine was 110% reliable?

19

None publicly. I have shot a few Colt rifles with the SAW work and they functioned exactly like the bone stock Colt rifles shot at the same time. But then again, my M16s worked 100% as well.

No one is stating their rifle is 110% reliable, I asked because I am interested in how someone can make a 100% reliable rifle function more reliably.

20

I think there is room for improvement in all Stock AR’s as they are still using cheap springs. I also like heavier buffers with my carbines and Crane O-Rings.

C4