Slap a conventional triple shingle on the front, and put a BFG ten-speed shingle on top of that. That’s going to remain relatively low profile but you can instantly go up to 6 mags in the front. If you’re not running 6 mags you can easily fit other necessary items in the BFG shingle or run one of the conventional pouches as a pistol holster/pouch.
i like this answer best.
I do something similar. I have a couple pig mag pouch inserts for my kangaroo pouch with a bfg 10 speed triple mag pouch over that. Keeps things very low profile.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk
First I gotta say, that’s A LOT of gear for a civvie shtf situation and it’s hard to imagine what kind of scenarios you’re envisioning, but I have a PC for insurance for classes might put me at the end of a errant muzzle. Like most, if you need 10 magazines, I’ll say you’ve found yourself in a very very bad situation and being that loaded down won’t be of benefit to you or anyone else.
I run:
3 Rifle Single pouches
1 double pistol mag pouch left of that
radio to the right of the rifle pouches
admin and general purpose pouches above rifle magazine pouches and also my PC has an integrated kangaroo pouch, also very useful.
I find the GP/admin pouches are very very useful. And having a slick front helps when shooting from prone. Those 5 doubles are gonna be…annoying.
OP, you are getting a lot of good general advice and suggestions. Mainly: less is more (keep it lighter and streamlined), keep individual pouch accessibility in mind, and test out your gear before you commit and then again after you have it set up so you can ID any shortcomings.
Think through possible uses, needs, and scenarios as they will drive the gear you needs. Keep in mind that if you are in an urban or suburban area then armor and gear that is more low profile can be a big benefit by NOT drawing attention to yourself (think grey color instead of camo and slimmer profile that can fit under clothing). Ask yourself if you will be able to quickly access, don, and wear armor gear without drawing unwanted attention to yourself (can you do this at work, at home, while traveling?). I love kitted out Plate Carriers as much as the next guy, and I am also a ‘rather have it and not need it’ type, but I also realize the odds of me needing a full blown plate carrier are slim. The odds of me needing/using a slim concealable soft armor set are much higher.
Remember that the plates are the most expensive and key piece of the P.C .puzzle. It’s important to get plates that fit properly.
Some specific suggestions on the gear you have in mind:
-
The Eagle plate carrier is somewhat old tech now in the world of plate and armor carriers. You way want to consider upgrading to something newer, lighter, and slimmer, Or at least keep yourself to upgrading down the road. First Spear has some of the best offerings right now; along with Crye, SKD, TYR and a few more.
-
5 double pouches is too many, as others stated; you likely wouldn’t be able to reach them all very easily anyway. Before you buy 5, or even 3 of any pouch make sure you like it and it will work and mount on your carrier OK. Buy or borrow 1 to check it out. Take this from a guy who has bought a bunch of TACO pouches he may not use. There are differences in how easily the different TACO pouches adjust their tension, with the single rifles being the easiest to adjust and the double deckers being the toughest. Double rifles are fairly easy to adjust as well.
-
If you are carrying a rifle you may not want or need a pistol, so consider pistol pouches that can double as utility pouches as in the case that you aren’t carrying pistol mags.
-
Pistol or any type of pouch above you main rifle pouches can seriously impede accessing your rifle mags. Consider keeping that area slick for the sake of rifle mag accessibility.
-
Pouches on your sides are fine, but beware that they may block access to a holster (assuming you have one), or hang you up if you need to get in/out of a vehicle or confined spaces.
You are on the right track. Keep asking yourself about your needs vs. wants. Get hands on with few items that yo think you want and don’t get married to anything before you’ve had a chance to really evaluate it. Odds are you will change your mind a few times.
Awesome advices and recommendations here.
For the LEOs, how should civilians proceed with training/ assessing their collected gears, besides going to classes?
Most of the gears I’ve collected, I’m forced to walk/hike/hit trails for quick jog, with the gears underneath an oversized jacket during winter/snow (to attract less attention)
How do you folks exercise with your gears?
I run with a neck knife, hike with my pistol in one of these…
http://www.hillpeoplegear.com/Products/InDetail/KitBags/tabid/922/Default.aspx
If I’m out backpacking for a few days, I have a holster on the waist strap of my Eberlestock.
Great thread… Hope the OP will not object to this question.
Anyone have strong feelings about a dump pouch on a PC? I saw a video that advocated this and it sounded great but I’m not sure where it would fit on without a cumberbund.
Thanks!
I don’t see why you’d put one on your PC when you could put it on your belt, where it’s easier to access and less in the way.
That is a lot of weight and will slow you way down and burn energy. Light and fast is what I look for in training and in a SHTF situation.
In my experience 3-4 mags is good for a training class. My PC, a Tactical Tailor Fight Light carrier, is set up like this.
-3 HSGI Tacos across the lower front
-Single HSGI pistol mag taco on the front as far to the weak side as possible
-1 Admin Pouch at the top
-Radio pouch on the back, as far to the weak side as possible so I can reach it
-Hydration pouch is in my assault pack (carrying more mags, 550 cord, glow sticks, batteries, food, extra socks, extra first aid items) so I can ditch it fast if needed to run lighter.
I can also use this set-up with my duty belt if needed.
I run my IFAK, pistol holster, a spare pistol mag and rifle mag, and dump pouch on a warbelt.
Light and fast, in a SHTF you don’t want to stand and fight but fast accurate shots then break contact and run.
Thanks for the recommendations. Yea I am not going to be adding the 5 doubles anymore. There have been some great points made. And no, I don’t mind anyone else asking other questions. I’m learning as we go too!
I did a Escape and evasion class not too long ago that had a focus on the urban environment. My advice: if you can’t do pull ups in your gear you need to learn how. Being able to scramble over walls and just generally use the full three dimensional aspects of the urban is ultimately important.
My opinion on a dump pouch: for SHTF get one. It will function more for pillaging and forging than a mag dump pouch. Maxpedition makes a rolly Polly? Pouch that folds up well when not in use.
The less crap hanging off you the better.
I have two plate set ups.
One is in my patrol vehicle at all times and has a Mag pouch that holds three rifle mags and has three pistol mags piggy backed on top. I have a grenade pouch that holds two pair of cuffs, a TQ and a seat belt cutter with glass breaker. On the back I have a 1.5L water bladder. I also have a sling attached to the rig so I’m not getting all tangled up. The plate carrier has a map pocket built in and I can shove three more rifle mags in there right behind the existing mags.
I am already wearing soft body armor if I am d-oning this carrier so it is sized to me wearing my soft armor, I also have a rifle mag on my duty belt.
If I am putting this kit on, I am heading to a gunfight or a potential one where the call was given out that there is an armed person.
The second set up I have is still kind of in the building stages.
This set up is either in the house or in my car.
It has front, rear and side stand alone plates because it is most likely going to be d-oned when I am not wearing soft armor.
It has the same rifle/pistol pouch as above and an admin pocket with a flashlight/multi tool pouch and a TQ.
I am going to add a sling to this one because I decided to try it without a sling and I prefer the sling connected to the carrier.
This kit will get a MED kit eventually and I don’t know if I will put a hydration kit on it or not.
In conjunction with this carrier, I have a first line belt with a holster, 2 pistol mags, 1 rifle mag and a TQ.
When I set my carriers up I kept this in mind:
If I am putting this crap on, I’m coming to get you (bad guys).
I need to be as mobile as I am protected from projectiles.
I am not going to hunker down and battle for several hours.
I also have to be mobile enough to take you into custody, give medical attention or drag bodies to safety.
I do not train with the gear on often but I do train with it so I can get a feel of how the guns feel on the shoulder and the location of the mags on the carrier, because obviously it is different than being on the belt. I will also bump mags from the carrier to the belt because training causes me to go there first. Obviously, if I don’t have time to bump mags, I won’t therefore, I practice reloads from the belt and the carrier.
I will usually pick the hottest, most humid day or the coldest nastiest day to train with the gear on because training in the extreme conditions will give you a better idea of how you are going to preform.
I am not a super SWAT operator nor do I have any military background but I hope this helps at least a little.
Every idea helps Corey, appreciate the input!
somewhat agree…
but does “basicload on LF” consider PC a first line? I always understood a belt to be first line and PC or chest rig as second line…
and not to dis anyone’s opinion but Jason Falla told us he doesn’t consider the pistol as a secondary. my takeaway from him was that either gun is primary if you’re using it. obviously conditions and distance to contact have a lot to do with this…
my thinking may be counter to everyone else’s but if I am using my pistol (whether due to temporary malfunction or complete failure of primary), I assume I’m going to use more rounds per target than a rifle so I carry three mags on my first line (belt) and two pistol mags on my PC along with 3 AR mags, BOK, and TQ’s. completely agree with keeping the PC as slick/light as possible though. anything more than 3-4 primary mags need to go in the assault pack…
I’d agree that a PC is second line, belt being first line- but a pistol is only your primary if that’s all you’ve got. If you’ve got a carbine, then that’s the most casualty producing and therefor the primary. While carbine malfunctions do occur, more than likely if you’re transitioning to your secondary it’s because your primary is black (empty). Pistols are less effective than carbines right? Then why would you want to carry even more pistol mags when you could be carrying more effective carbine mags? Obviously it’s all shooter preference, but I don’t follow the logic of carrying more than 2-3 pistol mags when you’re also running a carbine.
Also remember most people only transition to their secondary / pistol within 25-30m or less, and a lot of us are engaging bad guys far further than that- so again, carbine mags are useful.
ever had a bolt override?..
Nope. I’m sure it happens, but I’d bet people wish they had a couple extra mags for their M4 more often than 2-3 more mags for their M9 when shit goes south. Also generally you’re not fighting alone and all your other buddies can cover you while you clear your malfunction.
I might be wrong, it’s just my opinion. If you need more than 45 rounds of 9mm you’ve got bigger problems.
well, it’s just my opinion and I could be wrong as well. I’m not a gunfighter and I don’t have experience to back up my choices. your experience is different and valid, so I’m just telling you my reasons for how I do things…
not all malfunctions are ammo or magazine related and I have witnessed and experienced stage 4 malfunctions such as bolt override and case separation that made the gun completely inoperable. that’s caused me to consider the possibility of a critical failure of my primary weapon.
some of our war fighters go into combat without a handgun so obviously, doctrine changes according to the situation. if you got bros with long guns and long engagement range, you should be covered to clear your malfunction. but I make my gear choices to cover every situation I can visualize and I don’t automatically assume engagements are always going to be greater than 50 yards.
everyone’s gear choices are personal so I’m not second-guessing anyone else’s, and don’t want to sound like I’m criticizing. lots of people only carry 3 or 4 rifle mags on their first and second line but many carry plenty more. handguns are neither as lethal, nor generally as accurate at range as a carbine, so it stands to reason that you would need more ammo if that’s all you have. two magazines (30 rounds) of pistol are roughly the same size and weight on the gear as one AR mag and I’m comfortable with that addition…
Another diversion…
What kind/size of plates are most of you using? SAPI? Some variant of shooter plate? If you use a shooter in the front, what are you using in the back?
Thanks!