The Maturation of the AR15 Owner - Is the 6920 the Endgame?

AR/M4 AR General Discussion
1

Recently I’ve realized three truths with respect to guns:

  1. The AR15 platform will do 99% of what I need a rifle to ever do.
  2. A properly inspected and zeroed Colt 6920 will do 99% of what I need an AR15 to ever do.
  3. An AR15 setup for the remaining 1% is going to suck at the other 99%

Take for example the below video recorded just a short while ago. Suppressed SBR. Aimpoint T1. Gemtech BCG. ATPIAL-C Laser. Surefire dual tapeswitch. That gun scores serious points on the cool factor.

//youtu.be/DxlhLzdZ8uU

But, “Why all the misses Eurodriver? I thought you could shoot” Yeah no kidding. Because running 300 yards (on the third try) and shooting a rifle that has an 18oz weight hanging off the end plus a quad rail, laser, flashlight, spare batteries, a tapeswitch, a suppressor mount, etc kind of sucks.

For another example - shooting at 600y last year during the initial rainbands of a hurricane.

Anyone wanna try running a 3 gun match with a 20" Krieger HBAR and a 24oz suppressor hanging off the end? Not to mention how great a FFP 4.5x Nightforce is going to be for those room-distance t-box shots. (Sarcasm)

But - and night being the only possible exception - a Colt 6920 would come damn close to doing everything the above rifles will do. Much closer to their objectives than those rifles will come to a general purpose fighting gun. A 6920 won’t melt your Gortex either. (I’m actually not trying to be a motivator in the video, I happened to have the shirt and the only Goretex I have are MARPAT…and since I was in a Rice Paddy…)

Given my experiences and curiosity, what does your rifle do that a Colt 6920 does not? Why do you have the kit that you have, and what have you found it brings to the table? I have not found a carbine on the market that will outperform a Colt 6920 in any meaningful way in any course of fire that I shoot outside of sub MOA gong matches at 600 yards. No matter what kind of cool gear I buy - I always end right back with a 6920. It just doesn’t do anything a 6920 won’t. Given the interest in the Trooper, I suspect I might not be alone in these musings.

I must caveat here that a 6920 doesn’t necessarily have to be a Colt. I use the term loosely to describe any quality, well built simple 16" carbine. I readily concede that BCM, Sionics, and others make reliable carbines, but a BCM 14.5" ELW Midlength is not the same thing as a 6920. Conversely, this is not the place to whine about your 16" Bushmaster carbine ripping off caseheads of 5.56mm ammo acting like 16" carbines are unreliable.

What does a free float rail bring to the table over a plastic MOE handguard? Less POI shift? To what amount? I haven’t seen any difference in practical shooting well out to 300 yards whether my rifle was free floated or had a KAC M4 RAS rail. “They’re stronger”? Please, let me show you my video of me running over a Magpul MOE equipped rifle with a truck… What does a custom built gun do that a 6920 doesn’t? I guess if you’re a top tier 3 gun competitor in national competitions…but who here is doing that and how well do those guns fare when they’re run over by a truck or buried in sand?

For me and guys like me, the only reason I own a firearm is to become proficient with it in as many situations as possible. I want to be able to stack outside a house, pie a window, and then shoot a moving target at 1/2 a mile in winds that make everyone stay home while the gun is caked in mud. Not everyone is like that. Some people just like to have guns to play with, or look at, or post pictures of it on the internet. This thread is not for you. I collect bottles of bourbon. I care not at all who made the glass or if the bourbon is straight or aged just a few months as long as the bottle and label are neat. I get it, but if you’re a gun nerd go be a gun nerd somewhere else. :slight_smile: I want to know what results shooters are seeing with these, frankly, very expensive modifications to the AR15 platform that I’ve simply seen little tangible benefit from.

I know everyone posts this in every thread - that is a good thing - but a Colt 6920 (or a Trooper) is roughly 7 bills. What’s that rifle not capable of doing that you do as a shooter?

Lastly, my apologies to everyone for not creating a thread about a new product release, an aesthetic design, or asking what to buy. Also, I’m not trying to hate on anyone for building a fancy gun of course. I just want to stimulate discussion on, and learn from the forum, which parts are for show, which provide tangible benefit, and how to tell if it’s worth it.

2

This should be a good discussion.

I think it’s like everything else firearm related. People tend to get caught up in the new, cool, whatever and outright dismiss the fact they simply need to orient and validate their equipment to their specific needs and purposes.

That’s not to say having all the cool stuff is bad but mission drives gear the focus should be on increasing proficiency at the most fundamental level. Gear that augments that after the fact is just a bonus.

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3

This. Is a highly relevant thread now more than ever. You can make a basic carbine more comfortable but if you can’t shoot with it; what then?

Some have seen my “slutty” Colt. It is super basic save for a FF KAC RAS that does nothing major except be a rail I got at a good price. So named because it doesn’t care what I do to it. It just goes. I can put on and take off things I need at will because Pic rails aint going anywhere. FSBs dont break. Colt makes barrels that will always be able to hit a human at 400 yds, carbine gas because thats how Colt makes em.

Dont look sexy but it just feels right. Bullet dont care. Target don’t care. War Pony is sum of its parts and the Slutty Colt appellation reflects how little its owner cares about it.

Its meant to be used. Specialty rifles are fine. This is America.
But you can’t buy proficiency and you cant buy a history. You gotta make it and earn it.

Everybody in the world will sell you anything and everything but The Work.

You can’t do much better. Buy the rifle. Shoot the rifle.
Know. What. You. Are. Doing.

Get it dirty.

This is the Rennaissance of the American Rifleman.
You arent allowed to be fat dumb and happy anymore
Get a 6920 and shoot.

4

  1. I’m lost what you are talking about with the 6920 title, and then listing off your SBR.

  2. I guess the last line is supposed to be edgy, but this thread is a concept which has been talked about at least as much if not more than the above, with the possible exception of the “what to buy threads”.

  3. I don’t think many people are going to argue that a 6920 is an outstanding base / platform.

5

I started writing a fairly lengthy response and then realized I could some this up with a lot fewer key strokes.

  • Most people waste time worrying about shit that doesn’t matter. It doesn’t really matter that you have a specific AR variant to cover every single possible SHTF scenario, because the average gun owner/survivalist is going to die from heart disease or type 2 diabetes before they die from having the wrong AR setup.

  • Colt is a known quantity, it works. Why even mess around with other brands? IMO people have too many choices as it is. So many brands have come about since I started shooting that it makes my soul hurt. I always revert back to Colt, DD, BCM, LMT, KAC. If you don’t know which one of them to buy then just buy a Colt and by the time you know which one to buy you won’t need to ask. If it’s not one of those then why even bother? Those brands offer a gun owner everything they could possibly ever want in a rifle, and they’re all known, quality quantities. If you deviate from them, you’re only doing so to feel special. And that’s stupid.

  • Most people forget that a gun is a tool. This is the one major reason people don’t buy Colts and Glocks. They have an asinine and immature desire to feel different. “I don’t want to buy a Colt because that’s what everyone has.” Yea well it ****ing works. Get over it, buy a colt, your parents lied to you, you aren’t special.

  • A 16in carbine with a WML and an Aimpoint will do 99% of what 99% of average people need a rifle to do. It may not do it as well as a specialized piece but it will do it well enough that it probably won’t matter for most people. It’s not glorious but its reality, it works.

  • A shooter who spends 1k on a Colt Trooper and 5k on training and ammo is infinitely more deadly than someone who spent 5k on rifles and 1k on training.

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6

Most probably won’t argue it, but then they’ll go on to post a thread and subsequently spend way to many hours worrying about which profile scionics barrel to buy and weather their aero upper will fit in their spikes lower or not.

There’s a very simple way to avoid the painful confusion. 6920.

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7

Well stated.

8

Euro - I actually built a 16" PSA Freedom Rifle to run over with my truck and throw around in the mud like you did your 6920. I put a fixed Troy Battlesight on the rear and went out to zero it. The little stainless steel SOB shot so good and I had such fun shooting the little devil that I nixed the mud and the blood and the beer.

It is now my daughter’s rifle (wink, wink) I put Magpul MOE handguards on it, an M-Lok VFG, an M-Lok QD sling mount, and a SOB B-sling on it for her (wink, wink). Shoots under 2 moa. right now I have less than 200 rounds through it, but it is completely functionally, so far. Not bad for a 159.00 upper with free shipping.

My go to rifle (versus SBR) is a 16" with an MI SS 13" rail on it, a stubby VFG, light run forward right side of rifle (I’m a left), Ti-7 stock, ARMS 40’s front and rear, Aimpoint PRO. It has one of Greg Sully’s perfect lowers, a BCM upper with a Green Mountain barrel.

Really the only thing it does better than the little PSA carbine is that it is more comfortable to shoot. It allows me to extend out more and not be so cramped - my sleeve length is 36. Plus I like my hand placement on the slimmer rail versus the hand guards.

At this point in my life shooting is something I enjoy, like others enjoy golf. So our motivations may differ. I rarely wear gloves, don’t really have a problem with heat on any of the rifles, because I don’t fo mag dumps. Generally, every couple mags I’m giving the rifle a rest to change up targets. A lot of the time I’m hiking from 1 to 3 hundred yards to paint steel (okay a lot of times at 300 and for sure when I shoot 600, I drive). So the rifle has plenty of time to cool.

That is one of the things that is so dang cool about these rifles, you can add your little quirks - I have a Geiselle Enhanced Bolt Catch on it, a KAC Ambidextrous Mag Release, and a V7 3 Gun short throw safety - because I like the way they operate.

9

There are a lot of things that a rifle can do that a 6920 cannot. However much those may be worth to you, and how much impact they actually have on the task at hand (scoring hits) is another thing indeed.

Mid-gas is nice. It lets you get farther out towards the muzzle and still have an FSP. Or, you get a 6920-R, and it’s FF out to 13". Will mid-gas make me a more accurate shooter? I highly doubt it. Are there mechanical performance gains to be had? Probably, but they are incremental, and likely of such a slim margin that to call them necessary is to inform everyone around you that your priorities are lost in the sauce.

A precision stainless steel recce-type barrel is great. To take advantage of it, you’ll need an LPVO at the least. The recce-type of accurized rifle is probably the only argument to be made against a 6920. Even so, a stock 6920 firing 77gr OTM is still more than accurate enough to hit torsos out to the limits of the cartridge’s effective range. If, that is, you are good enough to make those hits. Even then, how much of an improvement are we talking about? What was the cost in $$$ invested? The weight gained?

Ambidextrous controls are great. They also cost very little to obtain, and can be done by hand with minimal tools in minutes. Also, plenty of lefties have run right-hand-dominant rifles for a long time, and the main issue that most have is the ejection across their face. There isn’t much to be done about that with an AR-pattern rifle.

Past these details (I am sure that I’m missing a few), you really need to start talking about specialty rifles, such as the SPR/DMR or a mk18.

Honestly, the 6920-R is such a sexy deal that I am considering getting one despite already having a 16" AR, and thus having the problem ‘solved’. In the world of hammers, it hammers pretty damn well.

10

The 6920 is for sure the best deal in rifles that has existed in my lifetime. The prices right now are unreal. And I agree it can do almost anything I would ever need it to do, which is why its very similar M4 cousins are general issue weapons. It is a Jack-of -all-trades, and it out-masters more things than most users. I can’t find a logical reason to buy any other rifle right now.

However, Eurodriver, when does it cease to be a 6920 and turn into a special snowflake gun? Lighter barrel? Shorter barrel with longer rail? What about a Geissele trigger and a muzzlebrake and a whizz-bang charging handle with all different furniture? At some point, a gun put together from a stripped receiver isn’t inferior (with the right attention to detail), just a shorter path to customization with fewer leftover parts.

My go-to rifle is built from parts, but I have no illusion or intent for it to be significantly different from my last work gun. Other than the longer rail, I didn’t really want it to be very different, functionally.

11

You are 100% correct sir, over the years I’ve had all sorts of different config ar15s and I always end up grabbing my 6920 when I have something to shoot/in a hurry. It works and works well no matter what ammo is in the magazine or how dirty it is.

12

IDK bro, for me a 10.3-11.5 suppressed rifle is all I need. If I ever need the rifle for real I’m guessing I won’t be putting my ear pro on all nice, I’d prefer to not totally wreck my hearing… Besides I don’t do much shooting at ranges beyond 100 yards and if I ever need the a rifle for real, even in the most Red Dawn of scenarios I cannot imagine taking a shot over 100 yards… But I do get it, simplifying what your needs are and focusing on that makes sense. I have several handguns but I only really “need” 1 of my G19s and a G43 and I’m good, same principles.

13

That’s a good question, and of course not one there is an objective answer to. I actually thought about diving into that in my OP (which I should probably clean it up a bit given the circumstances behind when I wrote it :)) but it was already getting lengthy.

The point that I was making in a broad sense is that so many guys with ARs spend more time figuring out what neat new gadget to buy for it than learning how to shoot the damn thing. If you are running skinny drills from the standing, kneeling, and prone at 25 yards on the reg and can hit a penciled in T box consistently then my post doesn’t really apply to you. Of course, there is nothing inherently bad with buying a Geissele trigger or throwing a free float rail on your gun.

But I can’t tell you how many guys sit next to me at the range with a $2,500 Frankenbuild who think they need all of that new stuff to make hits at 300 yards and then spend half the day trying to figure out where there impacts are. Take that $1,800 extra you spent on fancy stuff and go have someone teach you how to shoot. Hell, watch some YouTube videos and teach yourself how to shoot. That’s 6,000 rounds of Wolf Gold you could buy with a 6920. With that many rounds down the pipe the probability of improving your skill set, even by accident, is basically 1.

Late night posting results.

Do you hear all of those misses? Ran the same thing with a bone stock 6920 and irons and had none. Why? No gas in your face with a 6920, it weighs significantly less, and flatter trajectory. My point, which I probably should have stated, is that you can have $2,000 in cool shit on your gun and you might find it actually makes you worse.

Unfortunately the drone battery died, but we’ll do it again soon.

14

Great thread, Euro.

In your opinion what does the free float rail bring to the table - such as what the 6920 Trooper is configured with? Do the pros outweigh the cons, cost aside?

I ask because currently the 6720 is essentially the same price as the 6920-R Trooper. However, the 6720 is literally ready to go out of the box - just add an Aimpoint PRO and maybe a IWC mounted light and away you go. The Trooper is getting a LOT of attention here, and for good reason, but it still needs iron sights just to get on the same level as the 6720. (…and apparently heat wraps/grip panels for the rail tube)

6920-R Trooper: $685 (+$80 for MBUS pair = $765)
6720: $717
6920 Magpul SL: $789

15

The trooper has kind of thrown a wrench in the “Just buy a 6920” crowd. All things being equal, and in this case I think they are, a FF full length rail is going to make more sense than a plastic hanguard. I mean, really, I don’t see anyone advocating buying a Magpul MOE equipped 6920 over a Centurion Rail equipped Trooper for a $43 in savings. I would absolutely get the Trooper. Period. Such an easy decision.

The issue in my OP was more along the lines of guys already having a rifle and want to throw a $350 RIS on it. Do they shoot from barricades that often? Do they have IR lasers? Are they shooting from inside a vehicle? Look at how many guys are talking about dumping their Keymond BCM rails for MLOK. Why? Did it suddenly break? My point is not than a FF rail is bad, it isn’t, but do its benefits improve your shooing more than an equivalent $ amount of ammo or instruction.

For the overwhelming vast majority of gun owners, including me, that answer is firmly “No”.

16

I understand and see the wisdom of your point. My very basic BCM 16" middie fills the role because the extra 2" of handguard length makes a huge difference to me (basic meaning FSB, MOE HG, Aimpoint PRO). I think of it as my “serious” rifle.
I do have trouble hitting anything smaller than a clay pigeon with it at 100 yards, so my scoped, G2S equipped, free floated 20" rifle is used for “fun” stuff like shooting small stuff and groups at the range (it’s also a simple gun in its own way).

Andy

17

Yes, in 99% of the time, the 6920 is the endgame. The other 1% can significantly benefit from geissele fcg, FF, etc.

18

I use to get all wet over SBR’s and honestly I still do. There cool, there a little more exclusive… yadda yadda yadda… but ALL things considered, the reality is that a well setup 16" Carbine gives more versatility than anything else. Period.

Pros of a 16" Carbine:

  • Is immediately and readily accessible TODAY.
  • Works fine for CQB
  • Is highly effective out to 600m
  • less gassy when suppressed
  • more muzzle velocity

Cons:

  • isn’t the ultimate CQB weapon
  • gets a little long with a can

Pros of an 11.5:

  • More murdery for CQB work.
  • Shorter OAL with a can attached

Cons of an 11.5:

  • Not readily accessible. Requires additional paperwork and a lengthy wait time.
  • Not as effective past 300m

Let’s be realistic here and look at what our rifle is really for… If I’m honest, it’s for serious social work outside my house. It’s beside my bed, but it’s probably not the gun I’m grabbing if someone is banging on my door at 0330 in the morning. For that I have a G19 w/ Surefire and some 21rd happy sticks.

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19

Pretty much.

Or, the Colt AR6720, or AR15A4.

Did put a 14.5" (P&W) barrel on my 6920, after 19 years…

20

I would say “maturation” is the right word. At least it describes me. Early on I’d buy a rifle… regardless of how crappy it was…then run home and order a bunch of useless crap. You don’t want to know how much I spent on a Century Golani! Luckily for me Obama came along!

Stock 6920 is what I have and the only AR I need or want. I’m basic, my gear is basic. The ONLY addition it has is the old discontinued Surefire M500a dedicated forend light. Came that way when I bought it. My only other AR is the 6721. Completely stock to include the carry handle. It was my first Colt and at the time it was too good a price to pass up.

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