THe Bush admin seeks to limit Heller

apparently Bush isn’t quite the friend we thought.

http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/uncategorized/us-supports-gun-rights-but-more-narrowly/

U.S. supports gun rights, but more narrowly
Friday, January 11th, 2008 10:19 pm | Lyle Denniston | Print This Post
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The Bush Administration urged the Supreme Court Friday night to rule that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to have a gun for private use, but argued that the D.C. Circuit Court went too far in applying that personal right view. The appeals court, the new brief said, seems to have adopted a “more categorical approach” to gun control laws than is proper.

In a move designed at least in part to protect federal gun laws from being struck down, the new brief urged the Justices to uphold an individual right to a gun and adopt a flexible standard for judging specific laws, and then return the pending test case from the District of Columbia back to the Circuit Court for another look. Tellingly, the government’s friend-of-court brief was not labeled as a supporting brief for either side in the case of District of Columbia v. Heller (07-290).

The government brief can be downloaded here.

Filed by U.S. Solicitor General Paul D. Clement, the brief took no direct position on the constitutionality of the 1976 D.C. law that is at issue: a flat ban on private possession of handguns. The Circuit Court, in a ruling last March, struck down the law, finding that it violates the Second Amendment on the understanding that the Amendment protects an individual, not a collective, right. Clement did comment that the D.C. pistol ban “may well fail” if tested under the approach he recommended, but he did not argue that it would necessarily fail.

“The Court,” Clement summed up at the close of the brief, “should affirm that the Second Amendment, no less than other provisions of the Bill of Rights, secures an individual right, and should clarify that the right is subject to the more flexible standard of review described above. If the Court takes those foundational steps, the better course would be to remand [to the Circuit Court}.”

The “more flexible standard of review” the brief proposed is, according to the government, a form of “heightened scrutiny.” Here is how it is spelled out:

“When, as here, a law directly limits the private possession of ‘Arms’ in a way that has no grounding in Framing-era practice, the Second Amendment requires that the law be subject to heightened scrutiny that considers (a) the practical impact of the challenged restrictions on the plaintiff’s ability to possess firearms for lawful purposes (which depends in turn on the nature and functional adequacy of available alternatives), and (b) the strength of the government’s interest in enforcement of the relevant restriction.”

The brief added: “Under that intermediate level of review, the ‘rigorousness’ of the inquiry depends on the degree of the burden on protected conduct, and important regulatory intgerests are typically sufficient to justify reasonable restrictions.”

The D.C. handgun ban, the brief contended, is the kind of gun control that would call for the kind of “close scrutiny” being proposed. That law, it said, bans “a commonly-used and commonly-possessed firearm in a way that has no grounding in the Framing-era practice.”

The Circuit Court, Clement commented, “appears to have adopted a more categorical approach” that he was advocating. The Circuit Court decision, he said, “could be read to hold that the Second Amendment categorically prohibits any ban on a category of ‘Arms’ that can be traced back to the Founding era. If adopted by this Court, such an analysis could cast doubt on the constitutionality of existing federal legislation prohibiting the possession of certain firearms, including machineguns. However, the text and history of the Second Amendment point to a more flexible standard of review.”

The brief continued: “Just as the Second Congress expressed judgments about what ‘Arms’ were appropriate for certain members of the militia, Congress today retains discretion in regulating ‘Arms,’ including those with military uses, in ways that further legitimate government interests. Under an appropriate standard of review, existing federal regulations, such as the prohibition on machineguns, readily pass constitutional muster.” Some machineguns that are banned by federal law might meet the D.C. law’s definition of a pistol, the brief said.

It was not at all surprising that the Administration brief supported the individual rights view of the Amendment’s scope. Although the Justice Department had taken no part in the lower courts as they weighed the D.C. gun ban, then-Attorney General John Ashcroft in 2001 publicly adopted the individual rights view.

And neither was it a surprise that the position the Department took was motivated at least in considerable part by the felt need to assure continued enforcement of some federal gun control laws. Even though the government for more than six years has held the individual rights view of the Amendment, it has yet to take a position in a court case that a particular gun law was invalid under that view.

In arguing in the end that the case should be returned to the Circuit Court, Clement’s brief said that there are factual and legal issues that the lower court did not consider in its March ruling.

It suggested that one issue that deserves further airing is the practical impact of another part of the D.C. gun law that requires that any other kind of firearm kept in the home be kept unloaded or with a trigger lock in place. The local man who challenged the gun law has argued that the trigger lock provision may bar a resident of the city from even having a working shotgun or rifle at home.

Whether the law puts a “functional firearm” out of local residents’ reach, the government brief said, may depend on whether the local law can be read to allow possession at home of a working long gun.

If the law can be read that way, there would then arise, Clement suggested, the factual issue of whether the guns that remained available are not as well suited to self-defense in the home as a handgun would be.

Those questions, the brief said, are better left, in the first instance, to the lower courts. In a footnote at the end of the brief, Clement suggested that, if the Circuit Court ultimately held that some or all of the D.C. gun law’s restrictions are unconstitutional, “a remand will also give that court the opportunity to state more precisely the scope of its remedial holding” — that is, just what parts of the law are being invalidated.

Friday was the due day for friend-of-court briefs by groups supporting the D.C. government’s appeal in the case, or briefs by anyone joining in the case without taking sides with either the local government or with the gun law challengers. As of Friday night, 19 briefs had been filed to support the District of Columbia appeal.

Briefs by the gun law’s challengers, and friend-of-court briefs supporting that side, are due in about a month. The case is expected to be heard by the Court in March.

Justice? Just us.

This is a really dumb question but where is the NRA? Might be a golden oppurtinity. Where are they and what are they doing with my money! Anyone know? Thanks.

…I’ll be damned…
Some parting shot that is…

Unfortunately, Bush has never been a friend to true conservatives so It’s no surprise to me. I voted for him and I’d do it again given the options at the time but I can’t wait for him to be gone.

Never been much of a friend to gun owners, and don’t even get me started on the border…

rmdugan, I don’t believe I could have conveyed my thoughts as concisely as you just did. :slight_smile:

Statement of the National Rifle Association
By Wayne LaPierre And Chris Cox
On The Pending U.S. Supreme Court Case
In the coming months, the U.S. Supreme Court will consider the constitutionality of Washington, D.C.‘s ban on handgun ownership and self-defense in law-abiding residents’ homes. The Court will first address the question of whether the Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, as embodied in the Bill of Rights, protects the rights of individuals or a right of the government. If the Court agrees that this is an individual right, they will then determine if D.C.'s self-defense and handgun bans are constitutional.

The position of the National Rifle Association is clear. The Second Amendment protects the fundamental, individual right of law-abiding citizens to own firearms for any lawful purpose. Further, any law infringing this freedom, including a ban on self-defense and handgun ownership, is unconstitutional and provides no benefit to curbing crime. Rather, these types of restrictions only leave the law-abiding more susceptible to criminal attack.

The U.S. Government, through its Solicitor General, has filed an amicus brief in this case. We applaud the government’s recognition that the Second Amendment protects a fundamental, individual right that is “central to the preservation of liberty.” The brief also correctly recognizes that the D.C. statutes ban “a commonly-used and commonly-possessed firearm in a way that has no grounding in Framing-era practice,” the Second Amendment applies to the District of Columbia, is not restricted to service in a militia and secures the natural right of self-defense.

However, the government’s position is also that a “heightened” level of judicial scrutiny should be applied to these questions. The National Rifle Association believes that the Court should use the highest level of scrutiny in reviewing the D.C. gun ban. We further believe a complete ban on handgun ownership and self-defense in one’s own home does not pass ANY level of judicial scrutiny. Even the government agrees that “the greater the scope of the prohibition and its impact on private firearm possession, the more difficult it will be to defend under the Second Amendment.” A complete ban is the kind of infringement that is the greatest in scope. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit correctly ruled that D.C.'s statutes are unconstitutional. We strongly believe the ruling should be upheld by the U.S. Supreme Court.

The National Rifle Association will be filing an amicus brief in this case and will provide additional information to our members as this case moves through the legal process.

Please refer questions to NRA Grassroots at 1-800-392-8683.

the entire Bush clan are east coast blue bloods that transplanted themselves to Texas and with a few yee-has, were suddenly all-American good ol’ boys.

They have not, and will not represent conservatives. If 9/11 hadn’t happened we would have had a slightly more conservative term than Bush the First, maybe.

It would be better if the POTUS just stayed completely out of this affair.

Couldn’t have said it better.

Here’s a little more by way of editorial comment, which I also completely agree with…

[b]Bad Brief
The Bush DOJ shoots at the Second Amendment.

By John R. Lott Jr.

A lot of Americans who believe in the right to own guns were very disappointed this weekend. On Friday, the Bush administration’s Justice Department entered into the fray over the District of Columbia’s 1976 handgun ban by filing a brief to the Supreme Court that effectively supports the ban. The administration pays lip service to the notion that the Second Amendment protects gun ownership as an “individual right,” but their brief leaves the term essentially meaningless.

Quotes by the two sides’ lawyers say it all. The District’s acting attorney general, Peter Nickles, happily noted that the Justice Department’s brief was a “somewhat surprising and very favorable development.” Alan Gura, the attorney who will be representing those challenging the ban before the Supreme Court, accused the Bush administration of “basically siding with the District of Columbia” and said that “This is definitely hostile to our position.” As the lead to an article in the Los Angeles Times said Sunday, “gun-control advocates never expected to get a boost from the Bush administration.”

As probably the most prominent Second Amendment law professor in the country privately confided in me, “If the Supreme Court accepts the solicitor general’s interpretation, the chances of getting the D.C. gun ban struck down are bleak.”

The Department of Justice argument can be boiled down pretty easily. Its lawyers claim that since the government bans machine guns, it should also be able to ban handguns. After all, they reason, people can still own rifles and shotguns for protection, even if they have to be stored locked up. The Justice Department even seems to accept that trigger locks are not really that much of a burden, and that the locks “can properly be interpreted” as not interfering with using guns for self-protection. Yet, even if gun locks do interfere with self-defense, DOJ believes the regulations should be allowed, as long as the District of Columbia government thinks it has a good reason.

Factually, there are many mistakes in the DOJ’s reasoning: As soon as a rifle or shotgun is unlocked, it becomes illegal in D.C., and there has never been a federal ban on machine guns. But these are relatively minor points. Nor does it really matter that the only academic research on the impact of trigger locks on crime finds that states that require guns be locked up and unloaded face a five-percent increase in murder and a 12 percent increase in rape. Criminals are more likely to attack people in their homes, and those attacks are more likely to be successful. Since the potential of armed victims deters criminals, storing a gun locked and unloaded actually encourages crime.

The biggest problem is the standard used for evaluating the constitutionality of regulations. The DOJ is asking that a different, much weaker standard be used for the Second Amendment than the courts demands for other “individual rights” such as speech, unreasonable searches and seizures, imprisonment without trial, and drawing and quartering people.

If one accepts the notion that gun ownership is an individual right, what does “the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed” mean? What would the drafters of the Bill of Rights have had to write if they really meant the right “shall not be infringed”? Does the phrase “the right of the people” provide a different level of protection in the Second Amendment than in the First and Fourth?

But the total elimination of gun control is not under consideration by the Supreme Court. The question is what constitutes “reasonable” regulation. The DOJ brief argues that if the DC government says gun control is important for public safety, it should be allowed by the courts. What the appeals court argued is that gun regulations not only need to be reasonable, they need to withstand “strict scrutiny” — a test that ensures the regulations are narrowly tailored to achieve the desired goal.

Perhaps the Justice Department’s position isn’t too surprising. Like any other government agency, it has a hard time giving up its authority. The Justice Department’s bias can been seen in that it finds it necessary to raise the specter of machine guns 10 times when evaluating a law that bans handguns. Nor does the brief even acknowledge that after the ban, D.C.’s murder rate only once fell below what it was in 1976.

Worried about the possibility that a Supreme Court decision supporting the Second Amendment as an individual right could “cast doubt on the constitutionality of existing federal legislation,” the Department of Justice felt it necessary to head off any restrictions on government power right at the beginning.

But all is not lost. The Supreme Court can of course ignore the Bush administration’s advice, but the brief does carry significant weight. President Bush has the power to fix this by ordering that the solicitor general brief be withdrawn or significantly amended. Unfortunately, it may take an uprising by voters to rein in the Justice Department.

— John Lott is the author of “Freedomnomics, upon which part of this article is based, and a senior research scientist at the University of Maryland[/b].

http://www.usdoj.gov/contact-us.html

You’re right, were have the actual fiscal conservatives gone? The democrats have acted far more responsibly with our tax dollars than has the GOP over the last two decades and that is a true change of course.

Bush has quite a clear record of being an enemy of the U.S. Constitution. Especially in the areas of due process and privacy. I’ve never understood why gunowners didn’t think his “Executive can do anythying” attitude wouldn’t apply to the 2d Amendment, too. I’ve had many conversations about the slippery slope things like the Patriot Act have put this country on in the years following 9/11 at my local range. It is easy to see that if we’re willing to give up things like the requirement that the government actually have a warrant to search or eavesdrop, then we’re making it much, MUCH easier for things like the goverment banning and confiscating your AR-15 and your high-cap magazines.

Now, I voted for the man the first time, but after seeing the power-grab he started I never voted for him again. Truth is, the errosion he has started to our constitutional protections has done far more harm to our 2d amendment rights than any law Clinton could ever dream up whether you love him or hate him. Repealing a law or allowing it to sunset is far easier than regaining rights we’ve let slip away by a power hungry executive branch.

Just think if we get an executive with a penchant for banning guns. Wouldn’t it be easier if they didn’t have to deal with protections such as due process? Where we are now is very scary.

Word. :rolleyes:

Color me cranky. Not shocked, but cranky.

The Bush DOJ’s amicus curiae shouldn’t surprise anyone, given this administration’s history and a quick glance at the calendar. And since SCOTUS isn’t obliged to issue a simple up-or-down ruling on Heller, even a “favorable” result could well be messy (albeit different).

Think?

Prepare.

Scary, indeed. :mad:

It’s really sad where this once great country is going :mad:

Yup. I see police-state Orwellian fascists in the GOP, and nanny-state Huxley fascists in the DNC. With either path we are headed toward fascism, we just get to choose between being shot to death or hugged to death.

The future looks mighty dim.

Well when he was Texas Governor he was great for gun owners, passing EVERY single Pro-gun bill sent to him (no anti-gun bills were sent to him). But then when he was in Texas, he was surrounded by Texans.

It just seems when people get to DC, they become infected with Beltway disease, and lose all of the values.

Worried about the possibility that a Supreme Court decision supporting the Second Amendment as an individual right could “cast doubt on the constitutionality of existing federal legislation,”

That, sure would suck now wouldn’t it? :rolleyes:

Purpose of guns:

Killing out of control politicians
Killing scumbags that want to kill you
Killing people who want to sieze your shit against your will
Food

Now seeing as goverment has the means to control all of the above, why the hell would any government want an armed population. It is 100% not in their interest unless there is the threat of invasion from a foreign power

People in power want more power. Too much power brings things to a head, but its far easier to control unarmed people. Not hard to do the math here

Founding Fathers are sure to be rolling over in their graves.

So the government is all for the individual right argument, as long as they get to keep all of their gun control laws that deny us said right.

Nice, but no surprise.

The “math” that’s troublesome is the fact that the GOP is now being so stunningly proactive in they’re vocal opposition to our rights…when they should sit back and keep their god damn mouths shut.

Jorge Bush makes me sick…and its taken some people a long time to realize the view they’re seeing is actually from under the bus they’ve been thrown under.

And some refer to the Dems as the sheep. :rolleyes:

Love him or hate him, President Bush is our current Commander-in-Chief and should be accorded due respect.

This thread has run its course.