Except for the TA31 line.
The eye relief certainly isn’t ideal on the TA31. I’m a NTCH shooter so it’s viable but assuredly not utopian.
If the Marine Corps didn’t teach NTCH before they adopted ACOGs I’d swear they did it because of the TA31’s :laugh:
Tagged for reference.
That’s not necessary.
Upper-right side of the thread header, there’s a drop-down marked “Thread Tools.”
Click it, click “Subscribe.” Does the same thing as posting…but without the pesky necroposting that adds nothing to the topic.
Well since it has been resurrected I guess I will post my findings.
I acquired a TA33-8A recently and needed to sight it in and make sure it was GTG. I took it to an indoor range as it was the most convenient and I was just doing a sight in and T&E. After sighting it in (it has the Trijicon mount by the way) I did some both eye open dobble tap stuff. I was very pleased at how the BAC worked with this model. I tried it with a few TA31’s but it never really worked like this one. Be it the redical color or the FOV or the eye relief I don’t know. While looking through the ACOG with both eyes open all I could see was the redical. My hole field of view was magnified and as I scanned the back stop of the range it was like looking through binoculars. Very cool. I spent a brief amount of time with a TA47-2A (2x20) and I would say hands down I like the 33 more. Will I keep it? We’ll see as I am really liking the red dot’s and most of my shooting is sub 100 yards but as far as ACOG’s go I like the proformance of the 33 best. YMMV.
I prefer the TA33 the best for trying to keep track of your surroundings. You don’t have to look around your optic. On a square range it’s not a big deal, but you get the idea. I shoot ntch and it’s mounted in about the middle of my upper receiver.
This is partly why I choose the TA33. As you can see coming from the Aimpoint compM4 to my ACOG the size is similar and the so is the weight. Weight was somewhat important to me, as I didn’t want to add to it by adding a magnifier to the Aimpoint set up and I wanted magnification.
I find with the ACOG, as I’m getting used to it, I have speed in target acquisition. It’s pretty fast. I liked the TA11 well enough, but size, weight, and price all came to mind. It really didn’t give me that much more in application to warrant the increase in those areas.
I choose the green chevron. The chevron because I was most used to that reticle and green because to me, I could see it the best. Red in bright light looks like a star burst. I have a hard time with focusing on it. Amber doesn’t work in some backgrounds, so it wasn’t a consideration.
I also liked the TA33 4 clicks to an inch at 100 more so than the 3 clicks to an inch of that of the TA11. Easier for me to remember and slightly finer adjustments.
As you can see I just have stock mounts. I must say the Aimpoint mount was nice. I did like that. When it was tight it wouldn’t tighten any more, it just ratcheted. The Trijicon used Colt style knobs to tighten it down. Nothing fancy, but it works. I’d like a through lever set up, but I’m afraid I wouldn’t like it. Reason being is they sit lower and I already have a slight shadow from the front sight. As stated Larue puts it 1/4" lower. So there would be a shadow pretty close to my aiming point. I like ADM mounts even more, but I guess they are slightly lower yet than the Larue. Not going to work for me. So I guess it will stay as is for a while. Right now my fat head is comfortable as is. That is about all I got.
If the relief on the TA31 is such an issue, why doesnt the Marine Corps switch to thed TA11, or TA33?
And why would they select the TA31 in the first place?
When they first started going for them, in the 02-03 time-frame, the intent was to push 2 per squad so that there was an organic, kinda-sorta designated marksman capability, so the 4x magnification was probably weighed more heavily than the eye relief.
The overall success was enough that it later became a program of record as the RCO.
The TA11 is now a program of record optic, in the form of the SDO.
Ain’t that simple.
And why would they select the TA31 in the first place?
I could breathe fire about this for days.
The (conventional) military chose the M9 and Burst, but that doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.
So if you shoot ntch it’s still a big issue? I was thinking about picking up a rcoM4.
Concensus says the TA33 would be a better choice?
With the TA31 I get smacked in the shooting glasses every few rounds rapid fire and I am not recoil sensitive at all. I run ntch and with the TA33 not even close to an issue. The bullet drop comp is 600 yard instead of the 800 with the TA31-ROCM4 but most would not engage past 600 yards with a 5.56 round anyway… YMMV.
The ONLY reason I would ever recommend owning an RCOM4(or A4) is if you are issued one and desire to clone your work gun for training opportunities that you can’t bring your work gun to.
The TA33 is a better choice if you are insistent on owning an AGOC. Otherwise, there are better ways to spend your money in my experience and opinion.
TA11 offers more eye relief in case you use it on a 308, say TA11C. Every bit helps and even then it’s marginal. TA11C works well with 16" barrel and 69+ grain.
Another really cool choice is TA11J-308.
I think the red donut is great for CQB but not so good for precision at 300m. At 400m the crosshairs kick in and then the 3.5x power is not really sufficient. Long range shooting with ACOG is kind of an after-thought. It kind of does everything but nothing all that well. It’s the best optic from 50-200m but that’s about it (and maybe that’s plenty).
In a similar price range, I would look at other alternatives. For example S&B with a flash-dot. Admittedly it’s not in the same price range. Or one of the 1-4 scopes by Swarovski.
Tritium burns out and it’s difficult / expensive to replace. Easier to have a much brighter illuminated reticle where you can DIY battery swap once a year instead of having extensive downtime letting Trijicon do it.
I love acogs (except for QCB).
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I have a TA11 with green cross hairs and a TA31 with green horseshoe. I love the TA11, especially with the cross hair reticle. I don’t have experience with the TA33. The eye relief, FOV, 3.5X mag and brightness of the TA11 are perfect. Weight and size are the only downside, but is not as noticeable as you might think since it is roughly centered.
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Green vs. red horseshoe: I had a TA31 red horseshoe, and sent it for service at which point I had them swap out for a green horseshoe. I wish I had the red horseshoe back. I like the green triangle on my TR24, so I thought I’d like the green horseshoe. However, the red seemed to be better against a variety of backgrounds and seemed more refined to my eye. Having said that, I prefer the green cross hair to the red. So, if you can look through various reticles, it would probably be helpful.
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Horseshoe vs. other: I always thought the horseshoe would be the best. However, after having owned and shot using both the horseshoe and illuminated cross hairs, the cross hairs are far superior in every department (imho). The horse shoe and the chevron seem to “float in space” too much to quickly draw the eye and easily aquire the target. I find that the thick bars on this reticle draw my eye quickly to the center, while the illuminated center locks it on target. Even when the illuminated portion gets washed out, the bars quickly center the optic on target. It also seems to be faster up close than other ACOG reticles, due to the thick bars.
Here’s a comparison of the two reticles.
That TA11J-308G reticle looks very impressive, I never liked the donut that much for precision at 200-300m.
How thick is the illuminated part of the reticle in terms of MOA? 1/4? Or even smaller.
tagged for reference. Wish there was a 3x35 Trijicon with a 20+ Moa circle with a 1.75 MOA dot. Really like the 33, but the 11 has better light gathering from talking to other owners and reading reviews. Like that objective lens size on the 11, but really like the 3 power on the 33.
Just a quick question but can you tell much of a difference between the .5x of the two? I have a TA11H-G and am with you on how well it picks up light even with a killflash on it. I think that field of view makes a larger impact on how ‘fast’ a scope feels, at least to me.
What I would really like to see is a new body for the 3x type, not just the 2x20 TA44 extended. Might get some more out of it. That and would also like to see the TA31 given better eye relief at the cost of reduced magnification as I find the TA31 sized about perfect.
That and a built in adjustable cover for the fiber optic like on the AccuPoint line.
The more I shoot other optics, the more I really like my TA33. I had put it down for a good long while mucking around with other things, but recently picked it back up because it was on an upper I needed to use on a T&E lower.
Mine’s the red chevron, and I’d like to try the green donut and the green chevron, but the red is getting it done for me and the point gives me a little more (perceived?) precision and I’d hate to ditch it and buy another one only to find I missed the one I had.
I’m no CQB guy, never stormed a house or anything, but using the front lens cover trick makes it very workable. I can run the 2x2x2 in <2.5 seconds and the 1-5 in <6 seconds with it.