I had one many years ago and just picked up another one today.
Curious as to what Red Dot and red dot mount most folks go with on these things and any other accessories that might be must haves.
Other than a range toy, this thing will be my “trunk gun”
Just a guess but I’d bet there aren’t very many Kel-Tec fans here.
You can use a 45° offset site and still close your rifle without quite clicking into place. If not you can use the M carbo version that has a hinge allowing the red dot to swing out of the way
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I have a gen 2, I mounted a See All Sight on the handguard rail at the most forward point. No batteries or electronics. Doesn’t completely fold up but closes enough to fit in a medium sized laptop bag or sling bag.
MCARBO also supposedly has taller replacement irons as well.
And if you’re not afraid to spend money, Red Lion has a rotating handguard. I’ve never seen it but I did buy a Red Lion fixed handguard for a PLR-16 years ago and it was well made.
But any side mount or rotating optic mount is gonna make storage much more difficult.
I went down a theoretical Sub2k build idea last year, this MI mount looked promising.
https://midwestindustriesinc.com/mi-gen2-sub-2000-mini-optic-mount/
I have a S2K and have come to really like it. I went the simple way and mounted the RD to the bottom rail for storage using an ADM quick detach. To deploy I have to remove it and reattach to the top rail. It is not as quick as the twist mount or the side flip, but has less drama. The twist mount requires you to tie your bolt back for storage. If anything happens to the cordage, the charging handle slams into your RD. The MCarbo mount looked good, but adds too much the width of the gun when folded. I have practiced to use the iron sights first and then move the RD to the top when time allows. It is definitely funky but works for me.
I own more than one gun. I own a couple machine guns. I have extensive experience with a wide variety of NATO and Warsaw pact Small Arms systems.
The kel-tech Sub 2000, in a civilian context, is one of the coolest funnest most unique and practical guns I’ve ever known.
I currently have four of them. A gen 1 that I keep because I have a custom shoulder holster for it that unfolds it as you pull forward on it and the shoulder holster doesn’t fit the Gen 2. A Gen 2 9 mil for Glock mags a Gen 2 40 cal for Glock mags and a CQB 9 mil integrity suppressed model I haven’t been able to take home yet.
As far as an optic Mount goes I think the best option is the red lion precision. It’s less bulky when folded. It’s also suited to a wider variety of optics including some traditional tube style magnified optics. I think the next best option would be the m-carbo mount. I have the m carbo Mount but it’s very bulky and protrudes dramatically when folded.
Offset sites and even an optic work well on this platform just make sure you get it zeroed correctly and then use the sites in the manner in which they were zeroed. This is not a long range precision sniper system where we’re going to worry about the can’t of the weapon.
To a new purchaser who hasn’t yet got the base gun I very strongly and highly recommend buying the m carbo m series Sub 2000 with the upgrades already on it. When you look at the cost of the base gun from most places and the cost of adding those parts on later after the fact it is a major savings. Not to mention your time and effort also has value. Plus shipping ads up.
In regards to the choice of the double finger or recoilless charging handle I recommend the recoilless because it does help reduce recoil. Obviously it’s not truly recoiless hat’s just silly but it helps. In regards to the choice of peep sight or notch site I generally prefer a peep sight however in this case I personally would choose a notch site just a bit higher than the peep and the site’s being too low was a big deal for me.
Since you have the base rifle already I will recommend purchasing the approximately $234 all in one bundle and whatever parts are missing from it in comparison to the m series does for example I think the site and one or two other things. One thing to m series has that I would probably skip if I were doing it separately is the muzzle break. I personally just don’t like them and I’d rather leave the threads available for mounting a suppressor. An a2 style compensator in 9 mil or even one that has the slots all the way around makes a great thread protector and also allows you to make contact shots that are vented at the muzzle if need be.
Do not buy the m carbo butt pad. Not worth it. Their stuff is so great and then they put this turd out. Oh well. For a butt pad I recommend the Missouri tactical.
On the m carbo website there is an instruction form for if you want to have m carbo install parts for you. Ignore it they charge over double what Kel-Tec does. There is also an instruction form for if you want Kel-Tec to install parts for you. That’s the one you want check out and read that instruction form. Last I knew Kel-Tec wood install as many parts as you want for a flat fee of $40 including return shipping. That is a truly astounding and shocking bargain!
Also last time I spoke to Kel-Tec it turned out that although m carbo specifically omits this information Kel-Tec as part of that same previously mentioned service will also install other parts that are not m-carbo such as the Red Lion precision for end but possibly excluding fire control group parts as they’ve only tested the m-carbo ones and there are warranty issues.
By the way, while it’s at Caltech have them throw a brass bolt weight in it. This is a part only available from Kel-Tec as far as I can tell. I really wish m-carbo sold it or even made it part of their m series. Other than the muzzle brake which I don’t care for this does the most for recoil reduction.
I highly recommend going and checking out the Kel-Tec owners group forum.
Best wishes.
Ted
I have one, Only thing I did was drill the rear sight a little bigger. I ran mine hard when training once. Was flawless. I keep it in my work backpack for when I am going to jobsites. If it gets stolen, its less of a lose then a custom ar15 in 9mm.
I had a .40 that took M&P magazines. Nickel boron and all MCARBO parts… SIG Romeo 5 with one of the first MCARBO mounts. Unfortunately, lived in NJ when I bought it… so it had the muzzle pinned. It was nice when we were issued .40… but now with we use 9mm, so it was a little bit not optimal. Sold it to a coworker.
But I decided to pick up another… PSA had it as a daily deal for $450ish. Black, 9mm, with the Glock 19 grip… as that’s my duty gun and magazines are abundant. I have a P80 (retro one) so have the 17 rounders up thru 33 rounders. Going to do the MCARBO stuff again, with a few points that TED mentioned (agree with his post). I’m back/forth on doing a red dot… if I do, SIG Romeo 5 with the MCARBO mount.
I do have a 9mm AR pistol that takes Glock magazines and setup to run my Dead Air Odessa. I’d likely put it on the SUB2000 once it is setup.
Stock SUB2000 triggers… feels like an airsoft or BB gun trigger. The MCARBO parts… feels like a legit firearm trigger.
Gen2, with a Sig mag release that is the same height as the CZ-75 series, so I can use my pre-ban (not a free state, lol, but not really … ) high-capacity magazines.
I agree that getting your head down on the stock can be difficult for some people, so I went with the Midwest Industries red dot sight mount that flips out of the way to fold and then flips back in place.
It holds its zero, sighted in for 25-yards, you’re back in at 75, a little high at 50 and a touch low at 100. Coupled with a Primary Arms microdot … it’s been flawless, never a jam, never a failure to feed, never any extraction issue. Bullet proof is … as bullet proof does!
Since this picture was taken, I’ve added a Fobus mag holder on each side up on the forend, so with the 22-round mags, there’s 66-rounds at the ready.
By the way with a 9mn carbine like this especially with the longer barrel you can shoot static torso size targets at 100 easily shockingly easily and with good groups and that’s with iron sights.
I have a close friend I’ve known since childhood. He has two children with disabilities and he is a sole income for his family. He wanted a firearm for self-defense but was having a difficult time justifying the expense of the gun and the safe and the ancillary equipment. I’m an advocate for guns but I’m also an advocate for safety. Even if your kids are the angels that you train them to be it’s their damn no good friends they bring over that cause problems.
I told him if he would buy a gun safe I would give him a gun and some support equipment holsters mags etc.
He did so I did. I gave him a Glock 17. We went to the range. He really struggled with shooting a handgun. Really struggled.
I had brought my sub 2000 I let him shoot it things changed dramatically and he was drilling good groups at 50 yards easily and instantly. Not long after that he decided he wanted a sub 2000. At that time he couldn’t find one and the prices were pretty over inflated. I gave him a good deal on one of mine. That’s why I have four and not five. It went to a good home.
TED
Only reason to not put a RDS on one is that you cannot fold it, thus removing any justification for having one!
I have a 9mm Sub2000 (takes Glock mags) and if it wasn’t able to fold then I wouldn’t have it. Yeah, it’s a Kel Tec so there’s that…but if you can make irons work and are comfortable with it then I have to say that it will easily fit into most backpacks, which is kinda cool. I’m not a big fan of pistol-caliber carbines but if this was the only somewhat concealable weapon you could hide, be it for travel or hiking, then it should serve you well as opposed to (and maybe in addition to) a handgun.
I do agree that the fact that it folds is pretty unique and fantastic. I disagree that if it didn’t fold it wouldn’t have value. In fact if they made a sub 2000 that didn’t fold I would still be interested. Especially the integrity suppressed one.
In my opinion if you want to fold it and used optics I think the red lion precision form is the best option. The mcarbo mount is nice but stands up too proud and bulky when folded. I personally wouldn’t really consider the Midwest industries one.
Important note! If you’re going to go straight pure iron sights and not mount an optic then I highly recommend the mcarbo rear notch sight and even more importantly the…
Then choose a front AR sight post of your preference. I like some of the round ball style front sight post like k&S makes. I would choose one that is as large as possible without being larger than the rear notch, dip it in some phosphorescent paint, zero the thing then by hand carefully paint the front half of it black.
TED
… DO ANY OF YOU GUYS READ?
Just a few posts above there is a photo, a description and the name of a red dot site mount that allows the KT Sub-2000 to fold completely. Gosh you’re behaving like good little Liberals & spouting talking points without reading, lol!
I do. I actually referred to the specific optic mount pictured. I do not care for the midwest mount. Nor do I like the Mcarbo mount. Red Lion all the way here.