Student Suspended For Advocating CCW On Campus

General General Discussion
1

Pulled this off of Fox News

Gun Safety

A student at Hamline University in Minnesota has been suspended and ordered to undergo a mental health evaluation for advocating the carrying of legal concealed weapons on campus.

TownHall.com reports Troy Scheffler made the case in an e-mail to a school official that licensed gun owners could stop or prevent the kind of violence that struck Virginia Tech earlier this year. He pointed out that research has indicated the possibility of armed resistance discourages potential criminals. And he noted that many Virginia Tech students have said the massacre there would not have happened if the school had not banned concealed weapons.

But even though the school has a policy that guarantees students will be free to discuss all questions of interest and express their opinions openly, the dean of students says Scheffler’s e-mail was deemed to be threatening. Scheffler was placed on interim suspension, which will only be lifted after he agrees to a psychological evaluation.

President of Hamline is:
Linda Hanson
email: lhanson@hamline.edu
Office Phone: 651.523.2202

2

There’s a lot more than concealed-carry privileges going on in this young man’s head.:rolleyes:

(From TheFire.org)

E-mail from Troy Scheffler to Hamline University Vice President of Student Affairs David Stern, April 17, 2007

From: Troy Scheffler
Subject: I dont think the students need the counseling…
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 10:54 PM

Considering this university also pushes “diversity” initiatives like VA Tech, maybe its “leadership” will reconsider its ban on conceal carry law abiding gun owners… Ironically, according to a few VA Tech forums, there are plenty of students complaining that this wouldnt have happened if the school wouldnt have banned their permits a few months ago…

I just dont understand why leftists dont understand that criminals dont care about laws; that is why they’re criminals… Maybe this school will reconsider its repression of law abiding citizens rights.

Considering that accoriding to the university president that there were recently serious “hate crimes” that were committed in the womens bathrooms; there may be people on the edge ready to snap. I cant say I blame them, I myself am tired of having to pay my own extremely overpriced tuition to make up for minorities not paying theirs. On top of that, I am sick of seeing them held to a different standard than the white students (Of course its a lower and more lenient standard).

Oh by the way, when is your “diversity” department going to include European ancestry?

Respectfully,
Troy Scheffler

E-mail from Troy Scheffler to Hamline University President Linda Hanson, April 19, 2007

>>> “Troy Scheffler” > 4/19/2007 10:15 PM >>

I was wondering why a swastika painted by some frustrated ladies in their bathroom turned somehow into red flags of a hate crime but you dont consider an asian guy admittedly killing people because he hated them not hate motivated… Anyhow, in response to your most recent email concerning a vigil for people most likely nobody in the school knows; I would like to comment on your claims of upped “security”. I attend a MPLS cohort so I dont see any security in the area ever. Infact it seems the dirty bums on the street are the only ones patrolling anything. I would suggest if you are truley concerned about student security, you lift a ridiculous conceal carry campus ban and let the students worry about their own “security”. VA Tech just recently passed their conceal carry permit ban; we can all see how well that worked for criminal minds. Ironically, many students from VA Tech are in online forums which I can direct you to complaining that 32 people wouldnt have died in the students rights were not infringed by banning their legal right to carry their arms on their person. They take the argument that they would have shot the guy before he was able to massacre that many people; I on the other hand would argue that the guy wouldnt have even attempted this atrocity not only if we didnt pay for everybody and their mother to come here for free to soak up tuition funds but also that by knowing law abiding citizens carried weapons to defend themselves that criminals wouldnt be so bold to commit crimes against them…

As usual, Im sure this plea of common sense will fall on deaf ears as I recently responded to a general email notifying students of the conceal carry ban…

On a lighter note… For a “Christian” university, I am very disappointed in Hamline. With the motif of the curriculum, the atheist professors, jewish and other non-Christian staff, I would charge the school with wanton misrepresentation.

Yes, I obviously feel that Hamline has been a serious let down, so far I am almost finished with half of my MAPA degree and havent even cracked a book. All the books that came in plastic wrap are still in plastic wrap despite the ridiculous amounts students are charged. I have yet to hear a student in my cohort that is happy with the curriculum or quality of professors. Why does this school charge so much for such a substandard education?

Furthermore, why are you diversity initiatives anti-Euro American (ie white folks)? All over the university grounds I see loads of leftist propaganda, why not warn a student before they enroll at Hamline? It took me complaining to a few different people before even the hamline website finally included white people in the random pictures on the main page. If I remember corrextly it was like 1 white in a picture out of like 12… Now it is obviously better but just goes to show how biased this university is and the painstaking efforts of diversity pandering it does at the expense of people that are actually planning on contributing back to the TAXPAYERS that are footing the bill for your iversity initiatives. In fact, 3 out of 3 students just in my class that are “minorities” are planning on returning to Africa and all 3 are getting a free education ON MY DOLLAR. I bet the staff here is wondering how a swastika ended up in a bathroom… More people than you can imagine are tired of this all. It’s just sad that they resort to petty vandalism rather than speak their mind like I am.

Please stop alienating the students that are working hard every day to pay for their tuition. Maybe you can instruct your staff on sensitivity training towards us “privilaged white folk”. If your staff is going to continually berate the evil white male for this privilage and his racist tendencies, at least have them explain where to find the privilages and point out the evil people that are ruining the world. Strange for how horribly racist Europeans and other white people are that everyone seems to want to exploit our generosity. Maybe someday the favor will be returned but I doubt it seeing what I have so far…

Thanks for your time…
Respectfully,
Troy Scheffler

3

As liberal as the University of Colorado at Boulder is, even they allow CCW-advocacy groups. Like KintlaLake said - there was more to this.

4

Wow, after reading the letters that Kinta posted (thanks), I see where the University is coming from.

Why it is that the nut-jobs feel compelled to write this drivel down and send it to people? Maybe we could get Hillary to hire him as a campaigner.

5

Yup.

No one has time to dig for every fact behind every headline, but this is a glaring example of a badly “cropped” story. It took me about three minutes to find Mr. Scheffler’s messages and learn that he’s not doing us any favors.

As McMurphy said to Cheswick: “Take it easy. And stay off my side.” :rolleyes:

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I got the e-mail from FIRE last week and, frankly, I don’t see how anything that he said warrants suspension or compulsory mental evaluation.

He may be an attention whore, but I sincerely hope he wins.

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I don’t see anything wrong with what he says in that email. In fact I feel for him. The school just didn’t like what he said and wants to hurt him for it. It’s a shame education is such a joke in this country anymore.

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After reading all of this and the replies…The feeling that I get by “Listening” to what this young fellow has scribed definitely leaves cause for concern IMHO. You have to read between the lines.

I sense there is an awful lot of anger, hate and prejudice in this boy. I too get the feeling that he is reaching his boiling point. Someone of a more stable nature would not put these types of feelings in print. They’d know better, regardless of their “rights.” He has reached the age of accountability even though he is young, but he is not a “Young Adult”. He must learn that “Rights” are subject to scrutiny. That’s why you can’t legally own a gun if you have a Domestic Violence background.

Just my $.02 worth.

Tack

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That’s pretty much my take, Tack.

Anyone who’s a magnet for pro-con correspondence – public official, school principal, forum moderator – should divide such mail into four piles:

FOR – AGAINST – OTHER OPINIONS – FLAG

If one of my clients got an e-mail like those written by Mr. Scheffler, I’d advise them to put it into the FLAG pile. I’d then encourage that client to refer it immediately to professionals who are qualified to investigate, evaluate and recommend what steps (if any) to take next.

The most recent precedent for that course of action is, ironically, Virginia Tech.

Taken together, the subjects Mr. Scheffler raised (and the way he expressed them) form a rhetorical cocktail that should alert any university administrator or law-enforcement official.

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I don’t think it has anything to do with being racist. People always try to pull the race card when it comes to minorities and it’s bullshit. I can understand peoples frustration because it frustrates me as well. Just because someone thinks that people are doing harm to our country doesn’t mean they’re racist. I don’t think he said anything that merited getting suspended from school. They’re are serious problems in this country when it comes to the things he was talking about. It’s a fact the illegals have more rights and benefits than people who are actually legal citizens of this country.

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General rule: If a person has a specific point to make, they should make it – focus, finish. The wholesale venting of frustrations (a la Mr. Scheffler), however heartfelt or perceived as valid, isn’t persuasive. Ever. It buries the point and vaporizes credibility.

General observation: Trying to connect the denial of concealed-carry privileges to perceived racial favoritism and high tuition (again, a la Mr. Scheffler) is an Olympic-class leap.

Specific observation #1: Mr. Scheffler was the one to “pull the race card.”

Specific observation #2: For all the hand-wringing about a “liberal media bias,” this time it was conservative media that told less than half the story. Granted, it was slanted in favor of advocating concealed-carry privileges, a perspective that finds some favor in these forums, but it was slanted reporting nonetheless.

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Because you wanted to quote me, let’s get a few things straight…

Who said anything about being a racist? I said he was “Prejudiced”. There is a difference. Look it up.

Anytime someone plays the race card like our young friend did several times in his Childish, and Immature Emails, …they clearly are the “Racist”. He’s the one who singled out minorities. No one else…Period! It leaves little room for doubt on where he’s coming from. Not one of these “Minority Students” attending this university is doing our country harm to anyones knowledge, and if anyone thinks that just because they’re a minority they mean us harm, they should re-think their position. Many “minorities” have died for this great country! Native Americans, Hispanics, Blacks, Jews, Women, and yes…even Muslims’! They were all Americans.

He said many things that any rational “adult” would question. HIS child like behavior is what you so eloquently call…Bull Shit! I live in Colorado. The home of Columbine, and this wacko is borderline, just like the Dillon and Clebold punks who ruined so many lives here a few years back. This is one of the the last guys I would ever want to see carry a gun, and he is doing us all harm with his overly vocal, and publicly noted tirades.

Tack

13

I guess where just going to have to agree to disagree.

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He said he was receiving a “substandard education” and his rant confirms it.

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As an Asian American, I agree with you (and that student) to a certain extend:

  1. I do not support affirmative actions. It was a neccessity in the 60’s but I prefer the hiring process based on qualification than race.
  2. I believe all races have rights on self-representation and entitled to be proud. Nothing wrong with proud to be white! But when the skinheads decided to hurt others to prove their “pride” than they are just criminals.

I do not agree however:

  1. I don’t think illegals have “more rights.”
  2. I certainly do not leech off anyone. I started to work for my money at age 16 packing boxes at “Mail boxes etc.” Paid my taxes as a teenager. Worked full-time while going to college full-time and paid my way through school. Joined the Marines and currently serving this great nation. There are leeches from every race!

IOC

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I agree with you but it sure does seem to me illegals have more rights and get away with a lot of things that others wouldn’t get away with. I know there are tons of examples I’ve seen in the news and such but I’m too lazy and not interested enough to go digging around for stuff but it’s there. Thanks for your service I have a great deal of respect for our troops.

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I know how you feel buddy! But I think it’s not like the illegals have “more” rights. I think it’s more like alot of them do not obey our laws and there are American who are willing to DEFEND their illegal actions. Thus the perception that illegals have “more” rights. I certainly do not tolerate illegals.

I do find it ironic that foreign terrorists were given “due process” as if they were Americans… Geneva Convention? yes, US Due process? no!

IOC

18

Racism…illegal immigration…Affirmitive Action…all fascinating and important topics for free citizens to debate. In fact, I’m on my second bag of popcorn. :smiley:

At the risk of resurrecting the discussion about whether or not Mr. Scheffler should’ve been suspended and required to undergo a psychological evaluation, today I solicited a professional profiler’s perspective on the e-mails.

In the profiler’s judgement, Mr. Scheffler “crossed a bright line” when he said this:

“…there may be people on the edge ready to snap. I cant say I blame them…”

Word.

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Exactly!

And that is why we have professionals in the Psych field, )not only for us civilians, but for the LEO’s and Military forces aswell)…to help see a “Train Wreck” in the making. Problem is that way too many of these border line situations don’t get any attention when they get “Rad Flagged” which was the case in Columbine, and V. Tech.

Tack

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The way I see it is that most of the points he made were valid including the quote list above. We need more people ready to “snap” with all the bullshit going on in the US these days. The problem is how one “snaps” as shooting students isn’t going to help your cause much.