I remember when the M&P first hit the market some years ago. A lot of folks were calling it a “Glock killer” and predicting that it would soon claim the lion’s share of the polymer 9mm/.40 market.
Fast forward to today and Glock still seems as popular as ever, their 9mm hiccups notwithstanding. And since then, some outstanding guns have hit the market such as the Walther PPQ and HK VP9.
Don’t know about S&W’s market share, but is the M&P about where it was expected to be at this point in time?
I don’t know, and I doubt you could find out as S&W isn’t talking. That said, I’m thinking S&W is getting some serious competition from a lot of other manufacturers I mean look at a VP9, other than sights, it doesn’t need anything out of the box. NO apex anything. IMO, S&W took too long to address a lot of issues, and this eventually cost them.
I happen to agree with ralph on S&W taking too long to address a lot of issues. There are a lot of other striker fire firearms out there. Besides the VP9, there is the FNS, the Sig 320 and Beretta is coming out with striker fire. One thing I have notice is that Smith is takes a while to address the issues with there guns. It seems a lot of people wanted a Glock 19 size M&P. What does Smith do, they came out with a FDE and Carbin Fiber color frame. Really!? FN had an issue with their striker fire gun. FN addressed the issue right away and seems to be working fine now.
There are a lot of Glock fans out there. Glock is a good good firearm for the price. They have been around for a long time. Unless Smith re-vamps the internals of the M&P, and give what people want, the M&P will be second or third or fourth to the Glock. Just my two cents. Which isn’t much 
What hurt S&W was the slow to respond/react to shortcomings of the pistol, hoping buyers would just learn to accept it or when it gets sent to the S&W shop for repair, fix or repair the problem them. I guess if I owned a shop putting a firearm that was expected to be trustworthy and 100% reliable, I would be slow broke. My philosophy would be, don’t let it out the door until it’s right. I know it can be done as manufactures have managed to do it.
After carrying Sig 226’s for 26+/- years I bought my own M&P9 FS and 9L, Shield and a 9C. Not as warm to the 9c so it will move on out and a Sig 329 Compact, 15 rnd mag and 3.9" barrel, will take the 9c spot. I have a Sig 239 9mm, it’s a great gun almost 20 years old, but it is a heavier Shield size wise and capacity.
I always thought the M&P line failed to really give shooters a reason to switch from Glock…the P320 brings a groundbreaking level of modularity to the table, and the VP9 offers excellent ergonomics with an outstanding out of the box trigger pull. Sure the M&P was the first popular plastic gun to offer different backstraps, but there were too many other issues to overcome. Also the sizing of the Compact is a little smaller than I think most people are looking for.
The only M&P I have is the shield. Does fine for its purpose. Only thing I’ve done to it is change the sights and add some Foxx grips (like rubberized talon grips).
That said, I see a lot of M&P fanboys touting “all i did was add an apex kit…”.
Yeah, how much is that? Why would people brag about having to add additional hardware and cost to a brand new firearm? I just don’t get it. But that’s me.
I know many will debate this, but I have listened to a lawyer who has defended several defensive shootings, and any good prosecutor will attempt to go after any types of functional modifications you’ve made to your trigger, sear, etc. Doesn’t sound like that’s nailed anyone YET, but all it takes is one skewed jury to buy-in to that translating to the defendant “wanting to go out and kill someone” to turn the tide. And with the ever-growing libtard media pushing these types of agendas, it should at least be considered.
Ok, rant done. 
I think Smith & Wesson should stick to wheelguns. After the Sigma, I don’t trust any S&W semi pistol. The only S&W semi I would trust would be a 5906. The problem is the “me too” attitude that many manufacturers have. There was already a plethora of polymer framed hi-cap striker-fired semis on the market that had a proven track record. I think the M&P was doomed for failure from the beginning. As others have pointed out, the series didn’t really bring anything new to the table - so what was the point? Money… I think they’ve been trying to reclaim their LE market share after losing all of their Model 10 contracts. LOL. BTW, the Model 10 was called the “Military & Police” as well - and that was 116 years ago.
No, just no. A good prosecutor will argue the facts and the law… and a modified gun is irrelevant in an intentional shooting. Hell, a good prosecutor most likely won’t even prosecute you. Now if it was a negligent shooting, then yes, a modified gun to have a lighter trigger pull or fewer safeties may be to your detriment. But for an intentional defensive shooting? It doesn’t matter if your gun had a 1 lb or a 10 lb trigger, the shoot was good regardless of trigger weight and any “good” prosecutor won’t waste literally everyone’s time by making such a frivolous argument.
So…a lawyer who has seen it happen in court on multiple occasions is wrong? It didn’t happen?
And why is it that in these cases you read about and see in the news, the prosecution often times tries to question the credibility or intent of a defendant involved in a shooting? That’s what they are doing with the dive into the modifications on a pistol.
Like I said, I don’t know where it’s nailed anyone yet, but it does and has been a tactic.
The prosecutor/da wasn’t “good” in those cases. In most jurisdictions, self defense is a defense to murder. And self defense, in most jurisdictions, is assumed as soon as someone unlawfully enters your home. At that point, the weapon you used is essentially irrelevant. It doesn’t matter if you used a punisher evil black rifle or a pink deringer. At that point the case revolves entirely around if the person was there lawfully or not. A dead body in a house who is not a family member nor a resident of that house is an open and shut case. The protector likely won’t waste time and budget to prosecute you at all.
The only time he would is when there is real doubt on if it was self defense, which would be outside of the home in 99% of cases. And if there was, your trigger pull weight again won’t matter. It still comes down to the question of self defense.
Now if it’s a civil case… It might matter. Maybe. Depending on jurisdiction. But you were referring to criminal charges, so I haven’t mentioned that.
S&W should stick to wheelguns
Pretty much sums up every MP thread ever done.
I think if you were to get an honest answer from the people at S&W they would tell you that are satisfied with its success but always would like to have more of the market share. I only say that based off what I perceive as its current popularity with shooters.
Personally I think the gun is phenomenal. There isn’t a pistol I own that I shoot better. I agree that its taken S&W way too long to listen to its customers but they ultimately have in my opinion.
In my opinion, the gun in its current state of manufacture is the best striker fired polymer framed pistol for the money. Grant made a thread on the current upgrades here… https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?139767-Current-production-S-amp-W-M-amp-P-s-(Update)&highlight=
These upgrades take care of any issue I personally had with previous models, your mileage may vary though.
I enjoy the M&P series, and so far have been lucky not to have any issues with any of them.
However everyone has an opinion, and I am not different. I think S&W missed the boat by not offering a model that was a more direct competitor to the Glock 19. I think a lot of people find the M&P Compact just a little too small. I personally like my pistols to have a grip long enough to not require a “finger” magazine to fill it out.
I think a M&P Carry model, with a 3.8-4 inch barrel and a 14-15 rd magazine would be the cat’s meow for size. With a good trigger, fix the barrel/accuracy issues, and the option of a positive manual safety, it would sell like hotcakes.
I emailed S&W once regarding this notion listed above, explained at length, and was directed to their M&P Compact. Whooosh! Right over the head of whomever read my email.
It is funny as all other manufacturers seem to understand that the Glock 19 is the model they need to be compared to.
Does anyone know if S&W has any intentions of releasing a Glock 19 comparable model?
The M&P 9C is their competitor to the G19.
Looks closer to a G26 to me
Except for the fact it does not directly compare with the G19. I’ve owned both. It is closer to the subcompact Glocks than the G19.
Seriously, everyone under the sun seems to know that a large part of the G19s popularity is in it’s near perfect size. Big enough for duty, small enough to be easily CC. Except S&W.
I love my little shield, other than a few minutes on the worksharp I haven’t done jack to the trigger. Did I have to dick with it? No…
I loved my 9c but like all other doublestacks they just don’t fit into my style of conceal carry so it went away.
I have two friends with pro’s in 9’s, I apexed the one CORE and have lots of trigger time behind the other regular pro, maybe I’m not overly worried about triggers. All four of these pistols I’ve seen or put thousands of rounds down without issue. (except for the occasional OL reload) If I was going to buy one of these thick as a brick monsters for some reason I’d have to consider a M&P. For my HD and fun pistols I much prefer them to have a hammer like my 220 and 09. I do like the trigger on the VP9 and ppq but then again there’s no practical application for me.
Where the M&P line has failed is not having a 5" 10mm in the lineup, that’s forcing me to shell out a bunch of bucks for a G40 before next hunting season.
I think everyone knew S&W would have a tough time breaking ingrained Glock customers from their inertia… and I honestly would think that they knew this when the M&P product line was pushed out there. Since then, I am pretty sure S&W scored their fair share of agency contracts… enough to make the product line worth their while, nevermind the expansions to the product offerings over the years with the “Pro-series” additions that cater to the gun-game market. When I was shopping as a new buyer for an affordable training pistol circa 2010, it was a much easier decision to end up with the M&P than if I had already amassed a collection of Gen3 Glocks during the prior decade or two. For me the design ergos and sizing worked out well, and I have the full gamut now of FS, C, Shield, and PC CORE.
Since it’s inception, M&P’s have proven itself well enough that I see them out there a reasonable amount in training classes and on the hips of working professionals from time to time – alongside the usual stable of Glocks, Sigs, and XDs. No matter what happens, it will be a long time for major agencies to move away from their legacy issue Glock and Sig pistols, imho. The infrastructure investment and politics are just too huge. HK simply priced themselves out of most of the market for typical consumers wanting a “tactical” type pistol for training and more than just square-range shooting. Here in CA, sadly, the regular M&P line has fallen off our “Roster of Safe Handguns” so that cramps their market share by quite a bit given that the Gen3 Glocks are still available alongside the stable of Springfield XD pistols. The VP9 and PPQ will never gain traction here since it was never on the roster and the SSE path to acquire them closed shortly after they were released into our market. The newer Sig striker-fire offerings suffer this same fate here in CA.
I doubt anyone in their right mind can claim S&W “failed” with their M&P generation of products.
Interesting. I was going by some of their early Ad campaign stuff and Internet talk. I’ve not cared to handle a 9c personally. Thanks for pointing that out.
If you look at the pure size comparisons, you get a hopscotch progression with the Glock/M&P, imho (for 9mm):
G26
M&P9c
G19
M&P FS
G17
M&P L
G34
I should also have mentioned that S&W has done tons of design revisions since inception, as well, which can either be looked at as a positive improvement/investment in improving the product, or band-aid fixes for problems that should never have been in the design… depends who you are asking.