NFA items are illegal in jersey right? Im going to ask a cop tomorrow but i did research and it seems this is true.
What makes this illegal if thats the case? its not automatic
http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LWR-BCM-NFA
It’s registered as a SBR, short barreled rifle. Meaning its for use with an upper that has a less than 16" barrel.
Not all NFA is illegal in NJ.
Lower alone is not NFA/SBR under Federal Law. But since it is registered as a SBR, they want paperwork to xfer it. Not supposed to do it that way, but some still do.
ok thank you ill jus get the other lower
Not too sure what you mean. When you register an SBR using an AR type rifle, the lower is the registerd item. So, the lower alone is in fact subject to NFA rules and regs. Once it is registered, the upper receiver is irrelevant as to the status of the weapon.
No, by law, if it does not have bbl or the bbl is >16 (and it meets oal) it is not an SBR. Thus that picture is not an SBR. Put a 16 bbl on it is legally just another rifle.
I never looked at the photo, but he asked about a short barrelled rifle. If an SBR, the lower is the registered item. If it is registered, the length of the barrel - 11.5", 14.5", 16", 20" etc. - is irrelevant. You still own an SBR until removed from the registry.
My understanding is that you haven’t constructed and/or aren’t in possession of an SBR unless you’ve mounted an upper on it with less than a 16 inch barrel.
The question might be moot. Will the BATF approve a Form 4 or a Form 1 for an SBR for someone who lives in New Jersey where SBRs are illegal by statute? Will the local CLEO sign off on it?
Apparently you never looked at the law, the ATF rulings, or the Case Law either. 
It is not an SBR if it is not in an SBR configuration. Thus without a BBL, it is not an SBR.
[(8) The term ``short-barreled rifle’’ means a rifle having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length and any weapon made from a rifle (whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise) if such weapon, as modified, has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.
If it does not HAVE a bbl, it cannot be an SBR. Registration staus has nothing to do with it. SBR receivers are not defined the same way MG receivers are.
ATF letter saying transporting a registered SBR receiver across state lines is not a violation since it is not a SBR (page 2, but entire letter shown) - Page 1, Page 2,Page 3
Correct (or the oal part)
Since they are illegal, I hope nobody would sign off.
Being a C3 for about thirty years now, I can speak from experience. You are not correct in your assessment. Oh, and I do know the law, and I also know how BATFE operates. One letter to one guy is not neccesarily the same as another letter to a different guy. Nor does it preclude them from changing their mind, at any time, for any reason. Bottom line is, and it states so in the letter, the registered item is in fact the receiver, period.
Like I stated, what barrel you have on it is irrelevant, the receiver is in the NFA registry as a SBR regardless of what configuration you may have it in. For interstate transportation purposes though, if you don’t want to break the law, or don’t want to tell BATFE where you are going, then put a longer barreled upper and no one would even check. But who cares anyway? That is the whole purpose of registering the receiver as an SBR, so you can have an SBR. So you put a longer barreled upper on it so you can take it from Texas to Oklahoma? So what. That is the only ‘advantage’ if you want to call it that. That doesn’t mean the receiver is not an NFA item, because it is. You are basing your whole position on one guy’s letter that apparently wants to take his SBR somewhere. Not really sure what point you are trying to make.
By the way, you are mostly incorrect in your statement referencing SBR receivers not being ‘defined’ the same as machine gun receivers. Obviously they don’t have the same litteral definition relative to function but can in configuration. For example, Hk’s in SBR configuration. Ever think of that? Nope, you didn’t.
In the AR series of weapons, the SBR designation is basically a CYA. Protects you a bit is all.
WTF?
Coleslaw,
What he meant was that in NJ SBR’s are illegal. Please correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I know you can only have MG’s and AOW’s.
I would not seek leagal advice from a police officer.
This is the bottom line.
No, it’s not.
A SBR is defined in statute. If a rifle does not meet that legal definition, it is not subject to the provisions of the NFA, period. This is not a matter of interpretation, nor can ATF “change their mind.”
Until Congress changes the definition of a short-barreled rifle contained in 26 USC 5845(a) to include language referring to a firearm’s presence on the NFRTR, that fact is utterly and completely irrelevant, with regard to SBR’s.
So…a registered receiver is not an SBR. It appears that nothing is an SBR unless it has a barrel attached that is less the 16 inches and/or the package is less that 26 inches OAL.
I still question whether or not BATF would even process a Form 1 or Form 4 for an SBR for someone that lives in New Jersey. It does appear that the CLEO can’t sign off since he has to certify that possession of the specified weapon wouldn’t violate state or local laws, but I don’t know what BATF would do with Form 1/Form 4 for a trust, where CLEO signature isn’t needed.
You are grossly mistaken my friend. If a scenario arose where the ATF “changed their mind”, you may win in court, but it will cost you plenty. Read that carefully, PLENTY. So if you have the pockets and want to fight them over your SBR, by all means do so. Most here will support you in spirit I am sure.
Really. I see several individuals that are quick to reference law, ordinances, rulings, etc. We can all do internet searches and read, but I wonder what real world experience they have.
This whole discussion really revolves around one weapon, the AR15. Due to the fact you can easily swap uppers, it creates a loophole if you will. That doesn’t absolve anyone of the responsibility of owning an NFA regulated item, which it is. Granted, by removing the shorty upper it changes the configuration and by caveat it isn’t regulated, but the receiver is still registered. And as stated previously if the only advantage is being able to transport interstate, who cares?
True. Federal law (ATF interpretations) contradict themselves a lot too.
One a machine gun = always a machine gun.
But it’s true a SBR is only a SBR when a short barrel is attached. If it’s just a lower it’s just a lower. Weird but true.
You aren’t allowed anything fun in NJ. No full auto, no cans, no SBR’s, no AOW’s. Nothing nada zippo zilch.
Where did you get that info? According to Guntrustlawyer you can in fact own MG’s (a license is issued by some type of court?) and it states that AOW’s are legal as well.
It specifically states that suppressors, SBR’s, SBS’s an DD’s are prohibited.
