So my next question is; Was that Micro Uzi legal? I’ll assume that since the one guy was a chief of police he was able to sign off on his own paperwork.
This whole situation is fucked! Fluery is a great guy, he taught a few of my classes when I was in the academy. The city of Springfield (Which lies in hampden county and which Bennet is DA for) is so far fucked it unreal. Violent crime is throught the roof, (mostly stabbings) and he is worried about this shit. It has been agreed upon but it really is a witch hunt, looking for blame some one for a bad situation. Soon enough we are going to see lawsuits that indicts the parents for not making the child wear a helmet when he/she cracks thier skull open on thier bicycle.
Im so fucking sick of this State.
-DM-
So far the story goes is that one of the indicted from CT brought the Uzi and Fluery told him the whole thing was legal.
-DM-
Ah ha. I must have missed that. So what we have is a guy who brought a Micro Uzi across state lines to a shooting event based upon the word of the Chief of Police. Am I the only one who sees something wrong here? I still fail how to see how this is a witch hunt. People acted irresponsibly (no line supervision) and an 8 year old child lost his life. In addition we have an idiot who brought his NFA weapon across state lines on the word of a Chief of Police.
Someone correct me if I am wrong. Are you not required to file paperwork with the BATFE prior to doing this? How many of you would be pissed off if some new legislation was introduced because of these idiots. If I am wrong here please let me know.
No, you are certainly not the only one, as I agree with you 100%. This is holding people who should have known better responsible for their unbelievably stupid and irresponsible actions that led to the completely and totally needless death of a child.
Some here sound like they will start defending drunk drivers who kill because no one meant to hurt anyone and everyone feels real bad. Plus those involved have had their lives ruined anyway, so let it be.
Get a grip, folks. There was trouble written all over that scene. If I were there that day, I would have walked up to someone and asked what the hell was going on if I saw that child shooting that weapon while being “supervised” by another child. That’s not great hindsight, it is a fact. No doubt about it.
Go to KNOB Creek and you will have a weekends worth of work cut out for you… SAME EXACT type of event…
If you are implying that by going to this particular range/event, I would be witness to adults allowing children under 10 to fire machine pistols on a regular basis, supervised by young teens, then apparently there are lot’s of stupid and negligent members there.
Wouldn’t be my cup of tea.
One thing that I didn’t see was the Waiver EVERYONE has to sign to get in. When I attended this event years ago, you had to sign one waiver ot get it and a completely different one to shoot. AND if you were under 18, your PARENT/GUARDIAN had to allow you to fire.
The one time that I went to Knob Creek I remember the waiver as well as the fact that they had numerous people on the line supervising. I really don’t care if every machine gun shoot or gathering is fucked up like a football bat. If we really care about our 2nd Amendment rights we will do what is right to ensure that others who are not so vigiliant screw it up for us.
So I just finshed watching a report an ABC40 out of Springfield, and it basicly said that there is more intrest in this story globly and nationly than it is here(mass).
I would hope that Fleury’s lawyer gets a change of venue to ethier Berkshire or Franklin county IMHO.
I know I can’t spell.
Another example of why Liberals are winning. We happily throw our own people under the bus in hopes of pleasing the other side. Whole bunch of bad decisions lead up to a tragedy, that’s life, it happens everyday. Oh, wait I need to feel better, let’s pass more laws and prosecute someone.
The law, if anyone is interested.
Chapter 140: Section 130. Sale or furnishing weapons or ammunition to aliens or minors; penalty; exceptions
Section 130. Whoever sells or furnishes a rifle, shotgun or ammunition to any alien eighteen years of age or older who does not hold a permit card issued to him under section one hundred and thirty-one H or, except as provided in this section or section one hundred and thirty-one E, whoever sells or furnishes any alien or any person under eighteen years of age a rifle, shotgun, machine gun or ammunition, or whoever sells or furnishes to any person under 21 years of age a firearm or large capacity rifle or shotgun or ammunition therefor shall have his license to sell firearms, rifles, shotguns, machine guns and or ammunition revoked and shall not be entitled to apply for such license for ten years from the date of such revocation and shall be punished by a fine of not less than $1,000 nor more than $10,000, or by imprisonment in a state prison for not more than ten years or by imprisonment in a house of correction for not more than two and one-half years, or by both such fine and imprisonment. Nothing in this section or section one hundred and thirty-one E shall be construed to prohibit a parent or guardian from allowing his child or ward, who has not attained age fifteen, the supervised use of a rifle or shotgun or ammunition therefor, according to the provisions of section one hundred and twenty-nine C, nor from furnishing such child or ward, who has attained age fifteen, with a rifle or shotgun that is not a large capacity weapon or ammunition; provided, however, that said child or ward, being fifteen years of age or older, has been issued a valid firearm identification card or alien permit to possess a rifle or shotgun which is in his possession. Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit an instructor from furnishing rifles or shotguns or ammunition therefor to pupils; provided, however, that said instructor has the consent of a parent or guardian of a pupil under the age of eighteen years.
This is nothing more than blind loyalty. Liberals can in fact legitimately bash us as a result of this reckless stupidity. I would never want to be lumped in with such negligent people, and I would never stand by their decisions.
Ridiculous. The exact same logic used to justify any form of criminal negligence. Even more so a DWI fatality.
I would expect a hell of a lot better from my fellow firearm enthusiasts, not to mention my fellow parents.
Well, that’s a little ridiculous. They carry that mantra everywhere they go. “IN THE NAME OF SAFETY!!”
I’ve already shared my opinion, but this just struck me as funny coming from a fellow firearms enthusiast.
EDIT. I didn’t see your question posed to me in the other response. My apologies.
No your right, it certainly doesn’t take a rocket scientist to foresee problems with an 8 year and an UZI. However, it does take superhuman powers to keep your eyes on your children 100% of the time. I’m borderline paranoid when it comes to my daughter and even I lose sight of her every now and then. Now again, this is showing my ignorance on the case, was the father in the vicinity of the child? Did he see this happen with his own eyes?
Safetyhit, I suppose you support bans on hunting by minors as well. A little boy was just killed in a hunting accident the other day.
I’m not saying people in Mass should break their silly laws, but I’m sure not going to support their silly laws myself as some here seem to be. I also like the clever use of DUI.:rolleyes: I know another group with tactics such as those.
Nope. I started hunting at age 10 with a side-by-side 410 shotgun. Would you relate the manageability of my 2 shot 410 to that of a machine pistol? I wouldn’t, and I suspect many others here wouldn’t either. That regardless of whether they are for or against prosecution.
Silly laws? The boy is dead for the exact reason they enacted that or similar laws. Take the blinders off, my friend.
I can’t believe I have to explain the reckless stupidity of this needless tragedy to experienced gun owners. It never ever should have happened that way. If a capable adult was firmly holding the weapon with the boy, then this almost certainly never would have transpired. Even that would seem like a bit much to me for an 8 year old, but not nearly as bad as having one child supervise another younger child.
Come on, guys. You must know how horribly negligent this particular instance was. We, as a gun community, can’t just dismiss anyones negligence simply because we believe in the same cause. It will cause a lack of credibility, and it’s wrong.
I don’t think anyone is arguing negligence was absent. At least I’m not.
Many multiples of children/adults are killed at the hands of careless hunters compared with idiots doing stupid stuff at MG shoots. Certainly we must change this, for the children. Don’t you agree? I’m not seeing how one isolated act of negligence is greater than multiple acts of negligence every year by hunters. Clearly children can be saved by simple outlawing hunting. Do you disagree that children will be saved by outlawing hunting?
Again, the example of the safety comparison between a 2 shot 410 and a machine pistol? Not relevant to you??
But OK, you win. There should be no legal ramifications for allowing an 8 year old to fire a machine pistol while being supervised by a 15 year old. Fortunately, I have more sense than to continue down this ridiculous road.
And it doesn’t require exceptional intelligence to see that if as many 8 year olds were out firing machine pistols while improperly supervised as there are minors hunting, then there would be a lot more dead 8 year olds. The comparison is very weak and idealistic.
hatt,
You are forgetting just a few things. It is the law of the state regardles of how silly you think it is. And for the record as far as I know it applies only to machine guns and not hunting weapons. It has zero to do with the children and everything to do with not giving the other side any more additional ammunition to further their cause. So I guess you have no problem with gun onwers being reckless and therefore subjecting us to more undeserved scrutiny.
You guys carry on then. It appear two people were charged for simply bringing MGs to the shoot. I wonder what the story is with that. Clearly they should have been constantly staring at their guns and are deserving of felonies and potential long term jail sentences because they were not. People who bring guns to any sort of shoot and let other people shoot them better beware.
Also indicted for involuntary manslaughter was the Westfield Sportsman’s Club, where the death occurred, and two other individuals, identified in court records as Carl Giuffre, of Hartford, and Domenico Spano of New Milford, Conn.
Hampden District Attorney William M. Bennett said Giuffre and Spano supplied the machine guns used at the sportman’s club, but he said Fleury had assured them the action was legal.