p45hst1 or p45hst2 ......cant decide

General Firearms Terminal Ballistic Information
1

i am starting this thread because i have recently discovered that i cannot handle ranger-t 230gr +p (ra45pt) as well as i thought i might have been able to. it is very hot (990fps) and i find that no matter what i do my g21sf leaves my support hand a bit and nearly breaks my grip every time i pull the trigger. i have tried for over 300 rounds to use this load successfully with no avail. i am very accurate with it but split times are no where near as fast as any other .45 acp round that i run. this doesn’t happen when using any other .45 acp round in the g21sf that i have tried. ra45pt is just too much. so i am on to pick a different load from “the list”. i have selected either p45hst1 (+p loaded to 950fps) or p45hst2 (standard pressure loaded at 890 fps). i use hst in the +p flavor in other calibers and find it more than manageable. i don’t even notice the extra 50 fps.

i like an few extra fps if it not debilitating to my performance as a shooter. for reference,here are some things i find attractive about +p ammo

-aids in reliable expansion

-possible increased expansion

-increased function of the weapon when dirty

-increased function of the slide when you might not have time to get a 100% grip on the weapon

-maintain acceptable velocity in cold winter months

-flatter shooting…can be important

so what i am asking is: has any one found ranger-t +p to be “too much” or debilitating to their shooting and found hst +p to be just right? or … if i find Winchester’s 990fps too be too much, then am i just kidding my self that federal’s 950fps will some how be more forgiving? has any one out there tried both?

what is the p45hst1 offering (besides the possible benefits i listed) that p45hst2 does not? i noticed most agencies and departments go with p45hst1 over p45hst2 so, it has to be something …right?

i read this thread:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=62875

a great thread, answered most of my questions. but no real direct comparison between the +p ranger and hst…which is what i need.

and doc’s comments in this thread lead me to believe that felt recoil between the 2 hst offerings is not really “debilitating” or noticeable. he also states that he thinks .45 +p ammo is often loaded way too hot thees days.

i posted this on another forum. aside from 1 or two people i didn’t really get the feed back i was looking for.
http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1435814

i apologize for possibly clogging up our forum with what seems like another “+p” thread. i will purchase a box of both p45hst1 and p45hst2 and see what i run more proficiently. and yes, i know there answer is what ever round i shoot more proficiently with… is the correct answer. i just wanted to check with you and see where you stand on the two hst 230gr offerings and what your experience has been.

2

This is pretty much a no brainer–shoot the P45HST2

3

thanks doc. i thought that was the obvious choice. but why is p45hst1 the selection of departments and agencies over the p45hst2? what is that extra 50 fps doing that the standard pressure isn’t?

4

I second that, torn between these two loadings for my HK45 and seem to be leaning standard pressure. What are we missing?

5

I’d go with the standard pressure due to the fact that it has less perceived recoil yet is no less effective on target. Better to have faster more accurate follow ups…especially when its still an effective load.

Blame any misspellings on Tapatalk

6

I go with the +P for Glock use. It only has slightly more recoil in my Gen4, nothing unmanageable, but like another poster said the extra power will assure cycling in adverse conditions. I wasn’t able to induce the dreaded Glock limp wrist malfunction with the HST1, even purposefully holding it as loose as I could to the point of feeling like I was going to drop it (Of course, I have to admit I have never tried to limp wrist my Glock 21gen4 with HST2 so I guess I can’t really compare for sure). My recollection of shooting Double Tap through my .357 sig Glock was that it was actually painful and HST1 is nothing like that. At $32 for 50, why not buy one box of each and try it for yourself?

7

Just put in order into sgammo for 5 boxes of standard pressure hst2. If I found winchesters +p to be debilitating to my performance I think I was kidding myself in thinking federals +p ( even though loaded slightly slower…950fps) was going to be any different. We will see. I don’t think I am giving up much ( if anything) by going with standard pressure loadings. Well… At least I hope not. I want to squeez the most " performance" out of a hand gun as possible… Just not at the cost of my proficiancy.

8

Uh,…I think this gentleman knows of what he speaks.

Doc doesn’t have the time to go into long dissertations to support every post he makes, but, for sure, he does have support for his statements. Dr. Gary K. Roberts is among the very top experts in terminal ballistics, if not the top expert. You are free not to follow his advice, but there is no upside in that.

9

You are correct and I don’t mean to waste the good Doc’s time, +p is out.

10

The Doc’s recommendation, the p45HST2, is the std pressure round.

11

Sorry meant to put +P is out. Unfortunately our shelf at work is empty on both. Going to have to stick with the Gold dots for now.

12

There is nothing wrong with the 230 gr Gold Dot–good load.