Well, it passed the senate. Now they have to vote on it in the house. There is one last chance to kill the beast.
So, what are we doing to stop this thing?
M_P
The Democrats have been a driving force behind Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae and people need to remember this. Republicans pushed for some reform and oversite and people need to remember this too. Historically Democrats want to and do give away the farm because they know those people waiting with their hands out will elect and re-elect the @$$holes that tell them they don’t have to work as hard as the rest of us.
The voice of the American Citizen is silenced as soon as their vote is cast.
State Rep a scathing email this morning demanding he vote against and I also sent one to ‘Kit’ Bond. Roy Blunts web page was locked up this a.m. …but I tried the backdoor just now and got in he also has my views.
Michael
The Senate vote was easy, as only one third of its members are up for reelection.
Not so in the House. All 435 are facing the voters in about a month.
Given that, I don’t see it passing. A vote for this bill is pretty much political suicide and most everyone in the House knows it.
If this bill doesn’t pass, we won’t get an increase in FDIC insurance, we won’t get relief on alternative minimum tax affecting 20 million taxpayers, you won’t get to deduct sales tax, teachers won’t get to deduct out of pocket teaching supplies, students won’t be able to deduct tuition, energy credits will expire, interest rates will likely go up, it will be much tougher to get a loan to buy a car, make home improvements, or anything else, many many jobs will likely be lost as companies are unable to obtain credit to pay for salaries, many non-bank companies will go bankrupt, a lot of people in your hood will lose their homes, your retirement account values will plument, and the recession will last much longer. It’s one of those pay me now or pay me later things.
Most economists are supporting the bill and they are the experts. At least, more informed than most of us.
The bottom line is that there is much uncertainty whether this bill is a good thing or not. That’s the reason it didn’t pass the first time. For those banks using the plan that survive, the govt will get its money back plus interest plus a % of profits less the cost of the govt trying to run/oversee anything (which is to say there will still be a loss).
What we will ultimately lose is anyone’s guess. It might be $100b, $700b or more than a trillion. At this date it’s impossible to tell what the cost will be and having worked in a bank, I can tell you that it will likely be years before this all shakes out.
Be careful about picking which side of the fence you want to be on without researching the facts. I’m not sure if I’m for it or not, but I’m inclined to go with the economists who study and teach this for a living and they tend to favor it.
There are 541 people who represent us and got us into this mess w/ their laws and budgets. I do encourage you to get rid of those you can come november. It burns me up when some congressman/woman says Bush’s spending plan got us into this mess or Bush’s war is driving up the deficit. That’s a bold face lie! Bush PROPOSES a budget, congress approves it or sends it back. Bush decided to go to war, congress KEPT us in it. 541 people run the country. Your vote can replace a good number of them in november.
It’s funny, but the same economists you praise so highly for their intellect, are also the same one’s telling us that the depression lasted as long as it did because of government medling.
Frankly, I don’t think they have a bloody clue what’s going on or what will happen. They’re just scared. Bunch of flippin’ sheep … good night America, grow a pair!
Congress can give us tax breaks, no alternative minimum tax, raise FDIC whenever they want to. If this bill fails (and I hope to heaven it does) Congress can pass another bill with these provisions to help the middle class while letting the market correct itself - which is what needs to happen. I studied economics and its a “dismal science” that is the same as politics IMHO - depending on who you read and what you like forms your opinions. At the end of the day, economists don’t have a freaking clue about most real-life situations nor do they have any great insights compared to an average guy with common sense.
Think about it, if econolmists were so knowledgeable, how did we get in this mess in the first place? Oh yeah, banks gave out boatloads of mortgages to folks without the income or the means to repay them…but the PHd quants financial engineers said this would diminish risk, yadda yadda yadda.
This thing had better fail. Do we really want to be a socialist society?
The reason this bill will probably pass, in one form or another, is the fact that it will give the Senate and Congress control over another 805 billion dollars that they otherwise will not be able to get their hands on. The effect of this “rescue” is totally un-known, but we do know that it will not be the total amount that they will want to cure the problem. Most of the people do not want this, but like the politicians usually do they will pass this anyway. What some have forgotten is that they are not leaders they are representatives of the people. The President is a leader, Senators and Congressman are supposed to represent our desires not their own. This infusion of money, that the gov. will have to borrow from the FED, will just create more inflation and devalue the dollar.
“When congress is in session, the country is in peril”.
If this bill doesn’t pass, we won’t get an increase in FDIC insurance, we won’t get relief on alternative minimum tax affecting 20 million taxpayers, you won’t get to deduct sales tax, teachers won’t get to deduct out of pocket teaching supplies, students won’t be able to deduct tuition, energy credits will expire, interest rates will likely go up, it will be much tougher to get a loan to buy a car, make home improvements, or anything else, many many jobs will likely be lost as companies are unable to obtain credit to pay for salaries, many non-bank companies will go bankrupt, a lot of people in your hood will lose their homes, your retirement account values will plument, and the recession will last much longer. It’s one of those pay me now or pay me later things.
what about the constitution?.
oh, and you forgot about the sky falling.
Actually,
Most economists are against it.166 Economy Professors from around the country sent a letter to the Senate detailing the flaws in the bailout bill.They recommended doing nothing and allowing the free market to correct itself.They said the fallout from passing such a bill would be devastating.Very promiment businessmen around the country also oppose the bailout.Many Senators and Congressmen stand to loose lots of money if Fannie and Freddie fail.They are not concerned about us.
If this bill passes,you will see an immediate increase in the price of foreign goods.Buying toys for your children at Christmas will be costly.
Hell no. This thing is a mess. I am responsible, pay my bill and do what is right.
Yet, others screw up and want us to bail them out.
Tough. Let the chips fall where they may.
We need smaller and more efficient govt.
Stop sending money overseas, and live with in the budget.
Pay a portion on the debt and live with in our means.
If you do not work, you do not eat.
But, if you are physically or mentally handi capped, we will take care of you.
Especially our veterans 
Yup, you obviously didn’t see the economists against this bailout. Go google Prof. Nourine Roubini, or Janet Tavokali. These are the experts of derivatives. Every economists worth their salt right now are against this bailout, because there’s no plan how they will unfreeze the credit. The problem is lack of confidence/trust, not lack of liquidity. There are trillion of hedge fund sitting on the sideline right now.
http://faculty.chicagogsb.edu/john.cochrane/research/Papers/mortgage_protest.htm
The bill does not pass, then you take however long you need to get a new bill pass, if increasing FDIC is the right solution, so be it.
These headlines from today’s wall street journal:
“Car loans and leases are drying up as dealers, auto-finance companies and other lenders are having trouble finding money to lend to buyers.”
This too regarding schools & colleges:
“A second investment fund offered by investment adviser Commonfund froze most withdrawals this week, posing possible financial strains for the 200 colleges and schools invested in the fund.”
So what happens? Car dealers can’t sell cars, they have to lay off workers. The workers can’t pay their bills and default. They don’t eat out, so the restaurant fails. The restaurant lays off workers and they can’t pay their bills and so on. Big time trickle down effect that will likely affect you.
Schools can’t fund their programs and they have to lay off workers. Did these workers pay their bills? Most likely. Did they cause the crisis? No. Are they negatively impacted? Of course, more so they those of us still with a job. Will the passage of this bill save their jobs? Maybe.
I’m not happy about the situation either, but I’m afraid it’s not just a black/white issue. Yes, we can save money now by not passing the bill, but will anyone venture a guess as to what it will to our economy over the next 5 years. The trickle down effect of letting these banks fail is the real issue.
I have several residential builders as clients. They were screaming 3 years ago. Then my realtors started screaming 2 years ago. Then my closing companies started screaming last year. Then my carpet/flooring companies started screaming. Now everyone is screaming. Out of my 50 businesses I do work for, 6 have failed in the past year. That’s 12% in one year. Yes, you can call it natural selection, survival of the only the most fit. Passing this bill will likely moderate the pain and save a few. Of course, if only a few survive, we will end up w/ monopolies, but that’s ok?
Once again, 541 individuals who you voted into office (hired) are running the show and got you here. If you don’t think they are doing a splendid job, why don’t you just fire them? You have a chance in November.
The President sends a proposed budget to Congress. It may show a surplus or deficit. Congress either approves it or sends it back for revision. At the end of the day, 541 people decide where this country is headed. You hired the 541 people. Only you can fire them. I can tell you I’m disgusted w/ my 541 picks!
Now, how do we make the best of a rotten situation?
The company that I work for just got declined on a 3 year loan for a $26,000 van. Our group does $100 million of the company’s $500 million in annual sales. They wanted to see financials, and since we only broke even the last 2 years they won’t finance us. I have a VISA card with a limit of more than that…
Adios freedom - but everyone can still get their Nikes and Chevy Vans this year. Woo-hoo.
http://apnews.excite.com/article/20081003/D93J5L000.html
M_P
can’t kill it now, the House just passed the pork filled version and it’ll be on it’s way to POTUS for signature. 700 BILLION was too much to pass, so we loaded it up with another 150 BILLION in pork to make it easier for lawmakers to swallow.
It’s a damn shame we don’t have a single Representative with balls in the entire House as this would have been a perfect vehicle to get a repeal of 922(o), aka the Huges Amendment, aka the Machine Gun ban passed by Congress.
Call it the ultimate “poison pill.” Attach it to the legislation and see if anyone has the stones to vote for it.
Instead, we just got soaked for nearly a trillion dollars. :mad: