New GI Magazine Follower

AR/M4 AR General Discussion
21

This is a small thing, admittedly, but it’s one of the things I actively dislike about them, if you want to call it that.

We were conducting a test of an MFAL device, and I was standing behind and to the right of the dude who’s turn it was to shoot the next 210 rounds. I was looking in the direction of the ejection port when he went Winchester on his 2nd mag, and because of the color of the follower, I thought he still had rounds in it and that the bolt had just locked open on its own. Barely figured out what it actually was before I opened my mouth and ruined the cadence of the test-fire. I know, I know, minutiae…

I’ve had opportunity to discuss the “issue” of the follower hump being on the opposite side and its impact on how the rounds are oppositely indexed with 28 or 30 rounds in. Some yokel got all Chicken Little and started squalling about the massive training impact it would have on those who have learned to…note the word I use, he did, too…EXPECT the round on the right side of a fresh magazine.

Survey says AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!! If you’re fingering to see where the round is indexed, you’re doing it to discover that indexing, not anticipate the indexing! Most of the active-thinking folk I know finger it and mentally or verbally say “right” or “left” to themselves, so that, when they do their press-check, they know to look for the opposite indexing after they drop the bolt and then drop the mag. They don’t start expecting a damned thing until AFTER they have a basis upon which to start making informed guesses. That basis is established by visually and tactile-ly (how DO you spell that?) finding where that round is.

Think of it from the standpoint of, at that moment, you’re digging partially-expended mags from a dump pouch, or insert other fabricated what-if here…

If one is anticipating the round being on the right all the time for the purposes of doing a press-check, and it NOT being there (because of a different follower in a mixed batch of green-follower, Pmag, and tan-follower mags, say) totally mind-wipes you, you have other problems to address, none of which have anything to do with the magazine.

^^That’s a summation of how the conversation with the nimrod went. I tried to teach him that the side the round is on should be a joyous discovery, not the disappointment of bad habit, but he’s trying to win the Oscar by going full-retard.

This message has been brought to you by the letter π.

22

Jim, maybe this is showing my ignorance and maybe I’m getting your point but who in the world cares what side the round is on. I didn’t care what side a round happened to be on when I had mags in the Army. We never had any training concerning mags and press checks. If it is the same now as when I was in how could this end up being a training issue. Hearing abaout idiocy such as this stuff makes me glad I’m no longer in at times.

23

I’m with Stick. They should have went with the Magpul followers. I wonder how many millions of dollars wasted coming up with this shit. Another example of the fleecing of America. It is an abortion of the highest order. I can see someone doing a press check and thinking that the see a live round, when they’re actually seeing the follower, when rushed and under certain light levels. As others have said, a fully loaded mag indexing on the left, is not well thought of and will be a training issue to the guys who do a mag check for a chambered round.

As far as who cares. the guys that have been trained or prefer a mag check over a press check will. Many believe doing a press check incorrectly, can lead to a BCG not in full battery or not full closed, causing a “click” instead of a “bang” when you will most likely need it to go “bang”. Like I said, it will be a training issue and a reprogramming of the brain housing group.

Money would have been better spent by providing armorers with Go/No Go gauges for the feed lips and shit canning the mags at the end of every rotation, or sending them back stateside for training mags and provide new mags for deployment.

24

We’re on the same page.

That conversation of mine was with one of the folks that DO care (they are Legion), which could actually be fine presuming that that was the result of having put any thought into it instead of having been taught by rote. More often than not, that isn’t the case.

I’ve had that talk more than once in the last two months. It’s a “thing” with some folks and the new mags, and I won’t prevail upon anybody to take my word for it. It came up with the Tango Down mags when they came forward (for the same silly reason), it’ll come up within your sphere of influence at some point, too.

Have something on hand for the inevitable migraine and an oxygen tank to replace your wasted breath, should you choose to try and help them think it through.

25

Awesome.

26

We’ve had the “new” mags for at least 6 months.
It’s still an aluminum mag with a shitty spring that doesn’t like any number greater than 28.
Whoo.

ETA- I picked up 7 of 'em from the PX for $9 a pop for posterity’s sake.
Worst case, I have spare tubes for the future.

27

You’d have gotten a kick out of some of the stuff I’ve been seeing recently.

If a test is written saying that 30rnd mags will be used, by Joe Pesci, there will be 30 rounds in those magazines! The squints and the silverbacks stuff 'em and try to put them in on a closed bolt. You’d think that the mag was being told to do the dishes AND bring a sammich, what with all the slapping and bashing with fists…

Guys like us, however, are counterclture mavericks with attitude problems for opening a freakin’ bolt or suggesting “I live, like, 3 miles THAT way…I can get Pmags to make up the shortfall of mags because you couldn’t be bothered to do some somple math.”

“Nonono, the test plan calls for USGI mags. Critical!”

“Yo, Poindexter, XX Marine Regiment just bought 25k of them…oh, @#$^$% forget it. Your face is critical…”

FML.

28

Please don’t hate me for laughing!

29

I bought 125 of these and they are on par with the magpul followers. Absolutely no tilt, best feeding mags I have to date for sure and I have never had one to bolt hop, double feed or stick. I USE gi style mags but I have a buttload of p mags set back for a shtf barter item. I updated all of my old mags that I didn’t sell with springs and green followers. I see aluminum holding up better than plastics everyday, so why risk it?

30

I bought 125 of these and they are on par with the magpul followers. Absolutely no tilt, best feeding mags I have to date for sure and I have never had one to bolt hop, double feed or stick. I USE gi style mags but I have a buttload of p mags set back for a shtf barter item. I updated all of my old mags that I didn’t sell with springs and green followers. I see aluminum holding up better than plastics everyday, so why risk it?

31

Holding up better in what way? Overall I’m not seeing the Pmag being trumped by an aluminum one.

32

Plastics/polymers get weak over time. Just look around and see the polymers faded and cracked around you on vehicles. This is just an example, maybe a bad one. But just the same the unbreakable plastics around my house are destroyed by my two teenagers.:sad: I have broken a pmag(empty) when I dropped to the deck in training. It was an older black one without the window, if that matters or not. Time shows plastics breaksdown, and aluminum well it just sits there.

33

One of Kel-Tec’s engineers answered various user questions and stated, in response to a question, that nylon-6 used in theirs and various others’ firearms could be expected to last 50-100 years with proper care, and “30 years absolutely”, see:

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/10/12/gun-design-engineer-answers-your-questions/

It might be a reasonable question to Magpul to ask how long they think their polymers will last before becoming brittle or weak.

34

Somebody better tell HK and Glock that their pistol frames aren’t durable. I guess they were fooled by their decades of hard use and abuse when they could have just looked at the cheap plastic used in items with a 10 year lifespan and near constant sun exposure.

Don’t get me wrong, GI aluminum mags have a hell of a lot more years in service than PMags do, and time will tell if they have the longetivity of the known standard, but keep the comparisons in the same league. I could compare GI mags to old Coke cans, but that wouldn’t be right either.

35

Due to the fact that I have never broken a gi mag I would expect that side to side comparison to be accurate. As for the sun and uv exposure why aren’t pmags in all the soldiers hands in desert climates? I see the falling away and going back to gi mags in most battalions I know of. As for the glock and hk thing, I have already had to put a buffer in my glock 34 due to slide hammer. Yes I do shoot that much, approximately 15,000 rounds last year in 9mm alone. I own the plastics, g34, 35, 26, hk usp expert, keltecs etc and realize the limitations that come with owning them. Comparitavely, Old Coke cans were steel, not aluminum.

36

Stick,

Don’t look at the M855A1 thread over in the terminal ballistics forum. You blood pressure would double in a hot minute. :wink:

Can P-A even call it ‘research’ when the very ‘concepts’ they are purporting to develop already exist in a VERY tangible way on the commercial market?

Even a C-products knock-off makes more sense than this stupid tan follower…at least I can press check that at the trunk of my patrol car at night after chambering know whether a damn round went in or not. Seeing as it hasn’t been seen as ‘fiscally responsible’ to buy me a functioning trunk light…the change to the ‘tan’ follower would seriously dick me over if I were in the dot-MIL. Thank GAWD I can buy my own PMAGs, Lancers, and Magpul GenIII followers.

It makes about as much sense as putting a brass colored follower in a shotgun. What a fake-out.

37

So if these are ripoffs of the Magpul followers then doesn’t Magpul have them patented? Can’t they take legal action?

38

Please don’t get me started on the trunk light of my cruiser…

39

I purchased a couple of GI mags made by Brownell’s with the new followers at a local shop a few months ago. After a few range trips, here’s my $0.02

Pros:
-Followers work fine. No feeding issues. (haven’t tested for iraqistan dust conditions, though I think I’ll be doing so come next range trip)
-At 7 bucks a pop, it wasn’t a bad deal.

Cons:
-Shifted hump, totally counter-intuitive for loading GI mags unless you count each individual round or have them loaded via strippers. (honestly, this wouldn’t be a con if you only have mags with the new follower) and yeah, admin reloads will be a bitch if you mix mags with old & new followers.
-Spring dimensions are different, making them impossible to retrofit with Magpul followers unless you get an entirely new spring.

The only thing I see really “wrong” with the new followers, though is that the polymer isn’t self-lubricating like the magpul followers.
Unless I start having issues, though, I’ll be trusting these mags like my magpul’d GI mags.

Yeah, it’s different but it isn’t bad. I agree that it is disappointing that the magpul followers weren’t chosen, but c’est la vie.

EDIT:
Took apart a mag to compare the follower to a Magpul follower

here are a few side by sides




Here’s the big “Fuck You” to magpul and any other aftermarket followers.
The spring made to fit the new follower design is longer than the original spring in GI mags that would normally on Magpul followers.

40

Haha. I wouldn’t dare. :smiley:

My '05 Impala eats trunk lightbulbs like Rosie O’Donnell eats little children.

I’m close enough to deadline mileage that only ‘mandatory’ maintenance will be performed. Electrical issues regarding my trunk light have not yet been deemed to be officer-safety related. BUT, last time we had a barricaded gunman, I was on the hasty entry team w/ my 14.5" 870 and was loading up by my open trunk when my Sgt asked why I didn’t turn the trunk light on. He said, “It sure would make it easier on yourself.” I just laughed and asked him to turn it on for me. 'Nuff said. :wink:

Naturally, fleet has no comment on when I’ll be getting a newer vehicle. I’d be happy as a clam with this one if i could just get this handled and a few front-fender dents removed. Rant=over.