Hope I can word this correctly. When I think of match triggers I also think of $1,000 plus uppers from a highly regarded manufacturer. Other the other hand when thinking mass produced AR15s I think standard run of the mill LPK.
Is there any practical advantage to having match trigger(1 or 2 stage) in a mass produced upper?
First thing is the fact that the trigger is in the lower. A match trigger is of use if you are using the gun for precision shooting. If you are using it for a SHTF gun or defense a match trigger may prove too light for your needs. It will improve the pull over just about any factory trigger.
hmm… your question is a bit oversimplified, i think. ANY gun/shooter combo can benefit better shooting from a “better” trig, especially if the current trig is a piece of shit.
i think what you’re asking is: is it worth the expense and time to install an after-market trigger in a 2-3+MOA gun…?
that’s gonna be your call. i pretty much run whatever FCG came with my LPK, unless the FCG that came with the LPK is particularily crappy. i have, i’d say, three guns “worthy” of fine 2-stag trigs, but only one has one. the other two have good, smooth (either because they came that way or i honed 'em) service trigs, and are well served by them.
the most important component of this formula is the trigger finger, though… if you havent mastered trigger squeeze, no trig is going to do that for you. furthermore, if you haven’t mastered the service-trigger, a 2stage might improve your shooting, but it’s not going to improve your shooting ability.
dunno if any of this helps…
Well in thinking of terms of SHTF then it is better to have a standard trigger setup I’m assuming. Was at the range today and had a light primer strike. The 2 stage trigger is nice but doesn’t seem to deliver with authority. Would a change in the hammer spring to the job?
The one thing most, if not all two stage triggers for the AR platform suffer from is reliability. Fine for a plinker or range toy but nothing I want to bet my ass on.
USSOCOM has bought the Geissele Super Select Fire trigger for carbines in select units.
The trigger improves the shooters’ performance and outlasts the weapons. It is deployed in combat. It works.
Was at the range today and had a light primer strike.
Be careful here. This is not a FAL. You can use a heavy hammer spring with a “match” trigger. Nice mod if you have a 5.45 upper firing Russian surplus. All I am saying is light primer hit not result of crap trigger necessarily.
You might want to search the forums for past info on reliability. Some have not worked as well as others…some high $$ models like Giesel(sp?),Knights or Jewell, are hard to come by and folks sware by them, especially mated with a match gun.
Agree with most folks here, trigger squeeze is it, but if you really have a crap trigger…well, best to say it is worth it to have spares of everything, you know, to experiment with…
I’m clear on your point but it was a light primer strike on Privi Partizan M193 white box ammo and there was hardly a dent on the primer. This got me to thinking about reliability since my other AR has a Stag Arms lower with LPK and has had no issues with it and it has 3 times the ammo count.
To me it’s not about name brand but reliability. I have been accused of being a practical man to which I plead guility.
First the disclaimer. I’m a very experienced (almost 50yrs) shooter but a novice at ARs. I have three ARs (yes I’m still a novice), one with a standard single stage trigger, one with an Adco Improved National Match, one with a Geissele DMR. The difference is startling but only if you know what to look for and you’re a good shot. I have other rifles with two-stage triggers so I’m used to them.
The way a two-stage works is that you have a long take up followed by a stop, and then a very crisp break. My Adco NM starts with a 2lb 1st stage, stops and then when you’re ready breaks crisply at 7lbs. But it feels like a crisp 5lb trigger (7-2=5lbs). To me this is much safer than a 5lb single stage match trigger. If you have to take a quick unaimed snap shot it will feel just like a 7lb single stage. Adco’s improvement is to replace a breakage prone pin with something stronger and I trust the folks at Adco. I like this one a lot.
The Geissele is amazing. Mine is set for a 3lb 1st stage, and the second stage breaks at 4-1/2lbs. That gives the feel of a 1.5lb match trigger. This isn’t for everybody but wow. A quick emergency snap shot is still going to feel like a 4-1/2lb trigger, but an aimed shot will feel like a 1.5lb trigger. A bit like my M1a national match trigger but better. Again this isn’t for everybody.
I also like the long take up of a two stage because it’s more idiot resistant. Notice I did not say “proof”. We all know that our finger will never enter the trigger guard before we are ready to fire, but we also know that scared people do stupid things. A two-stage trigger is going to have to be moved a lot further before the bang. But it’s still no slower than a single stage.
If not a match or “high end” rifle. Get something like an LMT 2-stage trigger or even the (some have said) less robust RRA Match 2-stage trigger. Even CMMG has put out a trigger.
If you are putting together a “Match” or “Target” rifle get the aftermarket specialty triggers out there like the Geissele.
or better yet- if it’s not a match gun, run a standard 1S service trig.
It’s not a match gun but I was advised that there were advantages to having a 2 stage trigger. It’s just after yesterday’s range session it seemed lacking something. It’s a Rock River 2 stage with a Rock River lower parts kit.
I’ve been told that the smooth trigger will be lost if a stiffer hammer spring is installed. Will this cut down on light primer strikes?