The military is much smaller today than it was back then. And we have a larger population from which to pull the best soldiers to maintain high standards.
But back then it seems like most able bodied men signed up out of a sense of duty. Not being fit to serve was a mark of shame for some.
Should there be a large scale conflict in the future that requires the number of men WWII required, I do not think the young people of today would sign up so willingly. For most of them, it’s someone else’s problem. And if they were drafted, I think there would be a much higher percentage of unfit recruits.
I think men in general were tougher back then due to life experience. But I am confident that the Marines maintain their standards today, they probably just have to weed through more applicants to find the good ones.
Wow! Really? life was harder for Marines in the past?
How about life in general was harder. To say that the previous generation always had it rougher is painfully obvious in any field or topic. Does it mean they were better men? NO because this generation raised in the same time would have done the same job.
People are watching Highly Romanticized Movies about WW2 on history channel VS all-most live footage from Ass-stan on CNN everyday, ofcourse they will look at WW2 as some kind of dignified struggle against the clearly evil power vs the public veiw of this war as"One man's terrorist is another's Freedom Fighter".
Lets not be silly.
Nazi’s made lampshades out of Jewskin.
Hahdjis make IED’s and hide them in bodies.
Evil is evil,war is war. Our training makes us no better as men, neither did they’re lack there of.
Wow you got all that out of a simple observation. I am simply astounded by your superior powers of observation. I didn’t mention any feelings about the romanticized feelings I had for the Marines of yesteryear and yet somehow you smoked me out. I stand in awe.
Seriously, I make a simple observation about a POINT SOME ELSE MADE and you decide to be a douche. Well played sir.
I was born during WWII and joined the Corps (pronounced core) in 1961, I was issued an M1 rifle that seemed very light back then. In 1962 I was issued an M-14 brand new right out of the box and carried one in Vietnam during 1966 and 67. I grew up watching WWII movies and in certain ways found some simularities. What shocked me the most was the voice of treasion in our streets while I served. Marines will always rise to the occiasion, will the Americian people?
i’ve always looked up to the Marines that have come before me. not because things were harder for them, things were harder in general back then. i look up to them for their Honor and Courage under fire. i look up to them for the things that they accomplished, often with less support than what was needed. i look up to them because they upheld the standards and traditions of the Marine Corps.
it’s no different today, Marines are still Marines. we still fight in dirty, nasty places that mainstream America has never heard of. we still don’t have all of the latest high speed gear and equipment, we make due with what we have. we still uphold the traditions and standards of Marines past. life in the Marine Corps is always going to be tough and war is never going to be easy. the more modern conveniences that we have the more we’re expected to do, IMHO it all evens out. (my pack weighs less so now i can carry more stuff = same weight as before)
it’s more fun talking to old Marines, there’s something different about the way the old salts talk. my wife (Army vet) don’t understand why i like to hang out with the old guys so much and it’s tough for me to explain it. call it respect, call it inspiring, call it entertainment, call it what you want, the Old Corps guys have earned the reputation and respect. all i’m doing is trying to not let them down.
If Hollywood was as interested in making flattering movies about today’s fighting men as they it is in making flattering movies about the soldiers who fought in WWII, I doubt these sort of questions would ever get asked.
Instead, now, you can win an Oscar for making movies about reckless shitheads who endanger and even shoot their own teammates.
You are comparing reality to a Hollywood production?
The conscripts back in the 40s were a bunch of kids who were drafted. They were just as scared and unsure as anyone today. They may have come from rougher backgrounds on average, but they were no where near as well trained and educated as the modern professional Marine or Soldier. In the end, you are comparing a Hollywood representation of people 60 years ago, to a somewhat misinformed perception of today.
To accurately gauge that you’d need a war on the scale of WWII…which isn’t in the cards at the moment. When a relatively small band of morons flew planes into buildings recruiter’s offices were filled with people looking to go find the bastards who planned it and to kill them. They’ve been busy doing that for the last several years.
I don’t really know how much more evidence of grit you need. When the call went out plenty of people answered it and did their jobs well…and they weren’t being forced to do it by drafts, either.
To an extent. But a lot of training today emphasizes safety over the realities of training for combat. SOF units routinely lose warriors to training accidents because they tend to train closer to the edge. Regular units certainly shouldn’t train as close to that edge because they don’t consist of the same types that SOF units do. They tend to be older, smarter, and more experienced, and know the difference between dangerous and unsafe.
That being said, we could benefit from a little more realism in our training.
Yes, training can become so encumbered by safety that it loses some practical value…but remember this:
In WWII training wasn’t dangerous because it was super-awesome combat preparation. It was dangerous because they didn’t know a lot of stuff that we know now. The guys on the front line bitched about the lack of realism in training in WWII too. Training wasn’t lethal because it was awesome. Those two seem to be too easily confused.
WWII was a meat grinder that got a lot of people killed who wouldn’t have been killed had the WWII military had the knowledge, technologies, and capabilities that our modern forces have. One of the reasons for increased concern about safety in the modern military is because the individual fighting man isn’t seen as a sacrificial number anymore. Yes, that can be taken too far, but in general it’s a good thing that getting an entire company of Marines wiped out in a brave but ultimately pointless maneuver isn’t seen as laudable these days.
Even though “regular” military units may not train like the SF/SOF guys do, the “regular” units seem to be doing a pretty darn good job of turning living bad guys into worm food.
I’m third-generation Marine infantry. I have always considered it an honor to have veterans of WWII, Korea, and Vietnam as my friends. And it’s also a gift to sit with a young “03” and listen to them today.
Most of the Marines fighting today are young enough to be my children. I am constantly humbled when I read of their valor. I am filled with pride when given the opportunity to listen to them.
The Corps is in excellent hands. These fine young men and women make the Eagle, Globe and Anchor glean even brighter. They do not tarnish it.
Fallujah is a battle streamer that belongs on our colors, no less than Belleau Wood, Okinawa or Khe Sanh.
I don’t think he was comparing reality to a Hollywood production, he was pointing out that most Americans don’t see a difference between the two.
I’m a former 0311, and I recall that we were taught a lot of history in boot camp, things like Bois de Belleau, Tarawa, and Chosin, in a way that made them examples of accomplishments we should strive to emulate. That said, we always considered the Old Corps to be tougher, even if it was you finishing SOI one class before another guy; that made you salty. (:
