When someone posts “what AR should I buy/build?”, this being the M4Carbine.net forums, what configuration do you automatically think of? Before finding out the OP wants it for the typical plinking/HD/SD/SHTF/patrol use?
Myself, I think of a simple 16" carbine with an FSB, A2 birdcage, MOE/CTR/M4 stock and, of course, built with the right parts.
Matter of fact, the Colt 6920 is very close to what I think the ideal archetype universal AR of the M4Carbine.net set would be.
Or theBCM® CAR-16LW Carbine Mod 0 (you’ll need to add a rear sight)
I think today, the 16" lightweight carbine is the most versatile configuration. It’s short enough to be handy in in the tight confines of the urban and suburban environments most of us civilians live in while still offering enough ballistics to down a coyote out to 300 yards or more. While a heavy barrel would be more consistent and durable in sustained firing, a lightweight barrel with a quality bore will still deliver better than adequate accuracy for a general purpose carbine.
There are jobs that other configurations will do better than the 16" carbine, but those configurations are more specialized, such as a 20" for precision shooting, such as prairie dog hunting. The 16" doesn’t have any special requirements complicating matters, such as the pinned muzzle device of a 14.5" barrel or NFA paperwork for SBRs.
For versatility, ease of ownership, simplicity and practicality, the 16" carbine gets the job done.
How is your “can’t go wrong to start with” AR recommendation configured and why?
Colt 6920 is right on the money in my opinion. 6721 is just fine as well. Does everything fairly well, very adaptable and proven over and over and over.
The similar makes from BCM and DD fit the same bill.
Mostly agree just that the 6721 has a heavy profile barrel and 1/9 twist. I bought one for my wife a few years ago, and it is a good carbine just HB is not needed and 1/9 limits bullet selection up into the 75/77 grain category.
A 6920 would have the same length barrel, lighter, and comes with a 1/7 twist.
Overall there are so many options but I think overall a 16" carbine or midlength gas system ‘carbine’ from a quality manufacturer with a quality BCG, lower, and LPK is starting out on the right foot. Standard handguards or not is not really important. At least an ability to mount a light, RDS, and irons of some sort is crucial.
Most first time buyers in the AR market have little to NO trigger time on the weapon. Because of this, they do not know what they don’t know and end up buying a gun based off of “feelings.” :stop:
Not everyone needs a rail or an after market grip, stock, etc, etc and since they don’t even know what they even like, why buy anything at all??? People would be wise to buy a bone stock gun, ammo and mags. Then, after making sure the gun is reliable, look for a basic carbine class. At said class, they can learn more about their weapon and shoot others peoples AR’s.
With the above newly acquired knowledge, they can make an informed decision on what they like and what they don’t like.
As a gun and accessories dealer, if I had a DOLLAR every time someone changed out one rail for another or just go back to plastic HG’s, A2 grips and GI stocks, I would be rich! LEARN WHAT YOU LIKE AND THEN BUY IT!
I have shot AR’s here and there for years and owned a stock colt years ago but sold it due range limitations and lack of time. Now I have more time and found a great range & M4C. That said I have a BCM 16" upper w/ a Troy 10" rail. All I have is BUIS, T1 & a light and it does everything I could possibly ever need. After shooting and taking some classes were I was able to shoot other AR’s I noticed I shot better and was more comfortable overall with a 12" rail, allows me more control. So I purchased a Centurion C4 12" and purchased from Grant a BCM BFH 14.5" middy (I will admit because I love the look of the 12" rail & 4"s of barrel). I think that for versatility, ease of ownership, simplicity and practicality a 16" carbine be it a straight 16" or 14.5" pinned with a quality rail allows for a variation of options as you grow into your AR and learn what your particular mission is that drives what you actually need. I think unless you want a KISS set up most people will eventually add a light or other add on.
Oh, come on guys.
“Buy a 6920” is the easy way out. :lol:
Now, for clarity, I do believe that the 6920 is a great choice for a first or only carbine.
However, given the advancements in the field, I would tweak that a bit.
I do prefer a fixed FSB for a first gun (one less part to worry about, retains upgradability), and I think that the MOE handguard represents a tremendous value, but I prefer to be able to extend on the handguard more than a carbine length MOE permits.
I also prefer a midlength gas system, and see no reason that one should be urged away from them for a 16" barrel. Worried about non-standard parts? Order a spare gas tube with your purchase. If you burn through 2 gas tubes before shooting out a barrel, you are (in common internet parlance) doing it wrong.
As is frequently discussed, lightweight barrels can be a great option. I do not insist on them, but I can appreciate them, and having the option to lose front-end weight for certain applications/users is sensible.
Many will say “but if it’s your first AR how do you know?” and I believe that is valid. Ergonomics play a role. Intended use plays a role. Finances plays a role. You wouldn’t buy a car without test driving it. You wouldn’t buy a house without taking a tour. So get out and shoot!
If you have previous law enforcement or military service you have some idea from that. Shoot some friends rifles. Rent some at your local range/gun store. Go to a tac night or tactical class where you can rent a firearm. Gain some experience and idea of what suits and fits you best before plunking down a couple of thousand dollars in a firearm, mags, cleaning kit, bag, etc. Don’t forget to research, research, research and shop around for the best price. Your local gunstore is rarely…if ever…where you’ll find the best price.
I’d go with a base Colt if you want carbine length and a DD/BCM if you want midlength and go from there. If you have absolutely no experience I wouldn’t build one for your first…just as I wouldn’t recommend building your first PC as a “Frankenstein” piece if it’s your very first. You can build upon your rifle with accessories that suit your ergonomics (grip, stock, etc) and uses (flashlight mount, rail system, etc) as you go and experiment. You’ll probably never eliminate 100% of the buying of things you end up changing later but you can cut it down substantially by purchasing smart.
I would prefer a 14.5" barrel, but it complicates things with the need to pin the muzzle device. SBR has the added hassle of a federal tax stamp and (from what I understand) the need to let the feds know when it’s taken to another state. 16" barrel is easier to deal with for most people. Shorter is fine but requires more dedication and commitment on the part of the shooter. It was easier for me to get a 16" upper shooting now than the 14.5".
I think a middy is better than a carbine because of the lessened violence of the pressure curve. However, I cannot prove that it’s worth spending time arguing for or against one or the other. My choice was a middy. About the only argument I can make for it is the longer sight radius, longer handguards and to me, it looks better. All of these reasons are personal.
To me, the difference between middy and carbine is minor. If I had a carbine length gas system and wanted a longer handguard or longer sight radius, I’d choose either selling the upper or breaking out the Sawzall and cutting down the FSB, installing a longer handguard and mounting a new front sight to it. Both are viable choices.
As far as the which the M4Carbine Approved GP AR would have, I think the consensus of this board would be 33% for the carbine, 33% for the middy, 33% 33% couldn’t care less and the remaining 1% just want to rave about Olybushrocks being as good as a Colt
This topic is actually kinda relavent to me. When I first came here two years back (yeah…long time lurker, not much posting) it was to do as much research as I could, as it has the best signal to noise of any place I’ve found.
Anyway, I have a fair bit of shooting experience. I already knew what I liked, so that’s what I built- a Recce-ish style AR using a Centurion LW CHF 16" and 1-4x variable.
But people are always asking me what they should do for their first gun, and my fiancee wants one of her own. So I took it as an opportunity to build what I consider the quintessential M4C rifle (and the one I tend to recommend to others to build).
BCM LW 16" middy upper (I’m using the CHF LW, but not necessary)
Magpul MOE middy (with the option of the Centurion middy)
Vltor A5 system (I threw on a MOE stock)
Light (I used IWC SMC and VTac mini L4)
Sling
Red dot of choice, I used XPS 2
I think for 99% of users, that gun will cover most everything they should want to do with it, be it training, home defense, plinking, casual gaming, and even a decent ranch gun. It meets all the right specs, and doesn’t have any unnecessary “fat.”
I’m helping a buddy out with his first AR right now. He has some trigger time, as he is an AR Certified Operator with his PD, but we know that means squat as a lot of dept’s don’t exactly have stashes of favorable AR’s. Bushmaster and DPMS were the two impressed upon him by his peers and superiors in the dept., but I think I’ve done a good job breaking down that misconception (a big help being “The Chart” and EoF from Rob S). As of right now it seems we will be going with build like this:
16" middy (BCM, DD etc.)- I personally think starting with a FSP for a first timer is best. 16" means no pinning so he will be free to play w/ muzzle devices or possibly install a rail down the road w/o having to ruin a muzzle device. A Middy also offers slightly less recoil and arguably increased reliability. He also has longer arms and in handling my rifles feels more comfortable with the extra length of HG.
MOE hand guards for simplicity as he won’t know if he needs/wants a rail for a while. Also gives the option of mounting a VFG/Light/Sling mount down the road if needed. Keeps initial cost low.
The rest is pretty basic. keep the lower and parts mil-spec and from reputable dealers (Grant, BCM, DD etc.)
Just to be clear, I have nothing against 16" Carbines, I started there myself. I just think that the Middy offers a little bit more and given that the two can be had for roughly the same price there aren’t many reasons to choose a Car over a Mid.
BUT, I’m gonna go with a BCM 16" government-profile middy upper w/ MOE HG’s over a std BCM lower w/ an H buffer.
That config will run ANYTHING regardless of conditions.
I put all my newbie buddies into that and they fuggin love it. You can switch muzzle devices, rail systems, FSB’s, triggers, etc as they grow as shooters.
It’s a true do-all that benefits from the mid length gas system. I usually send out the PDF of Pat Roger’s “Filthy 14” article from SWAT mag.
