Well, according to this, it sounds like the M27 is now officially to be the USMC’s new rifle. https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/hk-protest-usmc-fields-m27-iar-shot-show-2018/
Anyone have any further insight into the truth of this?
It’s been touched on. They could do worse. I think it’s not a bad idea from a layperson’s perspective.
They are versatile rifles. IAR, Carbine, SPR, etc while all being functionally the same.
This was the idea sorta behind the XM8 project where everyone had the same gun just different roles. For a relatively small branch, this isn’t a bad idea.
Maybe go to G rails later.
ETA Author needn’t look much farther, there are quite a few rifles assembled in GA ready to buy.
I just hope people dont try to chase the HK 243/433 dragon.
Right now I believe the plan is to buy up to 58,000 and issue just to infantry.
Only problem I can think of is that it’s heavy for a general purpose rifle. Maybe the Marines will eventually put a lighter barrel in the general issue guns and call them M27A1s.
I also have to wonder if the Army is going to consider changing its mind and pick up a 416 variant as well. It seems like they have a thing about not letting the Marines get cooler toys then them. A decade ago, the Marines got their cool, new digital camo. So the Army needed to get a cool, new digital camo that was uniquely their own. Now the Marines have a cool new rifle, so I’d imagine the Army will want one as well.
Not to mention, it’s France’s new rifle, potentially Germany’s new rifle (we’ll see what happens with the 433, of course), it’s been Norway’s rifle for awhile, and it’s been the rifle for all the top SOF and CT units in the Western World.
It’s going to be an interesting few years in firearms development. If the US Army picks it, the 416 design will likely be the new standard for AR design.
Not an expert, just a bloke with an opinion but…if all goes according to prophecy; the 433 will be the “new” export gun for HK while they finally adopt the 416. There’s a reason for the mag interoperability between AR/G36 magazines. It’s really not the gun the 416 is. More of a less irritating G36. So, ideally Bundeswehr finally buys the 416 and the lesser nations who buy HK G36s will buy 433s and the G36 slowly and quietly gets retired. The rifle (G36) is a stop-gap footnote between G3 and 416.
Without getting into the lame piston v. DI debate; 41x rifles check a lot of boxes and have a solid track record.
If the Germans pick the 433 then something fell through.
I doubt the big army will adopt the 416 because DI guns aren’t broke and 416s aren’t cheap even at wholesale price.
But if one is going to run a rifle as an IAR then yeah a piston facilitates that a bit easier. But otherwise it would be unnecessarily prohibitive. For a smaller branch like the Marine Infantry, not a bad idea. But at a certain point there’s just too much gun for people who realistically wouldn’t need it and where the current rifle checks all the boxes.
Besides both normal ARs and the 416 use the same magazines. They are interesting rifles and I’d love to get an MR 556 at some point.
I would never make full use of the rifle’s potential just hitting paper but despite a bit more heft; the rifles offer exceptional accuracy out of the box and just plain work. An easy button for sure.
I think we, if the stars align, may be seeing a 1980s HK 2.0 in America with the new Army CSASS, the Marine M27, and an uptick in US production. Quality will be the same and before anyone scoffs; most Mercedes and VWs are made in Alabama and Tennessee.
The VP9 is a much worthier Glock alternative than Sig or M&P. There’s interesting things afoot and if price can come down on 556 and 762s then they will be much more attainable as opposed to being kind of a luxury gun.
A lot going on to consider.
They are not going Corps-wide; the current plan is for infantry only.
Excellent news for the Marines.
Bad news for budget conscious LARPErs
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Apparently the infantry is (finally) going to get 21st century gear and training too. Ops-core helmets, electronic ear pro, squad level comms, binocular NVGs, UTVs, suppressors etc.
The older officers and SNCOs will fight it tooth and nail (I had a battalion commander that wouldn’t let us wear FROG gear on deployment), but it’s definitely the right track. Train and equip infantry to a higher standard so they can relieve some of the burden on SOF.
Those things were at a ‘test and evaluation’ level. They won’t be distributed infantry-wide.
Definitely a step in the right direction.
There’s also units out west working along the same lines. Like I said, they’ll have to fight tooth and nail to get there, but I think it’ll happen.
A more recent article:
Meh.
Shoulda gone with the OICW.
Army is holding out for LSAT, polymer cased telescoped ammo in the 6-6.5 mm range is the future. Then hopefully the Marines will surplus all their M27 uppers. :dance3:
I want to know more about the 16" barrel being “more lethal.” The article isn’t 100% clear on this.
I’m sure it has to do with the little bit extra velocity generated vs. the M4… adds a little bit to “lethal” range.
So, to open a can of worms…our civilian 16" carbines were superior all along?
I like to think so ;)… maybe USMC should have just stuck to the A4’s and modded them a bit. Of course, this one has a piston and everyone knows a piston is better…
16" is a good 80% length.
Not much it can’t do without messing with new calibers.
The future is 16" Mid length gas for DI.
14.5 comes from the CAR-15 and working around the carbine gas.
The difference is so negligible as to be moot ballistics wise.
The bullet is gonna spin the exact same amount of revolutions before leaving the barrel regardless.
The Colt CAR (not CAR-15 but CAR) 24" ekes out more revolutions per twist rate but that’s a lot of barrel and was pretty niche (but an interesting rifle).
ETA to clarify I dont think/know if the Colt CAR was ever used by the military but was in Colt Catalogue for some years and was marketed towards the police for a semi auto precision rifle
There is no future for DI systems.
I must respectfully disagree.
You will not find a more proven, weight reducing small arms innovation.
Of what I have, my “not coming back” rifle is a DI 7.62.
In the year 2065, there will still be DI rifles in combat use provided energy weapons aren’t a thing.