My buddy bought one of these and brought it over today to put on a rail and some other stuff.
I was checking it out and noticed that the safety selector had a detent stop between “fire” and “safe” when the hammer forward.
Whats the deal?
Pull the selector out and look at the detent groove. It’s probably just a ridge from the MIM process. I had one do that once before and I was able to fix it with a triangular jewler’s file.
Uh - if the hammer is forward (not cocked) then the selector shouldn’t rotate more than about 10-15 degrees down from the fire position, and should have a hard stop after that little rotation. That’s how every single AR15 I’ve used has operated.
If you mean it has an intermediate stop when the hammer is cocked (rearward) then it sounds like some sort of burr on the track, as posted above.
Uhh…uhhhhh…I know how an AR 15 safety is supposed to work. What part of “the safety selector had a detent stop between “fire” and “safe” when the hammer forward.” didn’t you understand? The hair trigger sarcasm here is amazing sometimes.
Thank you Quiet-Matt for your polite response. As I said the gun is not mine so I will let him know or check it out the next time I see him.
I am honestly puzzled by this reply. Are you saying that the selector will go all the way to safe even when the hammer is not cocked? Otherwise we must be using terms differently, or am I much sleepier than I think I am.
I’m not sure how to explain it better but here you go:
When the hammer IS NOT cocked you can flip it toward “Safe” and it will click and stick half way there.
What is weird is the “click” you hear and feel is exactly the same as when you go to “Safe” (obviously with hammer cocked) or back to “Fire”.
Something is wrong but I was asking what it could be. My buddy didn’t take anything apart or monkey with it so it came from the factory that way.
I didn’t note that you had said this happens when the hammer is forward or de-cocked. If that’s the case, what you are probably feeling is the edge of the selector shelf coming in contact with the rear portion of the trigger.
In some selectors the cut is milled deeper than others and this will alow the selector to move a little further toward fire in condition 4.
Perhaps that’s what you’re feeling. If you have another selector, drop it in there ans see if it helps eliminate the overtravel if it bothers you. If not, it’s certainly not hurting anything.
-Matt
It’s normal in my experience. The click in between Fire and Safe isn’t though. The selector isn’t spring loaded, only the selector detent is.
When the hammer is forward (uncocked) you can still rotate the selector 1/4 way to Safe (not completely, which some Jard triggers allow), at this point the detent is out of the detent hole and sitting on the detent groove, but there’s no detent hole between the one between Fire and Safe positions. Since there’s nothing that will motivate and rotate the selector either way except you finger, there it stays, until your finger flicks it back to Fire, or you can charge the weapon and set it to Safe.
When the weapon is on Fire, the selector center’s round portion comes in contact with the trigger’s rear extension and stops it from being rotated all the way to Safe, but there’s some slack, which allows it to be rotated to Safe a little.
The click shouldn’t sound like the detent dropping inside the detent holes in the selector center, which is a loud click.
Just to clarify, I’m not concerned that it moves but that it sticks there. I didn’t think it was hurting anything (the safety functions when cocked) but the “detent” will actually hold the selector there and feels like it was meant to.
We didn’t have time to take it off and look at it. I thought I would ask here to see if others noticed this ever.
No other AR 15 that I ever handled did this…but I’m not sure I would have tried it either. I noticed it showing him a function check. If he can bring it back over this week I will check it out because I’m really curious now.
I’m sure you know this but I will say this for those that don’t (most folks here do), unless the detent spring is right about the verge of being backed out of the detent hole, it’s still in the detent hole and the detent spring will force it down and back into the hole because of the cone shaped detent hole, it seems as though the selector was spring loaded even though it isn’t.
While the detent is riding on the detent groove and well clear of the detent holes, there’s nothing that will make it go either way, save for the user’s finger rotating the lever, so there it stays until the user decides otherwise.
As there are tolerances in every part, and MIM/cast parts may vary more than billet/machine parts, so too the degree of movement will vary.
The receiver has many parts that together have dynamics that can be altered by a single component being slightly on the plus or minus side of the specs, or out of specs.
The typical semi auto selector is not within milspecs which we hold ours to, it’s thinner. This can be a good thing as it accommodates more after market triggers, but it doesn’t change that the original specs diameter is wider.
Yes, but if “feels” as if there is and the selector will stay in that position with and audible and tactile “click”.
I’ll post a pic when I can get the gun over here.
I broke out my M&P and tried the same thing.
Same results as the original poster; from a hammer down position the safety will rotate a few degrees as the pin is forced out of the detent and then the force needed to rotate the lever will lessen as it pin slides along the groove.
What does it all mean?
Not a dang thing.
It ‘feels’ like there’s another detent because the force required to rotate the lever has decreased, (pin is no longer being forced up, it’s just sliding on the groove.) No such increased force is required to rotate the lever back to Safe as the pin is again just sliding along the groove until it clicks down into the detent. The lever will also stay in any position between the two until the pin begins to enter the detent …which takes about 4.0375 degrees of travel.:lol:
So your saying it will snap into a “detent” between Fire and Safe and stay there?
Interesting. My Colt does not do that.
MIM selectors can be rough at times, the detent groove may have a burr in it that wasn’t polished out or removed, there should be nothing but a V groove between the two detent holes.
Photo courtesy of Stickman, it’s a selector center we make, you can see how it is with a machined selector center.
Here’s a close up of a MIM selector. The detent groove is notably shallower, but no bumps or extra hole between the detent holes.
Thanks for posting Duffy.
This issue with the safety reminded me to pick up an ambi safety that I wanted for my carbine. The shop near my house had a Troy in stock (sorry Duffy). I installed it and it does the same thing as my buddies M&P. My stock Colt lever absolutely doesn’t do this. I think I am going to take it out an check for burrs.
As for the Troy, its not as easily to manipulate and I not sure the stock length lever gets in my way. Maybe I should have got the BAD ASS;)
OK, don’t have the M&P to look at but here is a side by side of the Troy and the Colt. The Troy does exactly what the M&P does. There are cut very different. I don’t think I would have ever paid attention to this… COLT is on the LEFT:
I guess if it works there is nothing to worry about…
If they do the same thing, maybe you can check for wear marks on the selector center, also you can remove the trigger and hammer, but leave the selector, selector detent and pistol grip on the receiver to see if the selector still hits something between Safe and Fire.
Re: Troy vs. Battle Arms, it’s another topic 
We want to be useful members on m4c and contribute, we’re not here to hawk our gear. The pictures I posted are of use, it’s cool you got a Troy, we have a healthy respect for Troy’s gear 
They do the same thing in different guns…meaning the Troy safety in my Colt has the same issue as my friend stock trigger in his M&P. Which makes me think the stock M&P will look similar to the Troy.
Hm, maybe you should try one of ours then 
I may have to. The little pin you push down in the Troy went down and stayed down when I reassembled:mad: