Hello,
I would like to buy my first rifle in US, please let me know what are you thinking about LWRC products ?
Can I buy any better AR than LWRC ? I was reading opinion about LWRC products: Cadillac of AR15s, that’s true ?
I think about LWRC M6A2.
Thanks a lot !
I wouldn’t take anything from that company for free.
If I were in the market for a new, premium AR, I’d go with a Colt 6920, a DD M4, or a Noveske if I could find one.
You are going to find some people who due to failings in the management of the company in the past, do not like LWRC. It is important to note that the company is under new ownership and by all accounts, things have changed dramatically. If you do a search (assuming it works for you) you will find some examples of what I am talking about. Your first responder on this thread has been called out by people in the past for making similar statements.
As for the question at hand, I have heard very good things about the M6A2 and it is one of the weapons I considered when I was in the market for a piston AR myself. I ended up going a different route largely due to price in comparison with top tier platforms, and the fact that I did not think it is a good idea to have to remove the top rail every time I want to break down the gun. Because of those reasons and a couple of others, I went with LMT instead. However, I don’t think you would be making a poor choice with the LWRC.
Those are just my thoughts, others may have different perspectives on the situation. I would strongly encourage you to try that search as there was someone on here just a few days ago asking a similar question which drew some responses. Here is one such link: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=31366&highlight=LWRC
Good luck.
Could you explain why? You posted something similar on another thread. Im neutral on the topic. Im just curious.
I love my M6A2 so far. I don’t have a lot of rounds through it, but I would buy it again if given the choice.
If I were going to buy a LWRC rifle that was in stock with vendors today it would be the M6A3 that www.SGCUSA.com has in stock ready to ship. This is the first release of these rifles that have a lot of upgraded features compared to my year old M6A2, not to mention a smoother recoiling mid length gas system. Im trying to get a M6A3 upper now while avoiding the 10 month wait I had by buying from LWRC direct the last time, Im a very satisfied, soon to be repeat customer.
Another cool option is the CSAT package or M6A1-S. This is a M6A1 with the fixed sight block, but has the mid-length gas system. Very nice.
In general LWRCi products are about the best gas-piston AR you can reasonably afford. The H&K 416 might arguably be “better” but the cost-benefit is stacked against it for most people. Those who judge LWRCi by the actions of the erstwhile PLW are akin to those who forswore S&W…and now own M&P’s.
where you from brah? you a permanent resident?
begin plug
I will go ahead and throw in an unabashed plug for LMT piston carbines as well. 
Cheaper than LWRC (at least when I got mine) and you get a known quantity in quality from Lewis Machine and Tool.
end of plug
Leitner…
I own an M6A2 and love it. Only about 750 rounds through it so far, but zero problems.
I wouldn’t hesitate it buying one.
I also own a Colt 6920 and BCM middie upper on a Bushie lower. Both of those have been flawless as well. I have about 1500 rounds on the Colt.
FWIW, if it was my FIRST AR, I’d get a quality DI gun like the Colt or BCM.
But the LWRCi rifle has been fantastic… and very easy to clean. 
I have been sold on the LWRC system for the last few years, and own about 10 of their uppers in various lengths and configurations. My 2 hard-use guns have over 10000 rds ea on them with only quick wipe downs every few thousand rounds. Mine have been 100% reliable! We did some serious testing of them at my workplace as well and they were found to be a great improvement over the standard DI M4’s
I love the LWRC guns for the same reason that I love my glocks…you can treat them like a lawnmower and they will continue to run without fail.
I see no need to own a standard DI AR platform rifle with the availability of these guns. They are a definite improvement on an already awesome system.
Observations from the gentleman that actually ran the test, Pat Rogers, that above is a outline of created by Mr. Greg Bell, which seems to be posted often. This is what was posted an another forum. This was not a direct response as it came out before the outline, but I thought added some color to the article.
[i]"Guys- i apoloize for not seeing this sooner- no excuses.
When i wrote that article, i tried my very best to be- above all- factual as to what i wrote. Personal bias is a constant 800 lb gorilla, and if left to wander, can influence the outcome.
When Shrek, Jesse and I got together at Modern Day Marine in 2007 we started talking about an eval. As time progressed, i told them what i had in mind, which was similar to, but exceeded the round count, of a similar eval conducted on three S&W M&P 15’s .
They agreed to everything i asked. That is, everything. They placed no restrictions on what i was doing. They asked only that i notify them of any issues, and bring the guns in so that they might be able to diagnose any problems we had.
I stated i would run the guns hard, with minimum maintenance- but proper lube- and i did. I told them i would write factually about my experiences with the guns.
They not only agreed, but welcomed that. They wanted to be up front with not only the readers, but themselves. They felt that issues addressed would soon be non issues and that potential customers needed to see facts, and not hype or rumor.
This is exactly the same attitude i received from S&W.
We beat the snot out of these guns. We ran them hard (look at the pics in the article) and continued to run them hard throughout the eval period.
In the end, i was satisfied, not only with the guns- but with LWRCI as well.
If anyone feels that this article is brutal, then perhaps it is because they have been desensitized by the years of fluff from writers who have been paid to scribble out a story that is glowing, short, concise, and enhances advertising revunue.
SWAT does not assign me a story. They are self generated. Both the publisher- Rich Lucibella- and the editor- Denny Hansen- are strongly supportive and encourage me to write this type of article.
What you read was- in a condensed format- what we experienced.
I was in direct contact not only w/ LWRCI on a regular basis, but also with Borebrush and Stephan PSD. They were all aware of everything that transpired.
Some consumeables were consumed. Some parts broke. Some guns didn’t like some ammo, or apparently people as well (yeah Buck, talkin’ about YOU Very Happy )
When you look at the totality of this, we ran the guns from one era through another. From a small operation in Springfield to a large operation in Cambridge. From parts that may not have been to spec (due to suppler issues) to parts made in house.
At the end of the day, i have not only complete confidence in LWRCI, but strongly recommend their guns.
In my armory i have LWRCI, 416’s, PWS, Colt, LMT, Larue, Noveske, Defensive Edge (Sully), Stag, S&W, BCM, MagPul.
Some of these i bought (many a loooong time ago) and some are eval.
Not all evals will get a story in SWAT- we have limited time and resources.
That companies come to me for evals is flattering. Hey- how many civilians have received a 416 (upper) from HK? I have a good relationship with them as well.
In 09 we will be running Bravo Company Mid Length and DI, Defensive Edge, a Colt 6940 and PWS from MSTN ."[/i]
"For those who don’t believe gun writers/ gun rags. may i suggest this. I am not a gun writer. I am a Former Action Guy who still shoots for a living, and as part of my training business i write.
The purpose of that writing is to pass on information. A different format than EAG passes on in class to be sure, but to a wider audience.
If you haven’t read the article, maybe read it first before you comments on it. Give LWRCI- and me- that courtesy.
[i]Bottom line here is this.
What i wrote was factual. Any errors are mine alone.
I truly enjoyed this eval for a number of reasons. I like the LWRCI crew. They are really good guys, and with a vision.
I like where the company is going. Dick Bernstein knew what he was doing when he entered this.
I like the guns.
Perfect?
Nope. Neither is anything- or anyone- else.
Hope this helps. to clarify things."[/i]
What i really struggle with is how is a piston better than a DI gun as so many of you piston users love to say?
Ive fired a few pistons in my day and while i do think they’re cool i dont necessarily think either system is particularly better than the other unless you’re doing certain things with your rifle.
For me a piston doesnt do anything as i do not shoot suppressed nor do i fire full auto. Heck, i dont even run SBR’s so again, increased fouling is not an issue to me. For ME a DI gun is BETTER than a piston gun. 
What i would really love to see are reasons WHY piston guns are better for certain people when they make concrete absolute statements like that.
I can’t and won’t say a piston is better than a DI gun. I own and like both. There are certain cases where the piston guns are better like suppressed or full auto fire, or SBR’s. They have downsides too: more weight and parts complexity, some have issues with carrier tilt. They do run cleaner for the most part, but the value of that is an individual metric.
So far I’ve been impressed with my LWRCi rifle, and would happily buy another. I am also impressed by the DD M4 I recently bought. My 6920 and 6520 are also strong performers. If I had purchased a Noveske or KAC, I would probably be just as happy.
Are the LWRCis nice rifles? Absolutely. I think they are fully the equal of other rifles in their price range, and if you are cross shopping high end AR’s they deserve to be on the list. Not necessarily because they are pistons, but because they are good rifles. Let me put it this way: if LWRCi made rifles with DI systems instead of pistons, I would still like them. ‘Best’ is such a subjective and amorphous term that using it is inappropriate. They are ‘good’ rifles worthy of consideration. Also, if you are into the 6.8mm, LWRCi has the broadest range of piston driven AR types I know of. Just about every model is available in both 5.56 and 6.8.
Instead of hijacking the other thread any further, I’d like to continue the discussion with markm here.
[quote]
Originally Posted by Stephen_H
…are you serious? I hate to hijack a thread for your inane drivel (again), but what have the folks at LWRCi done to you so that you feel the need to say something bad about their company at every opportunity? What did Paul Leitner-Wise (who is no longer even with the company) do to you so that you feel the need to say something bad about their company at every opportunity?
Although leitner is no longer with the company, they’re slimey tactics carry on. Leitner himself wasn’t even the original offender in the Shilling department.
Why do you defend such a bottom feeder company so aggressively? Have you received free product from them or something?[/quote]
Where are they conducting these “slimey(sic) tactics”? Because their guns got chosen by the producers of Future Weapons to be on TV? Because the USMC looked at their guns for the IAR program, but down selected them from the program? Because the DEA just approved their guns for duty use? Please point me to their “slimey(sic) tactics” and I will make sure that the management and owners of the company are aware of it and the offenders punished. They have zero tolerance for that kind of behavior. Since the PLW fiasco, you’ll notice that the employees of the company have largely kept to their own forum. This is not a coincidence. The only time I have seen them post on other forums (for the most part) is to defend their products against people like you who throw around baseless accusations and veiled innuendos of impropriety. It’s a load of bollocks and you know it. The employees at LWRCi want to make the best weapon possible. I don’t know whether it was Darren or Jesse that pissed in your Wheaties (they are the ONLY two employees left that were around when Mr. Leitner-Wise was there), but give it a break. You can carry this grudge till it breaks your back, but it doesn’t change the fact that they are making a good product that is selling so well they can’t keep any in stock.
Did you know that they are AS9100 and ISO9001 certified? Can you name any other AR manufacturers besides Colt and FN that are?
I defend them because I believe in their products and several of their employees are my friends. Yes I have received free products from them. I also bought another rifle from them last week out of my own pocket (a new 5.56mm M6A3).
Stephen
Also, below is an unedited quote from Pat Rogers concerning the oft quoted SWAT magazine article on his LWRCi T&E. Note the last sentence.
"Guys- i apoloize for not seeing this sooner- no excuses.
When i wrote that article, i tried my very best to be- above all- factual as to what i wrote. Personal bias is a constant 800 lb gorilla, and if left to wander, can influence the outcome.
When Darren, Jesse and I got together at Modern Day Marine in 2007 we started talking about an eval. As time progressed, i told them what i had in mind, which was similar to, but exceeded the round count, of a similar eval conducted on three S&W M&P 15’s .
They agreed to everything i asked. That is, everything. They placed no restrictions on what i was doing. They asked only that i notify them of any issues, and bring the guns in so that they might be able to diagnose any problems we had.
I stated i would run the guns hard, with minimum maintenance- but proper lube- and i did. I told them i would write factually about my experiences with the guns.
They not only agreed, but welcomed that. They wanted to be up front with not only the readers, but themselves. They felt that issues addressed would soon be non issues and that potential customers needed to see facts, and not hype or rumor.
This is exactly the same attitude i received from S&W.
We beat the snot out of these guns. We ran them hard (look at the pics in the article) and continued to run them hard throughout the eval period.
In the end, i was satisfied, not only with the guns- but with LWRCI as well.
If anyone feels that this article is brutal, then perhaps it is because they have been desensitized by the years of fluff from writers who have been paid to scribble out a story that is glowing, short, concise, and enhances advertising revunue.
SWAT does not assign me a story. They are self generated. Both the publisher- Rich Lucibella- and the editor- Denny Hansen- are strongly supportive and encourage me to write this type of article.
What you read was- in a condensed format- what we experienced.
I was in direct contact not only w/ LWRCI on a regular basis, but also with Borebrush and Stephan PSD. They were all aware of everything that transpired.
Some consumeables were consumed. Some parts broke. Some guns didn’t like some ammo, or apparently people as well (yeah Buck, talkin’ about YOU )
When you look at the totality of this, we ran the guns from one era through another. From a small operation in Springfield to a large operation in Cambridge. From parts that may not have been to spec (due to suppler issues) to parts made in house.
At the end of the day, i have not only complete confidence in LWRCI, but strongly recommend their guns."
I never said they were. After 20 years of owning DI rifles, I wanted to try the piston AR as ‘something different.’ In that the internals in mine (POF-415) are as good or better than the internals in many DI guns, it’s “better” in that respect. In that it’s more accurate than the owner (an urban dweller now for the past 7 years, who doesn’t get to shoot NEARLY as often as he did in KY & NC before that), it’s “better (but then, so are all the OTHER high-end DI rifles, too!),” and in that it’s “better” than some DI rifles I’ve owned (pre-ban PWA and Olympic; post-ban Doublestar), based on the quality of its construction, than on that basis, you could call it a ‘better’ rifle.
I don’t DOUBT there are AR’s out there more accurate & reliable from the factory in DI configuration, but, I didn’t buy mine assuming it was the Star Trek phaser on setting 16. :rolleyes: It is indeed ‘DIFFERENT’ from anything I’ve owned before in an AR configuration. Enjoyable, manageable, accurate, fun - all the things you enjoy in a rifle when shooting it (as opposed to ‘jamming, breaking, & inaccurate’). And if you buy a piston rifle for any OTHER reason (OK… the cleaner chamber is nice too, but it STILL gets plenty o’ crud under the handguards around the front sight), you’ll probably be disappointed.
In the meantime, Vive la difference!
MarkM i’m just curious as to whether you actually have any experience with an LWRCi rifle? I’m going to guess its little to none.