I believe the DEA has a contract with Rock River. Texas DPS, and El Paso city police, have contracts with Bushmaster. I don’t know about other departments across the U.S…
My question is, do these manufacturers produce higher end rifles for their LEO contracts? Do LEOs feel comfortable carrying these rifles “as is” or do most upgrade their BCGs, etc…
I’m curious what different departments issue and what upgrades are made by individuals that carry them.
My dept just issued M16’s that they got from mil surplus, Colts, pre 1967, no forward assists. Exactly!!!
They did got new bcg’s DPMS, EXACTLY.
I carry my own 16 inch Noveske/DD and a 10.5 inch Noveske/DD.
this whole site eems to be stuck on bcg,s I have a friend on swat tasc he has a BM he loves it ,his life depends on it and others do to. I dont care what kind of BCG you have and mpi doesnt guarantee you cant have a problem with it you will never have a home scenerio where you will shoot enough rounds to worry about it before swat arives if you want a dependable homedefence gun it seems to me you would test several mags for reliability.funtion test the gun run several clips thru it clean it and keep it reay .If you play RAMBO every weekend just to say its a fighting gun. chances are you may have a problem with it when you need it
you’re such a troll. there very fact that you’re still here proves this site isn’t nearly as elitist as you think.
So if I understand your almost unreadable rant, as long as the gun works for a few “clips” it is GTG as long as you don’t ever actually train with it because then you might have a problem when you need it.
OK…go away troll.
you mean the cripple side
Dear Newguy,
This is literally the second thread I have attempted to read tonight and what do you know. You have some how managed to stir the pot with several of the other members… AGAIN. Come on man, relax and participate positively.
Thanks.
Do you know what SWAT stands for?
Sit
Wait
And
Talk
Teams don’t just go running into things blindly, and they sure as hell aren’t going to be there if you are in a gunfight. Your ass is on your own, and I’m not saying that because I have a friend who is a cop. I’m saying it because I am a cop, who happens to work in a rathole. If you are stuck in your house with a gun to your head, you’re going to hear a negotiator calling long before anyone thinks of making entry.
Buying a good weapon isn’t about getting into a shootout. Its about overall quality and reliability.
Im just saying that people can create problems for there selves and 90% of all people training except for law enforcement and mill are only training for the next range session. I have a bcg with a few hundred rds thru it that I keep in the gun while its at home for home defence and another i use for practice training etc. less chance of breaking something with minamal wear on it than somthing with 10,000.rnds on it just the law of averages
Please stop. You shouldn’t be swapping out your good and crappy BCG back and forth. The bolt wears to the barrel extension, and is designed to do that.
You evidently weren’t in the military as you would remember hearing about DEATH or missing body parts for swapping your buddies BCG into your weapon.
You are posting as if you are talking with first hand factual knowledge, but you are not credible. This is the wrong board to be doing that, and the design of this board was to get rid of fluff and bs posting so that people could get solid, legit info. I’m not a mod, nor do I have any control over the board, but I would guess you won’t be here long if you keep posting the way you are.
Kick back and read more, there is good info here, and the BS factor is much lower than other places. If you are looking to post and not get called out on things, there are some very large AR15 boards that are great for that.
Good luck.
You bring up a valid point, however my post was intended to address individuals that rely on firearms for their lives, not weekend warriors! I wanted feedback from operators, but you’ve so thoroughly highjacked my thread, it may never get back on topic. Please keep your comments on topic.
I work for the Department of Interior. We used to only use Colts and FN M16 variants, however we are now allowed to use any military spec US manufacturer. Of course that is a pretty loose requirement as they don’t define exactly how mil spec they want it. I now see a variety of rifles from FNs, Colts, Bushmasters, Armalites, and Stags(I’m sure there are more). Personally, I like the old standard better as it at least stuck with top tier rifles. Now days, you could end up with something of cheap quality and if your supervisor is a dick they may not allow you to carry your personal Colt. Fortunately, I was issued a Colt M4(converted to semiauto).
Manufacturers will meet the specifications imposed by the buyer. Few LE customers provide anything but very basic specifications. More often than not, it’s limited to combinations of a p/n, price range, or ship date.
How willingly, and at what cost the manufacturer will meet those specs depends on how significant the buyer’s purchase is. If it’s a lot of guns, or the buyer is iconic and useful in advertising, they are more receptive. If Anytown PD is buying one or two dozen, you’ll get a hefty quote or runaround.
The good-as manufacturers routinely and intentionally ship guns to LE agencies and officers that bear manufacturing and assembly traits likely to present problems. The same guns they ship to Joe Public.
Read more. Post less.
You would think range masters/armorers for agencies would use the chart to persuade the upper echelon boss’s when making purchases. Most everyone at my agency has never heard of BCM or even Daniel Defense.
Ky Cop
Sorry for the off topic remarks. Most departments are concerned with the cheapest item they can get which will pass some form of testing. If you are issued a weapon, the odds are that you are NOT allowed to swap out something intrinsic to the weapon like a BCG.
I am issued a Rock River, but I carry my personal LMT and BCM. Hope that answers your question.
My agency expressly forbids any alterations to the AR15’s. Only a tactical light and/or vertical foregrip maybe added by the individual officer. They are S&W MP15’s with Aimpoint Comp4 optics. The BUIS is a Troy folding battle sight.
I’m sure there are agencys that allow varying levels of customizing but that just depends on the department policy. But in my experience the vast majority of officers would not get into swapping BCG’s, etc. They just don’t have that level of knowledge ref the weapons to even know to do this. They’re trained to use, operate and maintain them and for the most part that’s the extent of their knowledge of the weapon. Maintenance beyond basic cleaning/field stripping is left to the armorers to do.
A good friend of mine is an officer on a local SORT(SWAT or whatever) team. He also works at a Gunshop. His team issues DPMS rifles and he loves his. I have tried to convince him otherwise but in the end it is his ass on the line not mine. It has served him well and he feels it will continue to.
I just hope I am never proven right in this case.
One of the problems is obtaining real data regarding parts failure. There is a lot of it with in regards to Colt M4s, but we have nothing to compare it to. There just isn’t a reliable compilation of data regarding things like non MPI/HP bolts or non MPI/HP 4140 barrels. I still believe that the failure rate of these parts would be much higher than MILSPEC, but departments and agencies can’t make purchases based upon what most people think just like the MIL can’t. The Problem is that an agency doesn’t do that extensive of testing.
I have always read about Pat Roger’s “book of shame” but have never seen a page from it. I think that he and other firearms instructors would be doing everyone (except for shitty companies) a great service by offering this data to someone to compile and metrix.
Another issue is that Federal agencies can operate within a bubble. The average agent might be much more concerned with accuracy over durability until their weapon is taken to task. I have read several articles about how impressed the FBI was with their 1911 contract, until some of them had to start training in the ME. After that those 1"match grade pistols didn’t seem so attractice in the field.
I work for a 29 officer Sheriff’s Dept in Indiana. We are issue DPMS rifles that were order by a Sheriff that has no firearm knowledge. The bottom line with the order was price!
The swat team is issue Colt SMG’s, but very few of use carry them.
I carry my SBR built with a Novekse 10.5 upper.