This is meant more for LEO’s. Who uses anything else other than .223 AR’s for their active shooter situations (for Patrol Officers). This is not really meant towards full time SWAT guys but for regular patrol officers. We have the M16A1’s (no full auto) which are old as hell. I was talking to someone else about this a couple weeks ago and then I read an artcile in a magazine, “Police-The Law Enforcement Magazine” and I thought I would put it out there.
The article had a lot of good points. Most of these battles are fairly close so you really dont need something that can reach out a touch ya at 700 yards away. The needs for different departments are always going to be different (city/country enviorment). The article made mention of using a 6.8 spc round. So, what do you have and why? Do you like it or not?
is the department supplying the ammo? if so, will they supply enough of the more expensive ammo to adequately train? if it’s on the officer- same question.
also think of replacement part and magazine availability.
Yeah - they would supply the ammo - as the more expensive ammo? Depends on how expensive. My Dept recently has become more open to what is being offered, especially after recent events. About the officer - usually the guys who want the better weapons are willing to pay the extra buck…
Im not talking like a .50 cal or a real limited caliber. Weapons discussions are arising in our Dept and I thought I would throw the question out there…
I use a Stag 6.8SPC for my patrol carbine. We use personally owned carbines, set up within Department guidlines. We buy our own ammunition. I have an identical 5.56 Stag I use as a training gun, with an additional .22LR conversion kit. I shoot 800-1000 6.8, 2,000 - 4,000 5.56, and an additional 3,000 - 4,000 22LR. per year. I also try to attend 2 outside training classes per year.
I have an additional 5.56 set up the same way, so that if off duty I can save time by responding directly to the incident from home with a PC, etc. Perhaps not as much training as some, but it’s the most I can squeek out of the budget at this time.
Well we have a couple of deputies here that decided 5.56 isn’t their cup of tea and decided to buy kel-tec carbines in .40 S&W. They even had it approved from the Sheriff. They are sworn officers, but they are the last one’s anyone would want to respond to active shooter situation. They typically are assigned to the court for paper service and court services. Personally if that is what they want to use great, it just isn’t optimal.
I use a 10.5" LWRC M6A1 6.8mm for all my LE functions to include swat. My main duty round is the SSA 85 grain TSX and swat round is the SSA 115 grain OTM. Active shooter is something I constantly think about and war game and my equipment is set up with that and swat in mind.
You guys make me jelous, My dept policy is stricktly 5.56 only!, and nothing but Colt and RRA’s, I chose Colt for obvious reasons. Heck my dept wont even let me SBR my Colt.
As of now we are only using 5.56 for all patrol rifles, dept issues M&P15 but allows personal rifles (a mix of colt, BCM, one RRA and a couple KAC). We are looking into allowing the 6.8 but so far it’s not getting much acceptance from the brass. We may have to go to a purchase your own ammo if we are able to get the 6.8 approved.
I really want to get one of the new LMS 308 for myself but for duty inside a city, I thought that round was for distance.
With all the budget constraints, I wonder if more agencies will loosen up their policies about officers buying their own weapons. Ours is locked down -you use only what we give you - and its never well thought out. Its usually some high ranking official who basically ignores our swat guys or anyone with real hands on knowledge. Then they rush it out and screw it all up
A 16" .308 would be a great active shooter rifle if the shooter was capable. Load it with Hornady 155 grain TAP and many of the overpenetration issues go away. Now getting an Administration to buy off on it is another issue.
I use a Colt M4 for patrol rifle, mine was my old SWAT rifle now modified to semi-auto. Most of our patrol rifles are Colt 6920-16" bbl. Our management will not consider the personally owned AR, to them too much liabilites.
As for other calibers like 6.8mm, no, but at one time our old, old chief deployed the Remington 7600 with “Monte Carlo” stock in a 308. Our firearm guys whispered in his ear about over penetration with the 308 rd and then he reverse his decision by allowing the SWAT guys to deploy our then HK rifles.
Remember, it’s the chief, command staff, city manager, and city council who will decide your fate because they know more then you.
Be safe all. This LEO job is dangerous.
You hit it dead center. The hierarchy is now getting a boatload of shit because they are finally realizing that the so called active shooter program and support is a joke. They just wanted a quick fix so they can say that they did something (another liability issue). SO, now they are considering different options.
At my previous Dept. there were only 12 rifles and the rest of the patrol officers had the issued shotguns. Our rifles were .223 Colts. Our shotguns were Remington 1187’s with a 14 inch barrel and the ammo was 1 oz. slugs. The over penetration was brought up numerous times by those of us who hunt and know what a 1 oz slug does. Our concerns were pushed aside.
One of the smaller departments in Utah offers M1 carbines for the female officers. They used to have M14s in the trunk of every patrol car, but the feds asked for them back so now most of the officers are issued AR15s. They also have a Rem 870 option.