This is my first Aimpoint. It is a Comp M3 with a 2moa dot. It was shot from the bench with XM833 using a 14.5" BCM middy. The groups pictured are average of the groups I shot today. I shoot much better with irons. I guess I need to get used to the red dot.
I can easily keep 2" groups from the bench at 100 yards using my T1’s, which have a 4 MOA dot. You’ll get used to it. I’d be happy with those, but I hardly ever shoot for accuracy or from the bench.
ETA - Don’t let the MOA of the dot fool you into thinking you can’t get groups smaller than it’s size. I shoot more accurate with my T1 out to 50 than I do with using the tip of the chevron reticle in my ACOG, for whatever reason.
Anyone who knows how to use them and has reasonable vision should shoot better with irons.
That group is fine for an RDS. They’re not meant for shooting groups. Discount that flyer to the left and you’re doing pretty good.
Remember if you are shooting for small groups or zeroing a RDS, turn the dot down to the lowest visible brightness level. This will help tighten the shots up if you are concerned with group size.
Looks good to me.
Agreed! Zero on a very low light setting. I run mine on the lowest setting that I can still see in the given conditions. However, whether im in low for full bloom, I still seem to shoot the same groups. I prefer to run a low setting because its easier for me to see the target.
Doesn’t look like he has much of a problem seeing the target to me.
That’s pretty much my point as well. I can shoot 2" groups with relative ease with the 4 MOA T1, actually more accurately than with the ACOG, given the right conditions. I’m sure part of that is I only do about 10% of my shooting with magnified optics.
Don’t let the dot size fool you, though it may not be the mos precise, putting the dot in the same spot will give you tighter groups.
Dude, are you joking? You just lookin for a cookie, or a pat on the back? Thats some good shooting.
As always…these discussions always tend toward the ridiculous.
Neither the Aimpoint nor the ACOG are meant to be precision optics. If you want that, mount a scope.
They are intended to facilitate rapid target acquisition in a combat environment and to put rounds into center mass of human targets.
Your shooting was/is just fine. You done good!
That’s pretty good shooting if you ask me. I just qualified on the M4 with the new Aimpoint M4S 2 MOA sight and I was surprised I shot better groups during the iron sight portion of the course than I did with the red dot. Just need to practice I guess. As was said already, RDS are not for shooting groups but for faster shooting with both eyes open.
Its only 50 yards.
I know, but still, thats not bad. I have no ideal what kind of groups either of my rifles will shoot, lol, I never try.
I don’t think there’s anything ridiculous about firing a few rounds from the bench to zero your optic, whether I do it with my T1’s, ACOG or S&B’s… then check your MOA.
Also, at pretty much every carbine class I’ve attended, they’ve focused on getting precision hits at 100 with our Aimpoints/EoTechs, and theses were not in any way a precision class, but they did want to see some accuracy from some sort of supported position for at least a handful of rounds.
Believe me, of the 500 + or - rounds I fire a week, maybe only a couple have an intention of hitting something smaller than an 8 MOA, but it’s still an important skill to work on, and I will whether it’s my T1 or S&B 5-25.
Ridiculous would be more like saying you bought a 700 and plan to shoot long range precision and you want to kow which Aimpoint is best.
You can experiment a bit by trying to hold the 12 o’clock (set to an intensity that makes it as defined as you can make it) of the dot to your desired strike zone, and zero to that. Simply floating the dot at that distance, you’re covering a 1" area. Shooting to a defined point ON the dot, you’re meeting an area with a point or border.
OR, simply hold a specific spot on the outline of the dot to a specific point on the target, instead of concentrating on floating the dot over your desired strike zone. That way, if your desire is to zero to the center of the dot and not an edge, you can do that by fire/adjust until the center of the group is .5" away from X aimpoint, regardless of direction (just pick one cardinal compass point and stick to it). An edge of a blob of light is easier to hold to a specific spot than a whole blob of light.
Molon did this with a 4MOA dot @ML2 100yds, and it worked to quell a lot of the noodniks that kept insisting that one couldn’t expect better than 4MOA accuracy from that kind of dot.
That’s a good idea. One of the things that drives me nuts when trying to make a precision shot with a Dot sight is that you’re indeed covering your desired POI.
I find myself floating the fuckin dot off target and then back on to make sure I’m where I want to be. I hate red dots. 
I think this is exactly what I’m doing wrong. Would explain why my scores are much higher with irons than with a red dot.
I find setting the brightness to it’s lowest setting help. But choice of target also helps a lot.
Years ago I bought some targets that were 1" squares. Superimposed on top was a fat black “X” for lack of a better term. The ends of the “X” are 3". It narrows down to a point in the center.
I, being a cheap a** ,have a couple left that I make copies at work on a copier.
These work great for my 4 MOA T-1. The dot goes right in the center at 50yds, and I don’t have to float at all to see where I’m at from shot to shot.
I was able to shoot 3.5-4" groups at 200 yds from a bench with my T-1. For what I use this carbine for, this is more than sufficient.
What is “Acceptable 50yd accuracy”? Depends on what you’re trying to accomplish.
It’s procedural with us and the SDO (TA11 w/9MOA RMR), for example.
The dot in the horseshoe reticle is 1.7MOA. Zero 12 o’clock of the dot @ 100m, and bearing in mind that M855 drops somewhere around 4" @ 200m with that zero, 6 o’clock of that same dot IS the 200m aimpoint. Next, co-align 12 o’clock of the RMR dot to the same point on the horseshoe dot (followed by a shooting confirmation and refinement), your Oh Shit! sight is set.
Shooting to the center of the dot is simply a matter of knowing how to use a ruler.
Now, SDO is an etched reticle with light being fed to it via fiber optic, so while it can (and does) bloom, I find them to be more distinct than projected RDSs and consequently easier to ID edges as a result, but the principle holds.
thats a good grouping for a red dot
What is considered “combat accurate” for the military?