Is the rift between right and left too far gone?

General General Discussion
1

Just a simple question but it seems American politics have gotten to the point where the differences are insurmountable. The difference between republicans and democrats 30+ years ago wasn’t all that huge. I mean Kennedy did the Cuban blockade, and he was in office during our first forays into Vietnam. The SF building is named after him. I could never imagine the Obama Special Forces center. And this is not about Obama but just American people in general.

So if you’ve interacted with die hard lefties, as I have, have you found any common ground? I have, numerous times, and its almost as if these people are like aliens. Yes they are still Americans but the rift between what was a righty and a lefty is much wider than its ever been. I dont think either side can every reconcile or put politics aside to do what most Americans want or what is best for us. Now the political stage is either based on D or R behind your name not the substance of your argument or point. Just like Juan Williams got tricked on Hannity last night into talking complete shit about a statement he was told Eric Cantor said when it was really Obama who said it in 2006 about the debt limit. I don’t even really think its about the substance anymore just gaining power in either the Congress or Executive. I dont think people on the news care anymore about what whatever party they are beholden to but are just out there to attack whatever the other party does. I mean if you watch MSNBC from about 5-9 the entire 4 hour periods is blaming republicans for this and that with some leftist host. They go as far as to say they would vote multiple times if they could. Its not even anything close to news anymore. Its just talking points for a political party disguised as news.

And lastly it seems like the fight revolves around the 10-15% of the “undecideds”. Obama only won with 3% of the votes. Not a huge victory yet the losers during that election came out in force like never before in modern politics.

I don’t really think we have a bonded country anymore. I really don’t. Before Americans were able to get behind America, and now it seems like we have a battle between old America and new America with both sides being polar opposites of each other. I mean I would not really feel bad about having someone like JFK in office like I do about either Clinton or Obama. Now each side is as different as can be imagined. One side investigating the ATF on allowing guns into Mexico and the other side using guns in Mexico as evidence we need new laws and reporting to the government on what guns we buy. The response to this quandry is just further evidence of the rift. The left uses ‘guns in Mexico’ as evidence of the need for new laws while those on the right use the ATF running guns into Mexico as proof of a civil rights violation conspiracy. Is there anything Im missing here?

I guess what Im asking is…how to people who have either seemingly flocked to either the far right or far left able to come together and run a country? I don’t really see things ending until one side or another wins, and I dont think there can be any winners here.

As evidence of this change just look at the makeup of Congress in the last 100 years. When Newt tookover in 1994 it has been decades since we had a republican controlled Congress. A lot of righties view the Reagan era as the holy grail when it comes to government yet Democrats were in charge during the 80’s in Congress.

I just think something has happened to where politics are at a point where neither side is ever going to be able to peacefully work with the other. Not that either side is right or wrong just that working together now is much bigger than sides working together. I mean look at the 80’s. republican president, and we had the SR47 running, star wars program, it was perhaps one of the best decades of NASA, and lots of major legislation we are dealing with today was passed. Now we have not even had a budget in TWO years. Not just a couple month fight over something we have not had a budget go through the house to the senate to the president in 2 years.

In the end I don’t see how this can ever be worked out. The differences today are much greater than they have been in 100 years. Im not a history expert but have done my fair share and more of digging, and I don’t really see anything in our history more different than the differences in the north vs. the south in the lead up to the Civil War.

2

It’s the highly populated urban areas with lots of votes versus the rest of America.

3

Frankly, I do not think the electoral college and the senatorial system goes far enough.

Those that choose to live on top of each other in huge f’ing cities need to be disenfranchised, by and large and let sane people make their political decisions for them.

History is not kind to urbanized populations and their political viewpoints/policies/insane world views.

4

I believe I saw a study not that long ago that said we are still a lot better off than in times past like the Civil War when it comes to political strife. On the other hand I have this gut feeling that we are moving towards the Balkanization of this nation. I think its a case of where moderates are left with shrills on either side and have become apathetic. I can blame them we there are other alternatives out there.

5

I just see it getting worse. We can’t even agree on facts anymore. You can get all your information from online sources or cable channels that feed you what you want to hear or don’t report what you don’t want to hear. Add in representative districts and a primary system that promotes extreme candidates and a unelected judges legislating from the bench because legislatures are full of squabbling politicians.

6

sadly unless things do get turned around somehow ? I dont see it ending
and I do see it as the beginning of the end so far ?

along with the over the top PC that is being put in place things are going to end up with a huger divide and we all know that ends up in a split or the end of what we know

7

I’ve recognized the increasing polarization. Just tonight I was out with one of my good friends and the debt ceiling crap came up and then we started talking about other things. He then told me that he would vote for Obama again. First of all I didn’t even know he voted for him the first time but I asked him why he would vote for him again. He said to give democracy a chance. I said WTF are you talking about. He said in order for something to work, you have to give it time to take hold and all republicans want to do is run the government like a business and you can’t do that when you are dealing with human lives (people on welfare, Medicare yada yada). I told him we have a spending problem not a revenue problem and asked him if he knew that nearly half our budget goes to entitlement programs. Didn’t have a clue and didn’t seem to care since they are “humans”.

I don’t remember exactly what was said but he was muttering crap about how the rich should be paying more taxes. I asked why and he said why the f**k not? They can afford it. I then asked if he thought a rich person should pay more for a loaf of bread than a lower income person in line behind him and he said they should.

I couldn’t believe what I was was hearing. What the hell do you say to that? Fundamentals can’t even be agreed upon. It’s only a matter of time.

8

Did we get here by accident?

I say no.

Divide and conquer is an ago old tactic. When looking at both ends of the spectrum I see no difference in Right or Left, Democrat or Republican, Conservative or Liberal. Those in power merely play to the whims of the masses all the while fanning the flames.

“A house divided against itself cannot stand . . .” - Abraham Lincoln

9

I agree with Moose Knuckle. I am thoroughly disgusted with big govt Republicans. We need a third party.

10

This.

11

Contained in these two comments are the central elements creating the massive divisions in this nation. The divisions are real. The first is a division in perception and the second is a division in wealth.

I’ve been beating this drum for a long time now. This nation has become a corporatist plutocracy which has manipulated the majority of the population, who are slowly sinking into an economic abyss, to turn on each other so as to be distracted from the folks at the top stealing out the back door with the wealth of this nation.

It’s not about the red state/blue state divide. It’s all about the green. Follow the money. It’s not flowing right or flowing left-- it’s flowing up.

12

Whenever I hear terms like “most polarized it’s ever been”, “worst time our country has ever had” etc I can’t help but think about how poor our history education is in this country. Im thinking that we were far more polarized (and close to dissolution/collapse) back in the 1860’s. Heck my grandparents thought that the END was arriving during the depression/WWII. I think that we are far less different from our ancestors than we imagine.

13

I have a Democrat that I work with that actually said to me the other night that the best thing for The Democratic Party is to have the Republicans split. It looks like the Tea Party is actually accomplishing this.

I actually think the Party system is the problem. Having an official platform to conform to is an issue. A candidate needs to just layout what ‘they’ believe in, not what others tell them what they should believe in.

14

It is people like you that will cause the democraps to rule forever.

The only time a third party can be succesful is if it draws from both parties not only from one. If you split the Republican party the democraps will rule forever.:rolleyes:

15

So what is what you are saying? Who do you want to control the wealth of America? the government or the people that create the businesses in this country?
I do not get it you have a problem with people or businesses that make money and provide jobs for the people?

16

Sadly, pretty much the case with a few exceptions out west…

17

Nope. Fuck 'em. I ditched my last lefty friends after the election. Now I have some who think they’re my friends, but in reality I keep them around to keep an eye on them.

18

Bingo.

19

The funny thing is, if people objectively looked at their positions on many issues, instead of merely identifying with a party/ideology, I bet there would be a LOT more libertarians out there.

I know SOOOO many people who identify themselves with a party when their beliefs are much more libertarian than they think…“democrats” who don’t want a ton of gov’t spending, or “republicans” who don’t have a problem with gay marriage, or abortion (PLEASE DON’T FUCK UP THIS THREAD WHINING ABOUT THESE ISSUES, THIS IS MERELY AN EXAMPLE!!!)

20

Oh, fucking bullshit. There’s plenty of blue dog dems out there and plenty of deems disgusted with their party and Obama. Take your simplistic “us versus them” shit elsewhere.