Unsurprisingly, I concur. Seems to be happening a lot lately. :eek:
My biggest issue with the guys that go on this dopes show is how they answer “why would someone need an AR 15?”
Not that their responses are bad but no one, even the pro gun guys, seem to realize that the AR platform IS used for hunting and numerous competitive applications.
We have to do a better job showing just how common, normal, and popular this rifle is. Also we must work to debunk the propaganda on the so called immense fire power it supposedly has.
The hunting angle pisses me off. Not that I am against hunters but like you all know the 2nd amendment is not about hunting.
Pat
Frankly, I think this is one concession the NRA should make in this debate. I know there are plenty that vehemently object to such a notion but I think it just makes common sense.
No reason a law-abiding buyer should object to a law-abiding seller confirming that they are both on the up-and-up. It protects both parties and presents no impediment to a legal transaction.
And it would seriously take the wind out of the sails of anti-gunners screaming the NRA and pro-2A groups are incapable of actively supporting measures to keep weapons out of the hands of those who cannot legally possess them.
If there was a voluntary system in place I would use it before selling a gun. But I don’t want to see a mandatory system in place.
If it is mandatory they only way to enforce it would be a paper trail of who currently owns the gun correct? Which in turn is basically gun registration.
But maybe I am over thinking it.
You would not have to have a paper trail. They could enforce it by setting up stings with UC officers attempting to buy guns and waiting to see if the seller gets the check done or not.
Pat
This is exactly what the anti’s are running down, capitulators, folks who have been conditioned by the apparatus, and trappings of the state, into accepting its infringements, as a means of “protection!”
I could flame you, but that would serve no purpose, perhaps it would even set you more solidly on the anti path, then you are, and make no mistake gentleman, you are on that path!
Morgan continually referenced what he termed “NRA members who agree with me” on these common sense restrictions. That would be folks such as yourselves, who have been successfully conditioned by the state, and circumstance into a pre-disposition to sede certain liberties as reasonable.
Just one question, which you can apply to any of the slaughter scenarios of the last decade, how exactly, would shutting down private commerce have affected either Sandy Hook, or Aurora?
Again with the rhetoric. No one said anything about shutting down private commerce. No one is capitulating. Go take your tin foil somewhere else! Before you go tell me how having to go through a background check to make sure your not a felon is infringing on your right to own a weapon.
Pat
There should be a way for citizens to use the NICS system, I think we can all agree on that.
However… “stings” won’t assist enforcing, there are too many sales and too few cops. There is no papertrail that could be relied upon. So the answer is to have the backend keep track.
You have a username and password just as an FFL does, you login, perform a NICS check (just as dealers can do online), it clears and you sell the gun to the other party. If there is ever a question as to where a gun went or how X criminal got it, there would be a log of cleared/denied checks on your account.
THAT SAID… This does open the door to registration and confiscation, but really, we’re there already. If you want the NICS system which most of us do like just fine, this is the compromise. To me, to never have to hear about a “loophole” or how felons are getting their guns “legally” it’s worth it.
I think an account with NICS and no private unchecked sales would go over just fine with the majority of gun owners, that’s a comprise that would be worth making imo. No one seems to be offering that on EITHER side.
I was just thinking of a way to enforce it without registration. Everyone is focusing on the guns and the problem is people getting guns who should not.
Pat
I 100% agree, and have commented in other threads on that and the hunting mantra is a big part of the anti gun propaganda IMO.
The point is that these dopes are pushing this narrative that ARs are some exotic exceedingly high powered rifle with absolutely no purpose but to kill people and very few people are calling them out on it. Morgan calls them machine guns on a nightly basis and constantly references how they are easily modified by many to shoot 30 rounds a second.
I cant believe I have not seen one picture of a CMP, NRA Rifle, or 3 Gun match on TV or even mentioned. Not to mention a hog hunting pic or something.
Damn 30 rounds a second those are some fast split times. Lol
Pat
I hate that Shapiro didn’t contend the use of “assault rifles”, Morgan claims 4 of the last 5 mass shootings were committed with an “assault rifle” and that’s simply not true.
I think Shapiro did a good job, I think he maintained his cool when Morgan was obviously trying to instigate, I absolutely loved it when Shapiro was smirking when he got under Morgan’s skin.
It’s terrifying when your opinion gets it’s ass kicked by logic and facts.
If you’ve been able to find everything you’ve ever needed without filling out a single 4473, more power to you.
Its interesting, how you, or the other folks, can’t offer a single justification as to why stripping another liberty from “We The People” would have prevented a single casualty at Sandy Hook!
Forcing all tranasctions into the federal system, is tantamount to registration, its creepy, its uneccessary, and it serves no purpose other then the states unhealthy desire to know! 
Actually you did. You want background checks for ALL guns sales. Now, why dont you explain to me how the hell im going to call in a background check when selling a firearm?
Fact. If you’re for more legislation regarding guns, you are part of the problem.
You can not legislate morality. You should know that criminals will find a way to aquire the tools they need to carry out their illegal activity. Bottom line.
Some of you people need to realize if you give these criminals (our Politicians) and inch they’ll take a mile.
That’s because there is none. IMO, there has never been ‘justification’ for any ‘gun control’ measures. Every law can be subverted, evaded, bent, or broken. All of the letters and emails I have sent to my Senators and my Rep. in the house have been quite simple, starting plainly with: “I am against any new gun legislation that may be introduced.” The rest (which I’m sure no one really reads) has been about tackling mental health issues and other root causes for violence in this country.
However, you might want to look around, Sandy Hook isn’t the only scenario that has people, non-gun people, saying ‘let’s talk about this.’ If you think that considering an NICS check for private sales makes me some kind of ‘anti-gunner,’ then so be it. So, 4473… Ever fill one out?
I am not vehemently opposed to everyone being given access to the NICS system and have a “confirmation” number assigned to your transaction when doing a FTF transfer so long as it was free aka I’m not going to get a bill in the mail for running a check on Bubba. Unlike you, I don’t, however, see how something like that would stop the wrong people from getting their grubby hands on a gun. The Sandy Hook guy stole his mom’s guns so the NICS check wouldn’t have stopped him. Deuchebag in AZ was legal to buy as were the Aurora, VT guys. Can’t remember how the Columbine kids got their hands on guns, but I seriously doubt they bought them from a law abiding citizen.
Basically, you are suggesting an unenforcible law that will make us feel better about FTF transfers, but in essence do nothing to actually help the situation. It will however set precedent for allowing the government more intrusion into then disposition of private property. Do we really want that, especially when you’re trading nothing for it?? Just don’t see what the positives are.
Filled out the ole 4473 yesterday morning and my feelings about that are the same as the NICS for private sales. Useless BS that doesn’t do shit to keep guns out of the hands of people who shouldn’t have them. That crap came about before my time as a thinking adult so I’m stuck with it and I don’t see much hope in it going away.
The problem isn’t the tool and how it gets into the persons hands. The problem is the person.
However, you might want to look around, Sandy Hook isn’t the only scenario that has people, non-gun people, saying ‘let’s talk about this.’ If you think that considering an NICS check for private sales makes me some kind of ‘anti-gunner,’ then so be it. So, 4473… Ever fill one out?
What exactly is it, that you expect to gain, from losing?
Your reference to myself and form 4473, I interpret as an ad-hominem attack, a not so subtle inference to my “personal legality!” Is that correct?
Finally, and to the point, you(anyone) “are” an anti-gunner when you not only capitulate to their most treasured desire, but also actually embrace it…
Private party commerce had, and has, no relationship to the slaughters that have taken place these last decades, they are not even on topic! You are invited to ponder that…