The way I understand it, if a firearm is being shipped out for repair or customization (engraving), and no transfer of ownership is taking place, you do not need to go through an FFL as long as the firearm is being returned to the owner.
I am doing a SBR now and have found out two important things in talking with ATF. Read…the resident “expert” in Martinsburg who now supervises all the examiners.
He says that the receiver or the barrel must be engraved. I know there are some people that have gotten away without having it done at all. It will not happen on this “experts” watch.
He also stated that names may not be abbreviated even though it states in the NFA Title 26, Chapter 53, Section 479.102,a,(2),(iii) that a “recognized abbreviation” would be acceptable. It is not acceptable to him.
My bud just got his form 1 returned to him for this very reason. And, IMO, and in the opinion of this “expert”, is the reason you should wait until you have a approved form 1 prior to engraving.
I’ve come to the conclusion that these folks will do as they damn well please when it comes to the fine print/gray area issues.
Well back to Ident, those guys are awesome! I live. Lose to their shop and scheduled a time to drop off my lower, I had an engraving and an etching done. In and out inside of a week. The guys are super cool, know what they are doing and will do everything they can to make sure you get what you want. Those guys were pulling some crazy OT too, they really bust their asses up there to get stuff done.
I assume that’s true since in all of the cases I’ve sent receivers off to be engraved (3 times), Ident or Orion have returned the receivers to me directly via UPS. However, to get them there, I had to have my FFL send them via USPS as there is no UPS shipping hub near me.
Well that might explain my increased charge from UPS! I opened an account to send two lowers out. I was charged another $20. I dropped my lowers in a drop box on the way out of town with the wife and kids.
I sent a Sig 228 to US Anodizing a month ago via UPS and it cost me nearly $75. Im contemplating getting a FFL to do out-of-state transfers just so I can ship my own stuff via USPS.
Yeah I insured the lowers to $500 but did not describe the contents. A few days after delivery I had a new charge on my account! I’ve always wanted an FFL too. Might be a decent side business.
UPS policy is that firearms have to go by 2nd Day Air, and must specify “Adult Signature Required”, and it can’t go through UPS Store or drop-box. UPSP is cheaper, but I still suspect that shipping an AR receiver (pistol) has to go from FFL to FFL.
Additionally, Federal Law requires that a non-FFL shipping by contract carrier (like UPS or FedEx) must notify the carrier that the package contains a firearm (27 CFR 478.31). According to UPS, they are X-raying packages more and more frequently. Sounds like a potential trouble spot, if true, and if they happen to X-ray your package.
I suppose one could hypothesize that they X-rayed the package, decided it was a firearm and upcharged you because it then had to go 2nd Day Air, ASR. Maybe you were lucky they didn’t notify the Feds. Or maybe it doesn’t matter. I didn’t dig into the stuff far enough to get an idea of what the consequences might be of not notifying them.
I note that the same Federal law that requires that you notify the shipper that its a firearm also requires that the shipper can’t label the package as containing a firearm.
I have seen certain stripped lowers for sale and seen 21 or older as a requirement. It may be because the maker did not specify the frame was a long gun. Not sure. I know I have seen S&W lowers sold with that restriction before. I also know their lowers have no cal markings. Anyone know for sure?
It’s an excellent question. I’ve seen it posed before relative to Ruger 10-22 receivers. Those same receivers can be found in 10-22 rifles or in Ruger Charger pistols. I recently bought a couple of old stripped 10-22 receivers from my LGS. I didn’t dig into the details, but he did tell me I had to show him my state handgun permit for the NICS check. I’ll have to ask him about that.
If it is a stripped receiver, rifle or shotgun, by the letter of the law it is supposed to be considered a handgun because it is capable of having a pistol grip installed.
These “tactical” shotguns that you see, with only a pistol grip and no stock, can only be sold as handguns.
Depends on your state and to whom it is getting shipped to. I have shipped pistols back to the manufacturer for repairs without issues. They just had to be sent overnight.
Stripped receivers are identified as pistols in the 4473 and any applicable State form when you first purchase them from a dealer. Pistol grip shotguns are identified as long guns (bbls 18" or longer) as long as they meet or exceed the minimum OAL of 26".
Once a receiver is built into a rifle, it is supposed to be treated as such. Which means an AR-15 receiver that was originally purchased as a pistol but built into a rifle is now legally a rifle and cannot be treated as or converted into a pistol.
In other words, you cannot take that receiver and remove its stock and marry it up with an upper that has a barrel that is less than 16" unless it is registered as an SBR.
Of course, I haven’t fully recovered from my Annual Training experience so I may very well be mistaken about this whole thing. Can anyone verify that I do not have my facts backwards?
According to the ATF Compliance Officer that conducted my FFL interview a couple of weeks ago, shotguns with a pistol grip only, not shotguns with a normal long stock and a pistol grip, are to be treated as handguns. No matter the barrel length. When you start talking barrel length and overall length you are now in the realm of the NFA.
He asked this as a trick question during the interview.
Ident and Orion both blacken the engraved lettering. I haven’t seen Orion’s work, but on everything Ident has engraved for me, it comes back perfect just as in the photos above.