About 2 years ago SWAT was issued G34 MOS with RMR’s. It took me quite a few reps before I got comfortable with it. Prior to becoming confident and proficient I wasn’t terribly concerned because it wasn’t our primary weapon and we still have irons to rely on.
Now I have one on my primary off duty G19 and if allowed I’d carry it on patrol as well.
I run co-witness irons with milled slide & RMR. The trick set up.
I am a disciplined shooter (“perfect practice makes perfect”, blah/blah).
Through thousands of dry fire presentations in addition to a few thousand rds live fire, I feel competent with the RD.
My precision at distance is at another level; 50 yd head shots with irons was not predictable, it is with the RMR.
The speed of initially acquiring the dot is lacking however.
I am not, nor do I feel I’m on the same level of immediate reaction that I have with irons.
This shows itself with surprise shooting scenarios, awkward positions and tight shots at contact distance.
Hopefully this improves.
Thanks for all the information. I was an early adopter of the red dot for the long gun going back to the OEG days. I don’t know why I’m so hesitant to take the jump with a pistol. David
For those of you with RDS experience, how much improvement do you see (if any) in low light shooting with and without a white light?
And for the select few with experience with the ACRO, what height iron sights allow some form of co-witness?
I just turned 60 this year and can see changes in my vision as regards to finding that lump of metal on the front of the slide…
I was perhaps the last geezer in the country to put a red dot on my carbine - what a mistake waiting!
Regarding a pistol - practice and an RDS class at Suarez International made all the difference. Amazingly useful bit of kit! Take the time to learn to use it - the many references to dry fire practice are spot on!
Regarding the many complaints about astigmatism and ‘grape cluster’ dots - wear glasses, not contacts and make sure they know you need them corrected for your astigmatism! Go through a good place - NOT the cheap $69 place at the mall! I have atrocious astigmatism and 20/450 vision without glasses. With glasses correctly ground - 20/20 and a pinpoint dot in my RM 06.
My EDC carry is now a glock 17 milled for the RM 06 (by Suarez International - on their slide system) and I love it. Actually, I love it so much that I had a complete backup identical gun built for range use - one for practice, one for carry. Given my age, I’m set for life (OK, I’m going to have my BUG Glock 26 milled for a red dot soon - and then I’ll bet set).
geezer john
Just like with a carbine, a pistol is easier to shoot in low light with a red dot. Just like with a carbine, you need to keep the brightness adjusted for the lighting conditions. Where the RDS on a pistol REALLY shines is when you have NV. I know there are some on the boards who do. It’s mind blowing. Like achieving a new level of consciousness, mind blowing.
Add to that RMR a suppressor and you have a whole new level of NV use. An X300 IR capable light and your limits are diminished dramatically.
I have 2 RMR’d Glocks using the Dueck Defense RBU and I plan on adding a 3rd for my G43. It’s a great set up. It would be worth the OP taking a look at. I know that some don’t like dove tail mounts because the RDS sits a bit higher. Legitimate point, but I haven’t found that to be an issue. Having back up sights is a necessity IMHO and I like the fact that I’m not permanently tied to only one specific optic.
We had a meeting of area instructors yesterday and their seems to be more interest in RDS equipped handgun classes. I may have to bite the bullet, buy a RDS pistol and put in the time to master the setup.
Which RDS for a Glock or other high volume pistol works best for you and why?
I only have experience with 1 setup, but recommend it.
Trijicon rmr06 (3.25 moa) in a custom fit cut (atei pro cut).
I have 6k rds over 14 months or so on a type 1 and no issues to-date.
No issues with zero
No issues with rain
Its been dropped and ran hard (practice and competition) and carried.
Its been ran suppressed a bit too and cleans up easy if you stay on top of it.
I plan on getting one soon ! Just trying to decide which one I want ! I have been watching a lot of vids and here are a couple of good ones! Vids are on sight alignment and presentation, very good & helpful I thought
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HloKf9WifJg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dh9MC7O_CtA
Ok. I’m kinda with the OP on this. I built one but I’m still unsure. It’s on a 17 and I LOVE my 19x so I think I’m talking myself out of using it. Lol. The times I’ve shot it, I like it but I’m afraid I may have put one on my 19x to give it a fair shot.
I am curious about everyone’s choice of dot size though. I know there’s no right answer but…
The larger, 6 MOA dot gives the illusion of the dot being steadier, not as much “wobble” being obvious.
My buds think the larger dots are quicker on target. I don’t find this to be the case.
The 2.5 MOA is easier for me to be very precise with ( think 40 yd head shot).
The 2.5 is my preference.
Again, this is not only personal preference, but likely purpose driven.
Do you need extreme precision or is a coarser, arguably quicker sight picture a requirement?
So far mine is a 1 MOA dot. No particular purpose at this point. I see it fine. Bigger could work but I’m mainly curious as to what people are using for their intended applications.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Use: ccw, uspsa.
I use 3.25moa rmr. I thought about a 1moa, but I like the 3 well enough and stuck with it for my 2nd rmr. Ive never thought a different size would help from 3-100yds.
I find 4 moa to be unnecessary on rifles, so I assume Id feel the same about 6moa on a pistol.
Almost all of my shooting is USPSA, so it is a 2.5 MOA DPP. I’also have 2.0, 3.25, 6.5 and 8 MOA dots, last three on my carry Glocks, and my preference is 6 MOA. I do think it is a bit quicker, mostly because of washout issues in various lighting conditions. Indoors or when cloudy/dark, 2.5 MOA DPP is perfectly fine but there are situations when even at max brightness I want more visibility. I’ve not found long distance accuracy to be a problem, given that 6 min dot covers 6 inches of target surface. At 100 yards, that is.
I’ve been practicing with a RMR for a few months now. I’m starting to carry it occasionally in place of an identical gun with Ameriglo Agents. The transition hasn’t been difficult so far, but I’ve got umpteen presentations with irons for muscle memory. I think that may be the key. I do presentations daily as part of my dry fire routine, with whatever gun I am carrying. I’m using stock sights, currently, so no reference, and no backup. Maybe one out of 100 presentations I have to actually look for the dot. Otherwise, its right there on the target when I complete my draw. My splits are slightly slower, but my precision is much, much improved. I’ll start competing with it soon, and plan on pressing it into EDC in Q1 2020. I imagine I’ll have found any issues by then.
My experience… Like every guy in their late 40’s I was having issues with not seeing the irons like I used to. I started with a Trijicon RMR in a dovetail mount, loved it, but struggled with dot acquisition in some cases. I then added another to my hunting 10MM, had it milled with BUIS and it was dead nuts every time. Sent my other two into be milled with BUIS. I went with dovetail so I wouldnt screw up an expensive slide if I didn’t like it but it is a mistake as it makes the sight sit just a little higher and not natural for sight alignment.
My advice, if you do it, do it correctly and have the slide milled or buy a weapon with it already made to mount close to bore, do not dovetail and you will love it.
Finding a holster to fit it is another topic but will leave that for another time.
Check these guys out,makes many a Optic-Ready Style holsters. https://www.trex-arms.com/ I grabbed this one to start but he does make IWB holsters that are Optic ready. https://www.trex-arms.com/store/ragnarok/ My CZ-07 fits and the retension is fine with plenty of room up top for the RMR. My slide isn’t back yet but will report when it shows up and I get out to the range !
I found this to be a non-issue. The difference in dot / optic heights between milled, plate mounted, and dovetailed is comparable to difference between short and tall iron front sights. In fact, some folks believe they do better with higher mounted optics. In practice, I’ve Glocks with optics mounted into .165 pocket, .145 pocket, almost flush on Unity plate, and on a dovetail mount, and I find no difference. IMO, the dovetailed mount are a reasonable evaluative option, whether checking out the concept or the equipment. I would not use it as a long term solution.