I have to disagree, the trigger finger is the main safety
I believe what he meant is that the Glock is fine without an external safety because if it isn’t in your hand, it should be in a holster. There are plenty of objects that could get caught inside a trigger guard and cause an AD/ND. An AR doesn’t go into a holster, so it NEEDS the external safety for use while you are not firing.
Anywho, back on topic. Simplifying something like a Glock would be a tough thing to do, it’s already about as simple as I can think of. This is definitely going to cause me a lot of thinking tonight:D
Na, disagree again only needs one to prevent ND if dropped.
We do some crazy shit with our rifles. They’re good for holding up barbed wire, but-stroking someone in the face, and of course shooting mother fuckers.
They go everywhere you go. If you hit the deck hard, so do they. If you low crawl through mud and grit and grime, they go right along with you.
I would hate to think of the consequences of having a condition 1 rifle with a 4lb trigger and no safety. It would be a huge hazard for military operations in any form or terrain.
But this is not on topic.
Agreed and Im wrong and hard headed and in a bad mood sorry guys was talking out my arse. Back on topic somebody
While I don’t think this is to “simplify” the gun, I think offering the Glock with a factory grip reduction would be the only thing I could think of. That and not having the hole in the backstrap and therefore eliminating the need/want of a butt plug.
The gen 4s have the interchangeable back straps, but that’s just an extra part to break. Have a factory grip reduction without the need for a back strap (like the 21 vs the 21sf) would be simpler.
Tampa M4 nailed it above and you cinched it.
When you are busting brush, twigs will get in the trigger guard from time to time and you will get a loud noise if you don’t have your safety on.
No manual safety on an AR under heavy field use would be a 100% guarenteed eventual ND, it would be insane.
You know how you low crawl with a rifle under barbed wire? With the rifle on your chest and you on your back.
Would you like to snag a piece of barbed wire with the muzzle pointed at your chin?
Yep I opened my mouth and stuck my foot right in
Since the Glock, like the SIG and Beretta, has an internal firing pin safety, the manual safety is a redundant feature to prevent a ND from mishandling. Keeping your finger outside the trigger guard is all you need to do. No one ever seems to complain about a lack of a manual safety on a revolver. The more you try to make an inherently dangerous tool Dummy Proof, the more you identify the user. I agree that a good holster does aid in safe handling of the Glock as you have mentioned.
One thing that I believe would be a plus is perhaps some experimenting with alloy’s to find those with a natural Lubricity.
This could help reduce friction, stress and fatigue for parts with heavy metal to metal contact. IE Slide to Frame Rails…etc.
Surface finish will dictate more, as a super alloy with a low coefficient of friction and a poor surface will still hang up. Surface finish will most likely be cheaper to control than a super alloy.
No one ever seems to complain about a lack of a manual safety on a revolver.
True. But most revolvers have much heavier triggers.
Understand what the Internal Safety is, it is a drop safety.
When you are actively engaging a target or preparing to do this with a Glock is one thing but the holster gives me piece of mind when I am doing other things.
I but brush, A LOT OF BRUSH. I backpack(ruck-up) about 4 days a week in the spring/summer/early fall weather permitting. I crawled thru a newly-fallen tree over the trail this evening with my G-19 on my hip condition one.
Knowing my piece was secure and the trigger guard was totally blocked was worth its weight in gold.
Again, not to further beat up Ryan (who now gets it), but as an example; doing likewise covered in gear carrying an M-16 or M-4 without a manual safety, this would have been a golden example of an opportunity for Harry Branch to meet Sally Trigger.
Again with the Glock, remember, under the right circumstances, anything vaguely finger-like inside the trigger guard of a Glock can easily pull the trigger. Just because your finger is out of the guard does not mean something else cannot pull it. Never let this allow you to become complacent.
In considering the basic question, the HK P7 came immediately to mind. This pistol offered extreme simplicity (and speed) from the operator standpoint, though it was surely a study in contrasts from a technical standpoint.
Anyone who has ever removed the grip panels from a P7 was probably floored by the complexity of the cocking mechanism, and yet, the gas piston configuration is simple in the extreme.
You’re probably correct to use the Glock as your “baseline” example of a simple (yet reliable) pistol, though I’m not sure how much further it could be streamlined without turning it into something like the Hi-Point – which is a bit too rudimentary to merit serious consideration here.
AC
The Alloy’s I speak of would of course not replace the need for surface finishes…But be used in conjunction with them.
Do you have a relative cost comparison for what is used now?
No, I haven’t delved that deeply into this idea as I am no Metalurgist. I was just brainstormin ideas for improvements that might increase reliability, wear resistence etc…
Ahh, OK. From what I understand of only a small sampling of like materials, it would be cheaper to work the existing parts over on a wheel prior to assembly than to invest into super metals.
Army Chief,
I agree with you on the P7. If you really look at it, the serious parts of the gun are extrememly simple. And the cocking mechanism is more unusual than actually complex. A lot of the Rube Goldberg stuff on the Glock and other modern autoloaders is hidden away in the gun were people don’t see.
Thank you, revolvers also have external hammers so do leverguns thus no need for an external safety (Marlin you listening?)