How accurately can you shoot your AK47? How many MOA?
- With iron sights
- With scope
- While benched
- While standing
- While kneeling
- While sitting
- While prone
I’m curious what the consensus is about how accurately a good shooter can shoot an AK47.
Jimmy
I’ve seen a guy run the MEUSOC course in a Pat Rogers class better with an iron sighted AK than an M4 style gun with a RDS. Its the shooter not the gun!
Spooky
And I’ve seen guys in Vickers classes routinely make solid hits on a reduced C zone steel at 200 yards with irons and a 7.62x39mm rifle.
As Spooky said, it’s the shooter.
You’ve been to a Vickers course huh. Lucky dog. What were the dimensions of the steel?
I think a Vickers course would be awesome. He seems like he really likes the AK and the class would be quite fun. Larry’s got quite the teaching technique too - I’ll have to remember my helmet so I don’t hurt myself licking…
Spooky
…he was making hits with his little Krink…this was at about 150 yards.
I’ve got a Rifle Dynamics AK with a T-1 in an Ultimak rail that shoots right around 2-2.5 MOA with Federal American Eagle or Corbon DPX 7.62X39. If using Wolf or any other of the farm animals, it can go from that to maybe 4 or 5 MOA (ammo dependant).
However, I have made consistent rapid hits on IPSC sized steel out to 300yds, and even managed to get on target at 500yds after a few ranging shots (although the hit ratio was not what it was at 2-300yds!!). This is with eiether the Aimpoint or the iron sights. Of course, due to my years of CMP Service Rifle matches, I will tend to use the irons more at further distance and ignore the reddot as I feel more precise with them.
It is all about the nut behind the trigger (ie shooter), however ammo selection and contruction of the rifle can play a big role in the accuracy of the AK.
I fired my -74 at a zombie target at 100 yards as fast as I could get the sights back on target while prone; all my rounds were inside the torso.
This.
My financial advisor is a former 18 Echo, he prides himself on taking a new shooter and giving them his old S&W Sigma that he bought used and have them beat the pants off experienced shooters with their bling bling 1911’s at competitions.
Yeah, but, but, he was also almost doing it with his Glock too.
He certainly could run his rifle and was a great guy… His malfunction clearance vid made me realize how slow I was as I watched it yesterday and saw myself fumble fucking around in the background.:eek:
To the OP, what’s up with these threads? I don’t think you are going to get any real empirical data that will be useful. You would need to break it down in so many different levels that you would go bonkers in the process…
Yeah I understand what you’re saying about this being a multifaceted topic. Since I’ve posted this same topic in AR15-land I’ve been accused of being a newbie, been admonished for using the word “accuracy” in place of “precision”, etc., etc.
Some guys get what I’m asking and others don’t. The point is not to nitpick the topic, just answer the question “how good do you shoot with rifle X.” It’s that simple. If you don’t like talking in terms of MOA, that’s fine, talk about speed or minute of man or whatever you like. I’m interested in all of it. I’m interested to know what people are able to do out there, what they are able to accomplish with their rifles as far as shooting them goes. That simple really.
JH
You said he was using irons but I see something mounted on his gun, looks like maybe a red-dot or something. Am I misinterpreting the pic?
Beautiful firing lane by the way. What is the nearer backstop constructed of?
I posted that because it’s one of the few pics I have of the steel plate.
That particular shooter is indeed using an Aimpoint T-1 on his SLR-107UR.
I’ve hit the same target in walk back drills using irons and off hand back to 200 yards.
That large feature in the pic is just a wooden frame to mount paper targets to. It’s at the 100 yard line from the front of the shooting area.
The plate was 8"x10".
What is your endgame OP? Why the positional breakdown? There’s prone or benched, which allows for the most stable rifle position thus the position where a shooter is most likely to wring out the best shots; then there’s standing where the best shot is least likely. Every other position is pretty much an in-between until we start talking about shooting on the move.
Your statement in the first post seems more of a question of mechanical accuracy of the system. If that’s the question, why a thread for this and the AR? Is the intent to compare the accuracy of each system?
I’ve run my SLR-107CR in Larry’s AK classes using both irons and an Aimpoint and regardless of which if I did my part correctly I hit what I was aiming at. In one drill myself and another shooter scored the same but Larry gave me the win because I was using irons and the other gentleman was using a T1.
I’ve seen guys routinely hit the steel out to 175-200 yards, from standing, during the walkback drills.
The AK isn’t as inaccurate as the internet makes it out to be. In fact, if you take a Vickers AK class you’ll see how accurate (and fast) the AK can be.
My “endgame”? That’s classified he he.
Seriously though yes you got it right, part of what I’m interested in is comparing the AR-15 to the AK-47. From my experience I get groups roughly twice as big with the AK as with the AR but of course that’s all a function of ammo, etc. But that’s not all of it.
I’m interested in comparing not only AK with AR, but also compare shooters. Even the guys who have told me I’m full of sh*t and measuring groups is for lame newbie posers, even some of those guys have offered interesting info about their combat drills and so forth.
Like I’ve said before, I’m simply asking : when you pick up and fire gun X, where do the bullets go and how close are they to each other?
Based on that, I would say that you A) should have posted just one thread instead of two, B) don’t know what you’re really asking and C) by focusing on the “newbie” remarks you show what you’re insecure about.
None of those are bad, but it’s best to be clear instead of this beating around the bush bullshit.
It’s not really important what each individual shooter can do in a poll type thread like this. The guys who can’t get better than a 12 inch group at 25 yards aren’t going to post that they suck. The guys who get .5" groups at 200 yards are ready to whip out their proverbial wangs to show off. So data points that you are asking for are unlikely to answer your true question about inherent mechanical accuracy.
Rather than try and come up with numbers out of my ass to say an AK is a 6 MOA rifle while the AR is a 3 MOA rifle, I’ll simply say that what you have observed (AK groups are double the size of AR groups) is not uncommon. For me, this is largely a function of the poor sights on a stock AK. However when both rifles are on equal footing (issue ammo with a 4 MOA dot sight), I find I am capable of nearly the same level of precision out of each platform.
ETA:
The “BS” was important to correctly glean your true intent in asking the question. I suspect by your reply that you still don’t know what you’re asking. My reply is the only one that actually answered the question you took two threads and multiple posts to actually ask.
Don’t get butthurt.
Offhand with an SGL-21; Minute of can out to seventy or so yards.
Thanks for the free psychological analysis. Next time I’m thinking of making a post I’ll be sure to ask you if it’s ok and have you check the post to verify there’s nothing stupid or misguided in it.
After offering your enlightened analysis and critique of my post you proceed to answer the question just like every other normal person has done. Instead of prefixing your response with a bunch of BS before answering my question why not just answer the question and save the BS psychology for your 101 course.