Yup, might not affect times, but we hate it. OP did ask for opinions. SIG are great guns I’ll never own for nothing other than personal prefference. If you look at facts only, the mp has better mag capacity and is lower priced so it looks like a no brainer to me.
Edit. I don’t know if it’s bore hight or slide speed, but HK and sig both feel like a brick clanking back and forth that I have to wait for before following up. Also, triggers should be moot also cause that’s a training issue as well.
I’ve owned both the USP and USPc in .40 (I’ve sold the full size). I also have decent trigger time with the M&P .40. The M&P is a very decent pistol. I just happen to love my USPc. Prefer it hands down to its big brother the USP. There’s also only a one round difference in magazine capacity between the two.
To put things in perspective I owned a USP .40 about 7 years ago. Frame safety w/decocker. In the process of trying out different firearms I traded it, mainly because it always felt blocky. Never had a problem as far as shot to shot reliability went.
Fast forward to last year, I picked up an m&p .40c. No Frame Safety. Again shot to shot reliability hasn’t been an issue. The m&p conceals better in terms of thickness and obviously grip length and frame length. But I also ended up putting a DCAEK/Trigger from Apex into the m&p so you could say that I spent as much on the compact m&p as I did on the full size USP.
Congratulations, we aren’t all you. The man(or woman?) asked for people’s opinions/preferences, I gave mine.
The trigger and mag release are remedied by training. But then guess what, I now have two different ways of doing things and I rely on striker fired, frame/button mag release for work. Stupid to switch and have to learn two different trigger and mag release styles. Again, my opinion.
Etho, I dont know that it is stupid to learn to different ways of triggers/mag release. I know where you are coming from with a keeping continuity across systems.
I cringe a little when people are trying to figure out the HK mag release, but they get it eventually. I rarely have an issue transitioning from style to style, but I grew up on 19’s and started buying HK 18 years ago.
The USP is love hate for most, with ergos being the biggest issue. You wont find a more reliable gun, built like a tank, by Herman the German.
Personally, I’d get the LEM or add it afterwards. It’s really nice on the USP line (better than the P30 line; basically just a better reset). You could even go jet-funnel and 16 round see-through mags if you wish.
The best 40 cal recoil handling guns I’ve shot. I have a USP-Tact in 40 and every time I shoot that gun I swear it’s a 9mm.
My statement certainly wasn’t meant to offend you. My carry gun has the standard push-button mag release and I have no issues with that whatsoever. If you don’t want to learn a new way of doing things, it’s not a big deal at all. I was just stating that with a little bit of training it comes as naturally as pushing the button on my G19. I know the paddle magazine release isn’t for everyone, and many people here hate it.
Soft shooting, like a comfortable gun, is not good in its own right. Just cause it feels soft shooting or feels good, does not mean YOU will shoot it better. That said I’m sure you could train for the gun and get used to it if you don’t like it at first… or maybe that’s what you are good with.
Op, maybe you could rent or use someone else’s gun and compare live fire with both. From a quality standpoint both will be good. HK will likely be more accurate, but stock mp is capable of heads shots at 25yds offhand so in real use I don’t think it’s going to make a diffrence.
Points to consider:
Mp has more support, and is cheaper stock.
Both are designed around 40
Both have good track record.
Striker vs da/sa.
Accuracy differences.
Mag release
Stupid is a bit of a harsh word. Not a good idea? Not to me anyway. That’s not to say I don’t shoot other platforms. But to spend enough time to become proficient? No. The last thing I(anyone really if they truly depend on a firearm) is a change of how things are done. Train like you fight, fight like you train…after all.
I can use the paddle mag release just fine. But again, see my first statement here.
The USP is a fine pistol. I enjoy shooting mine from time to time. But it is nothing but a range toy for me. It was given to me. I will still argue until the cows come home that HK offers nothing in a polymer pistol that justifies the cost. It doesn’t do anything better than my Glocks or someone else’ M&P or any of the other polymer pistols.
I will also echo that the USP and USPc I had in .40 were TAME. Felt like a 9mm and 9mm Glocks are more snappy than USP’s in .40. Secondly, I don’t shoot USP framed pistols well with the stock grip. But then I add a Hogue slip on grip to the pistol and it instantly transforms into HK45/P30’ish and everything falls into place for me.
The USP40 is my SHTF pistol. I am looking to get a USP40c. I shot my brothers and I may like it better than the full size. I want to upgrade them to the LEM/match hybrid as soon as funds allow. I have owned the USPf since 1994, it has never failed. It is one of the few fully supported chambers for the 40. During the last ammo crunch, 40 ammo in my area was much easier to get than everything else.
H&K was smart to build the USP around the .40 and they got it right. My USPc .40 shoots as smooth as some 9mm pistols and is dead nuts accurate. There is a USPc .45 Stainless, 1998 date code V1 in 98% condition on a local gun board and it is beautiful! Damn hard not to rush out and buy it at $650. Had I not just got a G43, it would be mine.
I recently picked up a LNIB M&P VTAC .40 and have previously owned a number of HK’s, including a full size .40. I have never fallen in love with any operating system but am inclined to striker fired over DA/SA. I found HK’s very well built and completely reliable. I do not like their ergos and high slide mass. HK triggers are very heavy and long in the traditional DA cycle and decent in SA. The best DA/SA trigger in my experience is the Beretta 92 with the D spring. The VTAC is a very good pistol and I do like the sights. The ergos are in my hand are some ways better than the platform I feel most comfortable with, the Glock 19, but not as good in others. The trigger is decent, but not as good as the Glock or VP9, and I find I cannot get as high in the backstrap as I would like because the trigger guard is not undercut enough.
Between the full-size M&P and the HK, I say M&P: better ergos, lighter, thinner, far less slide mass, less expensive, easier trigger to learn, lifetime warranty and more after market support. In my hand the M&P’s are also softer under recoil in compared to the HK. Subjectively, I think the VTAC looks pretty bad ass in its FDE finish, Vickers mag plates and LFI mag release (the stock mag release remind of a big freakin’ wart).
Not to derail the thread, but Maverick07, undercutting the trigger guard is something easily accomplished with emory cloth and a sharpie. I’m not the most mechanically inclined person and it was very easy to do.
While I know that it is true that a soft shooting gun does not mean you are guaranteed to shoot it better, there is no mistaking the biggest whine about the 40SW is it’s snappiness. That said…the USP 40 full size takes the “it is too snappy” issue off the table.
(I shoot and carry a G22 most times and never had a problem with it’s snappiness. If the 40SW is too snappy…maybe you need to hit the gym LOL)
Even though I do not own an HK…the many times I have borrowed this USP40 and a P-30…I never had issues with the mag release and am pretty sure I can adapt to it. I am getting a VP-9 in a month or so and the mag release is just not a big deal…sorry.
