I’m going to buy a plate carrier for personall use and am having some trouble deciding what I want. I’m looking at the CIRAS, P.I.G., SOHPC, ARHPC and am considering waiting for Cryes new CPC.
Does anybody have any idea when the CPC will be released? What will it cost?
If it’s going to be a while, what is the best choice of the options listed above?
The plate carrier would be for personal use (think SHTF) right now. I’m going to pursue a career in law enforcement when I get out of the military, so I would like to be able to at least possibly use this carrier for that as well.
Which carrier is the most comfortable to wear for extended periods? Easiest to put on? Which would you recommend?
I’d like something versital that can support both a light load (4 rifle 4 pistol mags) or a fairly heavy one (8 rifle, 4 pistol).
How do you want to use the PC, specifically, what do you want to stick to it? Some are better weight bearers than others, some have better cummerbunds, some have better side-buckles.
Are you going to be using side-plates?
Are you going to be using plate backers?
Do you have a need for QR? What do you consider to be the minimum to qualify as quick release or doffing effort?
Personally, I like the Diamond Back Tactical Advanced Warrior Fast Attack Plate Carrier. Its comfortable, no buckles on the front of the shoulder, easy to adjust ride heigh for changes in clothing, and a low-profile kangaroo pouch that can be fitted with a variety of pouches (I prefer 3 M4 mags). The integrated soft armor permits use of lighter, thinner plates.
When it comes to a cut-down, plate only system, the basic Paraclete is my favorite. Simple, cost efficient, robust.
As a load-bearing/combat vest goes, the Paraclete ARHPC is great, and comes with an armored cummerbund.
By the way- the CIRAS is a BALCS/SPEAR armor carrier, not just a plate carrier.
Per what F2S’s advice, I too just spent a bit on diamondback tacticals website and WOW! They do have any configuration you would need in a vest. I personally liked the fast attack warrior plate carrier.
Our local federal guys wear the UTOC which has been issued to them. Its like a vest and plate carrier and they say they sit in them for hours on survieallance without a problem. If you cant find what your looking for on that site, then your SOL. :ph34r:
Two TT SAW Pouches (one for an IFAK and the other for a utility pouch for assorted mission essential stuff, lube, or extra M4 mags)
Spare batteries
Small radio
Hydration carrier (I’m thinking the EMDOM vehicle hydration carrier)
Folding Knife
Multi Tool
Surefire G2
I want the ability to run side plates. I think the plates I’m initially going to go with will be the Velocity Systems Level IV ceramic stand alone. It sounds like the ARHPC may be what I’m looking for.
I do understand there is a difference between the CIRAS and a Plate Carrier, but what exactly is that difference? Size? The only difference I can really put my finger on between something like the CIRAS and the ARHPC is size. The ARHPC seems to be a little smaller.
I want the PC to be releasable. I’ve never dealt with this sort of thing before so I’m not sure what is considered quick to put on and take of. I’d like to be able to get out of it in 5 seconds or less and put it on in about 15 seconds. Are those realistic expectations?
CIRAS is an armor carrier that can support plates as well. It fits BALCS/SPEAR armor. Plate carriers don’t have provisions for soft armor underneath; you either wear the plates with backers, or wear soft armor underneath the plate carrier or the outer garment.
Plates are the most expensive part of the equation, so if you already have plates you can base the rest of your armor decision around that as far as if you are going to need soft armor or not. You can easily use an in-conjunction plate by getting soft armor backers for the plate, which fit in the carrier and are about the same size as your plate. Depending on your plate and soft armor, going with a soft armor backer can be a cheaper/thinner in use combination.
As far as your loadout goes, 4 rifle and 4 pistol along with all those ancilliaries isn’t really a “light” load, and will force you to use a cummerbund. That in and of itself isn’t really a big deal, but a cummerbund will interfere a little with belt-mounted rifle and pistol mags (the preferred place for them) and will make donning and doffing slower than just clipping a buckle as you will do without a cummerbund. You can go with an elastic/slick-sided cummerbund to give you better access to the belt, and it will make the carrier ride a bit more stable with a heavy load, but you will still have the time penalty associated with a cummerbund. Plate carriers are not good load-bearing platforms unless you are also using an inner-cummerbund to take weight off the shoulders and properly position the plates. If you don’t, with your load, you will have front plate sag which will expose the top of the heart, aorta, and lungs, which are precisely the areas that the plate is intended to protect.
Many people try to treat a plate carrier like a chest-worn back-pack. They aren’t. To get the most out of them, keep them simple and light. They work very well as an addition to a first-line belt, and poorly as a full armor replacement. I wear my armor for days at a time, eat in it, fly in it, slide in it, ride in it, run in it, fight in it, shoot in it, and sleep in it, so I am very particular and picky when it comes to how it is setup and how to get the most efficiency from it. If you only put it on for an hour or two at the range or at a class you will be able to get away with it in whatever setup you choose, but if you ever actually have to use it for an extended period of time, I assure you that you will get the most from it if you follow my recommendation for use.
In the end, it’s your money and your choice, do what you want for whatever reason you choose. Best of luck.
Thanks for all the help so far, I’m getting lots of good advice.
Will the ARHPC work for my needs listed? It sounds as though it will, as you describe it as load bearing.
I guess I considered that a fairly light load as I see pictures of some guys PC/Armor Carriers carrying 10 mags, a pistol and have so many pouches hanging off you cant see whats underneath.
I defenately want a carrier that I can wear for more than a few hours at a time, I want something that can be worn for an extended period of time (days at a time possibly).
I prefer to keep things off my belt. All I’m going to run on my belt is my P30 in an ALS drop leg with single leg strap and one spare magazine carrier weak side.
In that case, look to your own needs and abilities as opposed to what others are doing, or what you’ve seen pictures of. If you have access to Lightfighter, go to their loadout threads; they’re supposed to be posting their use for their rig, as well as some rationale on gear selection, rather than just taking a snapshot.
A lot of people try to fill up every bit of MOLLE that they can, with things that would be better suited to a back pocket or a backpack. Some of these guys are being driven to the fight, some already evaluated their physical condition and training, and determined that they can carry all this and still be combat effective (training and conditioning), others have no idea, and are doing it because everyone else is. Some are just playing bullet hose on a range. You have no idea simply by looking at the photos.
Now, I’m nowhere near F2S’s level, but when I wear armor, I wear it for work. I spent the last couple years buying up gear, pouches, etc. that I never truly needed. This was WRONG. I’ve begun selling pieces off, removing items, and rucking more and more or what’s not immediately needed. A good case for this is a cop’s duty belt. As I spent more and more time wearing it, as opposed to standing on a firing line, the less I put on it.
For SWAT, I switch between an assaulter role and a sniper/observer role. I carry my handgun, all mags (rifle and pistol), and IFAK on a MOLLE belt, and run my armor slick. This keeps me from loading myself down, so I’m in better physical shape to climb, run, fight, and maneuver. I can also doff my armor if I need to for concealment, and still have my fighting load. (psst…I also keep an active shooter chest rig with ammo and a medkit in my car; if I need more ammo in a SWAT environment, I can take that along too.)
F2S made a good point about thinking about all the time you would spend in an armor carrier NOT fighting. For me, that means being prone out in the woods, on a rooftop, in any weather, in an armored truck or a jump-out van or car, even sleeping, etc.
Personal experience: stick to bullets, meds, and comms (&a little H2O) between your belt and chest. tools, lube, more water, food, batteries, can ride in a backpack.
My advice? If you do decide to go with an armor carrier, chest rig, plate carrier, whatever, start with it completely bare, and as you determine what you need on your chest, put it there. The rest of the stuff, you’ll find, can probably ride in a backpack, a car or range bag (the lube), or in a pocket (knives and cool guy tools).
The pictures I was referring to were actually from the lightfighter thread. There were a lot of guys who looked like they carried a lot of shit on their armor/plate carriers.
After experimenting with a belt, I actually prefer to keep things off my waist and on my back/chest.
One reason I want to place my light/knife/bateries on my chest is for simplicity, I want something I can throw on and have a basic load of everything I need.
I was considering using a YOTE for a pack/hydration carrier. I figure a couple of batteries and a small bottle of lube isn’t going to take up much room on my chest.
My current chest rig is an Eagle/ SKD set up to carry Six rifle mags with my P30 in the fourth mag pouch. Two pistol mags and a folding knife/g2 in the other two pistol mag pouches. I have a Maxpedition Anemone on each side as well for carrying a multitool, some lube, pencil, paper and batteries.
With my armor I want to take that same set up and then add to the armor package what I couldnt to my chest rig. I want it to be something that I can just throw on, not something where I have to put on layers.
EDIT: what about the Mayflower Research Low-Profile Assault Armor Carrier? that looks promising.
What kind of belt and belt setup are you intending on using?
There is a very important part of this decision that I neglected to ask: how do you intend on employing this vest?
In the initial post you say personal/SHTF. SHTF has a lot of different definitions, what is yours?
Throw over a CCW rig when you grab your rifle?
Grab off your bedpost for an HD event?
Throw over top of a first line belt rig (LE)?
Open combat with prior prep?
It helps in helping you better scuplt your kit when all aspects are covered.
My definition of SHTF is enough shit hitting the fan that I’m not going to look out of place going about what ever it is I’m going about doing with a rifle an armor. Assume a REALLY bad natural disaster, shooting in the streets, looting, rioting (somewhat open combat). There would be prior prep.
I plan on wearing the armor over a Riggers belt w/ a P30 in an ALS single strap drop leg or the same weapon in a Kaluban Cloak kydex holster.
I want to keep as much as possible off my belt. The only thing I plan on running on my belt is my side arm and one spare magazine for my sidearm.
If you were planning on maintaining your CCW setup and add to it with a plate carrier I would agree with your approach, other than the amount of weight you plan to put on the PC.
However, if you are going to take the time to mount a holster and mag pouches to a belt I highly recommend a dedicated belt with everything you need already on it. All you need to do is pick it up and clip it on. Further, the human body carries weight on the waist better than it does with bearing weight on the shoulders, so pushing some weight from the vest to a good belt will increase mobility and comfort. I am not saying that putting 4 rifle mags on the belt is a good idea, but a single rifle speed reload, two pistol mags, a bleeder kit, dump pouch, pistol/holster, and a pouch or two for small items/multitool is not at all excessive. It will allow you to comfortably carry three rifle mags on your chest (just about the right amount) as well as 3 pistol mags if you really want (which cover a whole lot of transitions-I have found that 2 additional pistol mags is more than enough if you have a long-gun and a couple mags for it), and a hydration system on the back.
This is my opinon and experience, but it has been gained through personal experience and that of others that have been dealing with these systems in an overloaded status for a significant period of time in varying conditions. Take all the items you intend on carrying (with mags filled) and put it into a backpack and take it on a 5 mile run. What would you take out for the next day’s run?
Thanks a lot for all your insight F2S. After reading what you had to say, and thinking about what all I plan to put on my vest, I think that the ARHPC is what will work best for me.
What stand alone armor with level III or IV capability do you recommend to work with a chest rig rather than attaching pouches to the armor itself? Comfort would be a big factor for extended wear. Rapid don and doff would be nice but not a major factor. Also being a civie, “restricted” sales would be out. Thanks.
titsonritz, I’m really new to this so I’m learning too, but I’ve been doing a TON of research and I’d take a good look at Mayflower Research. They have a low profile carrier that interfaces with chest rigs. You can take the chest rig off to run it slick or strap it on.
psst…I also keep an active shooter chest rig with ammo and a medkit in my car; if I need more ammo in a SWAT environment, I can take that along too.)