Help legalizing AR to go into Massachusetts needed

Hi guys and gals,

Before I get into this, I’d like to avoid “don’t move (t)here” comments. I don’t have a choice regarding it, and have to move to Mass.

I want to bring my Colt 6920. I previously ruled it out, but have found that it might be possible to bring it if I remove the flash hider/bayonet lug and pin the stock. Is this true? Does anyone have experience with this or know the details?

The laws are so vague…I’m thinking I am going to give the local LEO Chief a call. Thanks in advance!

-Justin

I haven’t any idea what the rules are for Mass, but I don’t think contacting the local PD is the way to go. My contact with the local PD here in Cal tend to be of the " gee I don’t know" kind, but they are happy to arrest you for any violation that exists.

I would contact the state agency that controls the weapons, I have had very good luck in contacting the Cal DOJ assault weapon office.

From:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbulletin/threads/157704-MA-Assault-Weapons-Ban-quot-AWB-quot-FAQ

Pretty much everything you need to know about the MA AWB.


Background:
What is the MA AWB?

The “Assault Weapons” ban in MA is almost a verbatim version of the Federal AWB that existed from 1994 - 2004.

This is how it is currently encoded in MA law:
http://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Ge...140/Section121

The “Assault Weapons” ban in MA did not expire in 2004, and a “cosmetic” bill was filed, passed, and then signed into law by romney (although it is arguable that such an extension was unecessary anyways, as the MA AWB had no sunset clause written into it to begin with. ).

How so called “Assault Weapons” are defined by the law:

Rifles:
(B) a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of–
(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
(iii) a bayonet mount;
(iv) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and
(v) a grenade launcher;

NOTE WELL: Given (B), this means that things like PUMP and BOLT ACTION rifles are EXEMPT from the AWB.

Handguns/Pistols:
(C) a semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of–
(i) an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
(ii) a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;
(iii) a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;
(iv) a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and
(v) a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm; and

Shotguns:
(D) a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of–
(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
(iii) a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and
(iv) an ability to accept a detachable magazine.'.

NOTE: Given (D) this means that break open, pump, bolt action shotguns are exempt from the AWB.

How the AWB applies to Magazines (eg, so called “Large Capacity Feeding Devices” under MGL):

The federal ban stipulated a ban on “Large Capacity Feeding Devices”, and this is the MGL version:
“Large capacity feeding device”, (i) a fixed or detachable magazine, box, drum, feed strip or similar device capable of accepting, or that can be readily converted to accept, more than ten rounds of ammunition or more than five shotgun shells; or (ii) a large capacity ammunition feeding device as defined in the federal Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act, 18 U.S.C. section 921(a)(31) as appearing in such section on September 13, 1994. The term “large capacity feeding device” shall not include an attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with,.22 caliber ammunition.
What this means in english is that within the borders of MA, you cannot legally own/possess a magazine that meets the description above (unless the magazine was made on or before 9/13/94). You’re probably wondering what an attached tubular device is"- think feeding tube on a tube fed .22 LR rifle like a Marlin or some of the old Winchesters. This carve out was stuck in the law to keep the fudds from getting upset when it got passed.

It should also be noted that the MA version of this law does not include the extra definition in Federal Law (reference to be added later) that used to define a standard of evidence for what constituted a “Large Capacity Feeding Device”. Therefore, the means of prosecution with regards to magazines is not laid out in state law like it used to be on the Federal side. This means that how someone would be prosecuted for violating the mag ban is anyone’s guess. Federal law rather FIRMLY put the burden of proof on the part of the state, even going so far as to stipulate that an unmarked mag that was claimed to be preban was to be taken at face value. This is not the case under MGL and enforcement is very unclear.

Exemptions: (This is important!)

The MA AWB does not apply in the following scenarios:

-The Rifle/Shotgun/Pistol was an “Assault Weapon” or in the case of a magazine holding more than 10 rounds, a “Large Capacity feeding device” manufactured on or before 9/13/94. Note: In order to qualify for this exemption, the device must have existed “in AW configuration” the date the law was enacted. This caveat, of course, is rarely proveable one way or the other.

-The device in question is possessed by an MA FFL or a LEO (for use in performance of their duties)

Note: This exemption is “murky” at best. The “commonly accepted” interpretation is the dealers are AWB exempt because they supposedly are able to sell AWs and the like to Law Enforcement, and the LE exemption is doubly murky, depending on who you talk to.

-The device in question is possessed by someone in US Military service under orders, or someone employed in a Federal law enforcement job as issued duty gear- issued gear is immune due to an overriding federal law more than likely. The protections ascribed to here likely do not apply beyond the scope of whatever the job you have is or whatever gear
you are issued.

-The device in question is not an “assault weapon” as described above or a large capacity feeding device. EG, a 10 round cripple mag is obviously not covered/governed by the AWB.


Common Questions:

Magazines:
Q: Can I use a pre-ban large capacity mags in post-ban, ban neutered firearm?

A: Yes. The gun the mag works in has nothing to do with the mag, legally speaking.

Q: I have a post-ban, large capacity mag in a free state, can I cripple my mag to be 10 rounds only to make it legal for use in MA?

A: Probably- I would suggest doing a modification where reversing or attempting to reverse the modification would result
in the mag being destroyed, that way someone cannot argue that you intended to circumvent the law.

Q: Can I legally re-build magazines?

A: The commonly accepted interpretation of this is “yes”. Problem is this has never been fleshed out under MA law- the fed interpretation was that you could replace ANY part on a pre ban magazine as long as you were not creating a new magazine… but who knows how that would fly in MA.

Q: How can I identify if a mag is pre-ban or not?

A: This would take way too long to explain here, and honestly, 8 out of 10 times it is nearly impossible to identify whether something is pre or post ban. One type of mag that is definitely off limits 100% of the time is anything with “LE/Mil/Government use only” markings on it- those markings are a dead giveaway since they were used during the AWB to identify post-ban magazines. We also have other threads here in the gun laws forum (eg, the Glock mag thread) where some people have attempted to identify provenance of magazines by various means.

Q: I am a LEO in MA. Can I have/buy post-ban large capacity magazines (or for that matter, so called “assault weapons” for personal use? )

A: This is unclear. The “Gliddenism” answer/interpretation is NO, and that the LEO exemption only covers duty items or items “necessary for duty use”. That being said, if I were a LEO in MA I would be basing my ability to use this exemption on whether or not my command brass would back me up or not if the chips were down. Also remember that if for some reason you are not active, you are no longer protected- eg, you quit, got fired, or retired.

Firearms and the AWB:
Q: I have a pistol/rifle/shotgun that is single shot/bolt/pump action does the AWB…

A: No, not really. The only thing that really applies WRT the AWB is the mag ban if your firearm takes a magazine of some sort or has one built into the gun.

Q: I have a preban rifle/pistol/semiauto shotgun- does any of this crap apply to me?

A: Not really, provided your gun was in “assault weapon” configuration when the ban was passed. Obviously the mag ban still applies regardless, as the gun does not “immunize” nor “poison” the magazines used with it by association.

Q: I have an FID. IS this AWB thing what blocks I can actually buy?

A: No. The MA AWB has nothing to do with the restrictions between license classes in MA.

Q: I noticed that there is a “name ban” in the AWB. Does this even really apply/matter?

A: Not really. Federal ban was the same way, name ban portion of the law doesn’t really mean much. (ETA: If someone can disprove and explain this to me, I would be happy to add it to the FAQ. PM me with info- AFAIK, nothing is actually banned by name as the dust settles via the name list in the fed awb)

Q: People keep telling me that the MA AWB is rarely prosecuted and can basically be ignored.

A: While they are 100% correct on the “rarely prosecuted” part, prosecutions have occurred- and it is a “disabling felony” too, if convicted… see also AWB prosecutions in MA:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbu...utions-in-Mass

So, ignore it at your own peril, more or less. Enforcement is rare and inconsistent but being stuck on the wrong side of the law when the chips are down could be very costly legally.

Q: People keep telling me the MA AWB expired when the Federal one expired…

A: It did not- it exists as its own law under MGL and only references Federal law as it had appeared at the time of the ban. There is no wallhack to it in this regard.

Miscellaneous:
Q: What about this EOPS AWB memo that was sent to dealers that people keep talking about? Is it legit?

A: Nobody knows, except it is best described as being based on legally dubious premises. See also: http://www.goal.org/newspages/eops_e...er_to_ffl.html

Q: What about Gliddenism I keep hearing about- that you can’t take a post-ban rifle and have it neutered before taking possession, and that it is still illegal even after it is neutered?

A: This is some musing that Glidden came up with that appears to have no actual basis in law. I have found no case law as to support his assertion. Bear in mind this attitude is
contradictory to the attitude espoused by the feds during the term of the old federal
AWB.

Q: “Some gun shop sold me something that I think is an illegal assault weapon!!!/illegal magazine OMG what do I do?”

A: If you are reasonably sure that is the case, and you care, my advice would be to shut up, bring it back to the dealer, and get your money back. Please don’t come onto NES posting about it, lest you incriminate yourself in the process, or the dealer for that matter. There is a good, no strike that, excellent possibility a dealer made a mistake due to misunderstanding of the law. There is a lot of crap for these guys to keep track of, and it is trivial to see how a dealer could unwittingly sell someone a felony.

Q: “I saw gun dealer X at gun show Y with a gun/magazine that violated the AWB ZOMG OH NOES? Won’t heee get someone in trouble? what should I doooooo?”

A: Best thing to do is simply be quiet and don’t buy it.

Q: "Someone told me that if I bring an AW/ post ban “large capacity” mag into MA when I move here it is grandfathered cuz I moved into the state with it, and whenever you move in with something it is grandfathered no matter what it is. "

A: They are completely wrong. The AWB applies to all MA residents and does not grant leeway or special exemption to move-ins and the like- we all live under the same pile of
crap unless you are one of the rare exempt categories like dealers, LE, or military running under orders.


Questions Related to building rifles/shotguns/pistols and how the AWB affects these builds:

Rifles:

Q: Can I legally replace parts on a preban lower and still have the gun be pre-ban at the
end?

A: Yes, as long as the lower stays as a constant, the entire gun can be treated as a preban, even if all the other parts are brand new.

Q: If I put a thumbhole stock on my AR can I get an extra evil feature?

A: Yes. That said, beware that in a lot of cases this doesn’t buy you much. You could swap out a brake for an FH. There is also the “usable threads” problem you run into on most
normal uppers.

Q: What about this rumination I hear about a rifle being exempt from the AWB if it is an SBR?

A: Controversial/Unknown - This issue is discussed in detail here:
http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbu...l=1#post422229

Flash Suppressors:
Q: What Legally Constitutes/Delineates between a Flash Suppressor in MA?

A: Nobody knows, the assumed guess is it references the old Federal standard, which is defined by this ATF bulletin here: (cite needed)

Attachment of Brakes/other muzzle devices:
Q: What legally Constitutes “permanent attachment” of a muzzle device in MA?

A: Nobody knows, the assumed guess is it references the old Federal standard, which is either Silver Solder or Blind Pin + Weld over the hole left behind.

Collapsible Stocks:
Q: What legally Constitutes a correct “pinning” of an adjustable or folding stock so that it is not considered as such under the law?

A: Nobody really knows. The generally accepted premise is that it must not be able to be restored to its original state without the use of tools.

Q: Why are stocks like the Magpul PRS considered legal? Doesn’t that back section “collapse” ?

A: If you read the law and how it describes a collapsible stock, it does not fit the definition of such a stock.

Shotguns:

Q: Can I add a pistol grip to a Saiga shotgun in MA?

A: Not usually, this would push the shotgun above the part count limit for shotguns

Pistols:

Threaded Barrels:
Q: Is a threaded barrel legal on a pistol in MA?

A: Yes, pending the constrictions described in the AWB above… but generally speaking, most common handguns are lawful to use with a threaded barrel, because most of them are way below the AWB criteria.

Pre-Ban Pistol:
Q: Is it possible to build an AR or AK pistol in MA that doesn’t violate the MA AWB?

A: Maybe, but what you will end up with is best described as a “frankenstein hack job”.

VFG:
Q: Can I attach a vertical foregrip or a buttstock to a pistol?

A: No. This is prohibited by the Federal NFA. There are ways to do this legally but this is WAY outside the scope of this Faq… see the NFA faq in the equipment section.

Flash Suppressor:
Q: Can I put a flash suppressor on a pistol?

A: Yes, if your pistol does not trip the AWB weight limit described earlier.


Good luck.

Thanks for that. I’ve been reading up at goal.org and also on NEShooters, but hadn’t seen that post.

Another question I have is this…I don’t plan on changing residency (right away, if at all) from Rhode Island. Can I get a Non-Resident LTC and possess all of my firearms even if I’m technically living there? Or would I have to change residency…

Delete.

Q: What about Gliddenism I keep hearing about- that you can’t take a post-ban rifle and have it neutered before taking possession, and that it is still illegal even after it is neutered?

A: This is some musing that Glidden came up with that appears to have no actual basis in law. I have found no case law as to support his assertion. Bear in mind this attitude is
contradictory to the attitude espoused by the feds during the term of the old federal
AWB.

This is what you have to watch out for. I have never heard of anyone being prosecuted for it. If you read the law I don’t see how you could be prosecuted for possession of an “assault weapon” and then a defense attorney shows the firearm and it clearly does not meet the criteria. Some will say once an AW always an AW meaning you cant modify the weapon to make it compliant. Head over to northeastshooters for some good info. MA laws are a cauldron of verbose and confusing legislation combined with Attorney General threats that appear to have no basis in any law, and a list of regulations regarding licensing and firearms so long and confusing nobody has any idea how to interpret them.

The things you need to understand in MA are license type, laws governing the rifle/pistol you want to bring in, laws governing magazines.

The only police agency I would contact would be the Massachusetts State Police. I would find out who you need to speak with and see if you can get their email. If so I would conduct all conversation via email so you there is a record.

Sorry dude. I hope the job pays big money that you are going there for.
My two cents is WOULD NOT call the police for gun advice! If the move is permanent, then you are stuck with their awful laws, like i am living here in the PRK. If the moves not permanent, obviously you’d want to leave some of your guns with trust friends.

Right now in the PRK there’s a “bullet button ban” being bandied about in the Krazy Kaliofrnia Kommie legislature. It looks strongly that it will pass and nobody can tell you exactly what it will make illegal. On top of that the state judiciary temporarily suspended the “ammo restriction” bill that would require: microstamping ammo, no more then 50 rounds a month (!) and fill out a form and show ID to buy ammo. The bill has ALREADY passed so it is merely on hold. PRK will just keep coming up with more and more anti-gun laws. In the last year i have bought two WASR AK’s and a Stag AR, on credit because i figure i have to get them NOW since they may be banned TOMOROW! Same goes for ammo - i hoard, for the same reason.

If they try a gun or ammo grab here in Kalifornia i intend to contact one of my relatives in other states, and ask them if they will keep my guns for me for a while. I only intend to stay in PRK until i retire which will be 7 years or less and move to a Free State.

Is there any way you can move to a free state like New Hampshire or Vermont and commute to work? A lot of people live in southern NH and commute to MA.

Another question I have is this…I don’t plan on changing residency (right away, if at all) from Rhode Island. Can I get a Non-Resident LTC and possess all of my firearms even if I’m technically living there? Or would I have to change residency…[/QUOTE]

That would not be wise, nor legal. Could cause you a major ass ache that you really don’t need. I’d contact GOAL in Westboro MA, or the Mass State Police Firearms records section. If you call 10 different local Depts., you will get 10 differnt answers. Save yourself the aggravation.

MA is very unkind to out of state firearm owners. I have a free house waiting for me there but I won’t move into it because I like my boomsticks too much… That being said I wouldn’t bring anything across state lines there except for a hunting shotgun until residency is established and you have your FID and LTC, depending on what you own.
My dad handled his department’s permit applications from the time they instituted the new rules until he retired a couple years ago.
I’ll shoot him an email and see what he comes back with and post it for you.
ETA :
If you’re lucky you’ll end up in Western MA (Berkshires) in one of the hill towns. They’re less likely to be scared of guns as a lot of the hill town residents hunt. AR’s may still scare them a bit but you’ll make friends at the range if they shoot it some.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I847 using Tapatalk 2

you turned down aFREE HOUSE? Now that’s love…sell it/rent it? I totally understand, would do the same…these ridiculous laws are not going to end!!! I think when i retire I’ve found a cause to devote my time to - 2A advocate!

Deepest well of knowledge on all things MA gun law related will be GOAL:

http://www.goal.org/

You can call them directly and speak with them, and or, they will have someone contact you. As far as I know, if you have the specific recs of the state for ARs (which I think you covered above) you are GTG in terms of the gun itself (but do NOT take my word for that, contact GOAL) as well as issues of pre ban/post ban mags, licensing, and so forth.

Once you get it figured out, in MA, depends very much on where it is you plan to attempt to bring it to, as the ‘licensing authority’ of each town has a say in that, so one town you may be fine, next town over, not so much. How is that Constitutional? I have no idea…

So, you need to find out the laws of the state, and make sure the town you are moving to is not known for it’s anti gun stances. That issue tends to be much more acute when looking to get CCW for sure, but no doubt, there’s towns where someone once saw a movie where evil black “assault” rifles were used in a crime, and thus don’t want them in “their” town and so forth.

BTW, MA is not the worst state in the nation for gun rights, but it’s close. It does have some of the most fu&%ed laws on the books, but generally not as difficult to achieve what’s wanted once (clearly un Constitutional) hoops are jumped through like a good Subject… From what I gather NJ or CA for example worse.

If you were smart, you’d move to NH and commute. Just sayin’ :cool:

Nothing in MA is free, nothing. It’s where Liberty began and ended in this country. :help:

You’re asking a bunch of Qs people here can’t answer for you, and you can’t take their word for it regardless… I believe non res LTC is actually done by the State Police and is actually not that difficult because it’s outside the usual loop of what residents have to go through, but again, you can’t take my word for it regardless and have to start with GOAL and work from there.

Truth, there. I grew up out in the Berkshires and our home/property isn’t to be sold, according to my great grandfather who built it. Right now it’s about 3/4 acre lakeside with a 5 bed, 2 bath 3500sq ft home on it. My parents are currently there and have offered it to me many times on the condition that I share it with them till retirement or when my grandparents who live down the way die they’ll live in their house till then. I think my Mom is trying to move somewhere warmer…
I put a new deck on it a couple years ago, then my Dad built a nice new sun room on top of that. They will be retiring in a few years and then heading somewhere warm with close water access so my Dad can do his salt water fly fishing. When I take it over it will be split in to a two entry unit and one rented and the other available for family/friend use whenever. I figure that plus some renovations it needs will set me back 15k if I do most of the labor. But if I can rent it out I can pay it off in a couple years with rent so it works out to free(ish).

I love the area it’s in but until the MA legislature and people get their heads out of their arses and restore freedoms the house and residency there is just a backup plan.

So my dad just emailed me a link to GOAL and said it’s your best bet for info so I’ll pass it along to you: http://www.goal.org/masslawpages/moving_to_ma.html

The Massachusetts Non-Resident License to Carry is now a gigantic pain in the ass, and I can say this with authority.

First, you need to fill out the application and send it in with the money and required materials and credentials.

http://www.mass.gov/eopss/docs/chsb/firearms/nonresident-application.pdf

The LTC application is first bifurcated into Class A and Class B. Don’t bother with Class B … apply for Class A.

You will be asked to WHY you are applying for this license. If you want it issued for the “CCW” (for all lawful purposes, including personal protection), you need to provide a very specific justification as to why - otherwise you will be denied. Do not bother applying for this if you don’t have a good and documentable reason. DPS has been clamping down very hard on issuance of unrestricted LTC’s as of recent.

If it’s just for target shooting, then no problems.

After you send in your app, you will be contacted by DPS by phone for a personal interview. Yes, you have to schlepp up to Chelsea, MA on a weekday to go for a very short interview. A DPS rep will go over your application, take digital fingerprints, and take a photo. If you are applying for the “CCW” LTC … you will be under a microscope.

You’ll get your LTC several weeks afterwards, depending on how slammed DPS is. They process a few thousand applications a year on a shoestring budget.

The non-resident LTC is only good for one year, and DPS is telling me the process to renew is about a 4 month process. So every 8-9 months, you are going through the renewal process.

A note about Mass laws - they are very restrictive. In some respects, they are like D.C., but not as bad as D.C. and NY and NJ.

First off, as a resident, in order to possess long guns and ammunition, and COMPONENTS, you need to have a resident Firearms Identification Card. This is the first license you usually obtain as a resident. It’s issued pretty quickly by your local LEO. DO NOT BE IN POSSESSION OF LONG GUNS, AMMO, OR AMMO COMPONENTS (EVEN SPENT CASE OR SHOTSHELL OR EVEN LEAD SHOT) OR ANY MAGAZINES UNTIL YOU GET YOUR FID CARD.

The second tier of licensing is the infamous License to Carry. You need a License To Carry to transport a handgun outside of your home. You need a License to Carry to have high capacity magazines.

There are “Class A” and “Class B” categories for these licenses.

Class B gets your revolvers, pistols with low cap mags (<10 rounds), and the ability to lawfully own PREBAN STANDARD CAPACITY RIFLE magazines. It is usually issued for target and hunting only.

Class A gets you anything covered under Class B, as well as high cap pistols and their pre-ban magazines. Class A licenses can be issued, at the discretion of the local chief, for all lawful purposes including personal protection (target, hunting, CCW) or can be restricted to target shooting/hunting only. It will depend on where you live. My suggesting - pick a town that has a pro-gun police chief.

Other licensing stuff - in Mass, full auto and SBR’s are doable, but again depend on where you live. To obtain a full auto, you must first have an FID card, a Class A license to Carry, and then a separate machine gun license (the old “green card.”) Note that suppressors are a no-go in Mass, unless you are an FFL + SOT.

Getting back to OP’s post:

Any semi-auto rifle made after September 13, 1994, can have only limited evil features. For most people, this means a pinned stock, the bayonet lug milled off, and a permanently attached MUZZLE brake.

Said another way - no collapsible stock. No bayo lug. No flash hider, no threaded barrel.

The pinning can be done yourself, or by a number of fairly competent gunsmiths in the area for a nominal fee ($20). The pinning and welding of a proper muzzle device is about another $100.

You need a minimum of an FID card to be in possession of a long gun.

AR Magazines:

Any AR magazines made after September 13, 1994 need to be ten rounds or less.

Any AR magazines made prior to September 13, 1994 are okay …

BUT YOU NEED A MINIMUM OF A CLASS B LICENSE TO CARRY TO OWN THEM.